Aderans

[inspects]

One other important information I found out is:

Dermal Papillae (DP) & Dermal sheath cup cells (DSC) are INTERCHANGEABLE.

Throughout the hair cycle, DP cells turn into DSC cells and vice versa. During growth DSC cells turn into DP cells to provide hair with more growth factors and during resting Phase some DP cells turn into DSC cells.

Now, here's the important bit:
DP cells are used by Aderans
DSC cells are used by Replicel.

So, they are practically the same treatment! We should be rooting for both of them. And regardless of which one comes out first we can jump on it straight away

Nice find Desmond....Very Interesting....!!

I also believe the only real treatment for baldness will be stem cells.

Cheers,

-Dale-

[Desmond84]

One other important information I found out is:

Dermal Papillae (DP) & Dermal sheath cup cells (DSC) are INTERCHANGEABLE.

Throughout the hair cycle, DP cells turn into DSC cells and vice versa. During growth DSC cells turn into DP cells to provide hair with more growth factors and during resting Phase some DP cells turn into DSC cells.

Now, here's the important bit:
DP cells are used by Aderans
DSC cells are used by Replicel.

So, they are practically the same treatment! We should be rooting for both of them. And regardless of which one comes out first we can jump on it straight away

[Desmond84]

Wouldn't the slick bald hair follicles still have androgen-sensitive DP cells, along with the transplanted ones? Why not remove the sensitive ones and then replace them?

Also, what happens to the hair follicles which have had their DP cells removed? I haven't read up on aderans really - are DP cells from donor area taken and them mutliplied, and then transplanted?

Yes, exactly right! So, you will have TWO types of DP cells present in the root of the hair follicle:

1) Original DP cells that are sensitive to DHT --> these are shrinking and refuse to provide the growth factors and signals necessary to promote hair growth.

2) Transplanted DP cells that lack Androgen receptors --> these cells would aggregate to form fully functional DP which support a healthy hair growth cycle!

Here's a little excerpt from one of the publications I found:

"The treatment area would be miniaturized follicles that are cosmetically insignificant, and the strategy would be to rejuvenate miniaturized follicles by the insertion of hair-inductive DP cells. Because the cellular target in androgenetic alopecia is the dermal papilla, providing the follicle with new, androgen-insensitive DP cells might reactivate the follicle to form a normal (terminal) hair. "

This should answer most of your questions about what Aderans & Replicel are all about:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2884703/

This is a MUST read if you're planning on going down these paths once the treatments come out!

[amibald]

OK guys, Prepare to get your minds BLOWN

Now, most of you would have read the stuff I posted a week ago about the reason why Aderans is using Dermal Papillae cells to treat baldness. Here's what I posted if you haven't:





So here's the BIG news:

"Dermal Papillae cells remain the same throughout your whole life. They don't die or replicate. They simply move up and down the hair follicle during Anagen & Catagen Phase."

This is the best news we could have had Why? Well what this means is that the effects of Aderans would be PERMANENT!

Once you have Dermal Papillae from occipital region (donor area) transplanted onto the top of your scalp, there are no longer sufficient Androgen receptors for DHT to damage your follicles; i.e. your hair will remain DHT-resistant for a substantial period of your life!

So, I believe in the future, hair transplant surgeons would simply refuse to perform fue/HST/etc until you have managed to immunise your remaining hair against DHT. Once immunised, they will then perform a high density transplant.

Here's some extra info on DP cells if you guys wanna read futher:

http://jcs.biologists.org/content/124/8/1179.full.pdf

We are so close brothers...I can smell it

Wouldn't the slick bald hair follicles still have androgen-sensitive DP cells, along with the transplanted ones? Why not remove the sensitive ones and then replace them?

Also, what happens to the hair follicles which have had their DP cells removed? I haven't read up on aderans really - are DP cells from donor area taken and them mutliplied, and then transplanted?

[Desmond84]

OK guys, Prepare to get your minds BLOWN

Now, most of you would have read the stuff I posted a week ago about the reason why Aderans is using Dermal Papillae cells to treat baldness. Here's what I posted if you haven't:

Well, around 3 months ago I did a lot of research into what are Dermal papillae cells and dermal sheeth cup cells and why are we using them rather than the other 30 different cells around the hair follicles.

What I came up with was fascinating. here's some of those articles:

1) To date, we have only found Androgen receptors on the dermal papillae of hair follicles. Hence, the reason why Aderans most likely decided to use these cells! Here's the link:

http://www.nature.com/jid/journal/v98/n6s/abs/5612065a.html

2) Dermal papillae cells in balding areas express a much larger number of androgen receptors compared to non-balding areas. Here's a study if you wanna read further:

http://joe.endocrinology-journals.org/content/156/1/59.short

3) Here's the most AMAZING finding back in late 90's: "Dermal papillae extracted from occipital scalp hair follicles (donor area) lack Androgen receptors! Here's the link:

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-2133.1995.tb08706.x/abstract

That's why I think at least in theory, DHT-resistance may be possible!

Cheers

What I can't find out is:

1) How long do Dermal papillae last for before they have to be replaced with new ones?

2) How do Dermal papillae replicate? DO they replicate themselves or does a stem cell create more? If it's the latter, then we need regular injections of Aderans otherwise the stem cells would again produce DHT-sensitive Dermal papillae!

So here's the BIG news:

"Dermal Papillae cells remain the same throughout your whole life. They don't die or replicate. They simply move up and down the hair follicle during Anagen & Catagen Phase."

This is the best news we could have had Why? Well what this means is that the effects of Aderans would be PERMANENT!

Once you have Dermal Papillae from occipital region (donor area) transplanted onto the top of your scalp, there are no longer sufficient Androgen receptors for DHT to damage your follicles; i.e. your hair will remain DHT-resistant for a substantial period of your life!

So, I believe in the future, hair transplant surgeons would simply refuse to perform fue/HST/etc until you have managed to immunise your remaining hair against DHT. Once immunised, they will then perform a high density transplant.

Here's some extra info on DP cells if you guys wanna read futher:

http://jcs.biologists.org/content/124/8/1179.full.pdf

We are so close brothers...I can smell it

[Alf]

Any source for that statement? If it's true the Aderans researchers expect it to be compoundable, that's great news.

I have it from the user Joker " But before I get too negative, I should mention that if this treatment is compoundable (and Doc Washenik says it should be) it could actually lead to some pretty good outcomes, especially when combined with transplants. "
Page 65.

I don't have any first source, but I guess Joker or someone else on the forum has.

[goingquick]

Someone earlier mentiond that Aderans researchers expect that it is compundable, question is how much.

Any source for that statement? If it's true the Aderans researchers expect it to be compoundable, that's great news.

[Alf]

Is there a possibility that the results can be compounded?

The results are average at best, some people get better results with fin or minox at a lower cost

Someone earlier mentiond that Aderans researchers expect that it is compundable, question is how much.

[bigentries]

Is there a possibility that the results can be compounded?

The results are average at best, some people get better results with fin or minox at a lower cost

[Artista]

I have to agree with UK and Neversay' , I was impressed with the overall results shown thus far.

[UK Boy]

A few thoughts,

1. MODERATORS of this forum need to step in and control the discussion so that it stays on topic and refrains from abuse. It is VERY annoying when there is news like this and there is page after page after page of talk which has NOTHING to do with Aderans.

2. My personal view is that Aderans have knocked the socks of Histogen and Repicel. Their trial is huge and their photos show CLEAR re-growth. Something I cant really see in Histogens macro shots.

3. OK, so theyre not creating new follicles but this is a huge step forward. Between DHT, BDGF, TGFbeta1, PGE2, PGD2 and so much more, there is no way we will develop a therapy that fixes the signalling problem that makes us bald. Cell multiplication and bio-engineered hairs are the only real possible 'cure'. Aderans are achieving re-growth that is visible after just one injection. And they seem active in finding out just how many of those cells are working and how many are not. Its a big big plus. They have proven that cells can be multiplied to provide a visible change. How can that not be a huge step towards a cure?4. Are those hairs now DHT resistant? Is that signalling issue now resolved? Essentially those shrinking hairs have inducted these new cells. The next big step is for them to find out how many of the injected cells are actually being inducted and possibly subjecting transformed hair to some kind of "DHT test"?

5. Spencer needs to interview this guy. Id say as a top priority. If he, or a moderator is reading this, please oblige!

People might play down Aderans regrowth but I would pay £20k right now if it was available. Sorry to NW7s and NW6s but there are plenty of people around with plenty of hair left that they can save. Is their a video available of the questions that audience went on to ask him?

I agree about the re-growth, I don't get why people are saying these are poor results, there was definite cosmetic improvement with just one injection, I'm sure if the whole area was injected and with repeat treatments the improvement would be even better. Also the possibility of the treatment preventing any further hairloss is a huge thing for a lot of men. Those with less severe hairloss would basically have a cure, get Aderans treatment and then, safe in the knowledge that you'll not suffer any further hairloss, go and get a high density FUE hair transplant. I would def pay thousands if they could guarantee DHT resistence for all my remaining hair plus some regrowth on top of that.

[Artista]

Singapore is a wonderful place to visit.

[Dazza]

Yeah, looks like we have to get to Singapore in 2015 for Histogen and hopefully by 2017 we can get our follicles immunised against DHT with Aderans!

always wanted to go to singapore..

two in one bonus

[Desmond84]

Yeah, looks like we have to get to Singapore in 2015 for Histogen and hopefully by 2017 we can get our follicles immunised against DHT with Aderans!

[yeahyeahyeah]

Oh man I just can't believe we've gone from early 2014 to early 2017.

I can kind of undrestand why the old timers are so negative

So whats our best bet - histogen?