Final Days: Chinese Scientists Have Solved the DP Culturing Problem! (2014)

[nameless]

You give me their resources, funding and past knowledge... I would LAUGH at the idea of taking 10 years to do put the theory into practice.

Let's not pretend like 10 years is acceptable. That's friggin' pitiful.

They were probably talking about 10 years to get the treatment to market. Which is a point I've been making the past few days.

I think with the focus now on trichogenicity, and with the researchers going at the problem full-tilt-boogie, they will probably solve the problem within 2 years. It may just be a year or even months, but then it will take another 6 - 8 years to get it into the mainstream marketplace. I've said this repeatedly for a few days now.

[nameless]

Hi Guys,

The scientists @ Nanfang Hospital of Southern Medical University in China just published this article. They confirmed that the expression of several genes and proteins associated with hair follicle inductivity of DP cells, such as NCAM, Versican and α-SMA were maintained using this 3D Matrigel Culturing Method.

THREE DIFFERENT TEAMS FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD HAVE MANAGED TO CRACK THIS ISSUE IN THE LAST 3 MONTHS Jahoda/Christiano, Taiwan Uni & Now the Chinese. We are so close Here's the abstract:

Controllable production of transplantable adult human high-passage dermal papilla spheroids using 3D Matrigel culture

We have succeeded in culturing human dermal papilla (DP) cells spheroids and developed a three-dimensional Matrigel (basement membrane matrix) culture technique that can enhance and restores DP cells unique characteristics in vitro.

When 10000 DP cells were cultured on the 96 well plates pre-coated with Matrigel for 5 days, both passage 2 and passage 8 DP cells formed spheroidal microtissues with a diameter of 150-250 μm in an aggregative and proliferative manner. We transferred and re-cultured these DP spheroids onto commercial plates. Cells within DP spheres could disaggregate and migrate out, which was similar to primary DP. Moreover, we examined the expression of several genes and proteins associated with hair follicle inductivity of DP cells, such as NCAM, Versican and α-SMA, and confirmed that their expression level was elevated in the spheres compared with the dissociated DP cells. To examine hair-inducing ability of DP spheres, hair germinal matrix cells and DP spheres were mixed and cultured on Matrigel. Unlike the dissociated DP cells and hair germinal matrix cells co-cultured in two dimensions, hair germinal matrix cells can differentiate into hair-like fibers under the induction of the DP spheres made from the high passage cells (passage 8) in vitro.

We are the first to show that passage 3 human hair germinal matrix cells differentiate into hair-like fiber in the presence of human DP spheroids.

These results suggest that three-dimensional Matrigel culture technique is an ideal culture model for forming DP spheroids and that sphere formation partially models the intact DP, resulting in hair induction, even by high passage DP cells.

http://online.liebertpub.com/doi/abs/10.1089/ten.TEA.2013.0547

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My brothers are getting the article for me Once I read it I'll update you guys

Desmond, the Chinese talks about partial preservation of trichogenicity/induction, not 100% preservation of it. Jahoda already accomplished partial preservation last year so the Chinese have not accomplished a big advance unless they have preserved a lot more trichogenicity than Jahoda did.

[Jonathan]

You give me their resources, funding and past knowledge... I would LAUGH at the idea of taking 10 years to do put the theory into practice.

Let's not pretend like 10 years is acceptable. That's friggin' pitiful.

Whats your theory behind this? Don't you think the researching companies and the investors behind them understand the economic value of being the first company that presents a cure for baldness?

If they really could do it in shorter time if they put more effort into it, then I agree with you that it is pitiful, but I don't think that's the case. Why would they say no to wealth and fame? It doesn't make sense.

Lets put our hope on that they say 10 years instead of 1 year, just to cheat their competitors

[ytterligare]

Lets put our hope on that they say 10 years instead of 1 year, just to cheat their competitors

Who did actually say 10 years? I'd rather wait for an official statemant than believing in random multiples of 2 and 5.

[Jonathan]

Who did actually say 10 years? I'd rather wait for an official statemant than believing in random multiples of 2 and 5.

The 10 years estimate come from this article http://www.upenn.edu/pennnews/curren...inst-hair-loss

[Jonathan]

Have anyone emailed the Chinese researchers and asked for more details regarding their time estimates, clinical trials etc? I don't have enough knowledge to know what to ask them (if you post suggestions on what to ask them here, I will be happy to send the email myself)

[534623]

You give me their resources, funding and past knowledge... I would LAUGH at the idea of taking 10 years to do put the theory into practice.

I totally agree with you. Especially with such a very simple approach ...

They just took existing cells and hair grew.

[Arashi]

The 10 years estimate come from this article http://www.upenn.edu/pennnews/curren...inst-hair-loss

I'm pretty sure that comment is taken out of context by the journalist: "He says the ultimate goal is to be able to make a hair follicle in a lab". People already made hair follicles in the lab ! Like Tsuji lab did. Maybe the researcher said that it will be 10 years before it's on the market. Or, maybe he meant that he wants to make a follice totally derived from iPSC cells (so the DP cells too). That maybe complex (and also unnecessary since they can now culture the cells, so no need to induce them from iPSC, it's just an alternative route). But the way it is stated there, just makes NO sense. Again, follicles have already been made in the lab.

[Arashi]

Hell, they even did it themselves "The cells were able to produce human epidermis and hair follicles, which Xu says were “nearly identical to the epithelial stem cells directly isolated from a hair follicle—biochemically, in gene expression, as well as functionally". So they already made a follicle in the lab. So again, that remark has been taken out of context. I think he's talking about making EVERYTHING out of iPS cells (epethelial + DP cells) AND most probably about the day a therapy based on that can hit the market. That's nice, but there's just no need (from the market, us baldies) if DP cells can be cultured.

[ytterligare]

Yes I thought of the same thing. Most of the article seems plausible, but obviously there is some kind of unwritten law in journalism which says that EVERY article about a future treatment must end with some still-a-long-way-bullshit, even if it's completely inappropriate You could almost call that a rhetorical device by now.

[nameless]

I'm pretty sure that comment is taken out of context by the journalist: "He says the ultimate goal is to be able to make a hair follicle in a lab". People already made hair follicles in the lab ! Like Tsuji lab did. Maybe the researcher said that it will be 10 years before it's on the market. Or, maybe he meant that he wants to make a follice totally derived from iPSC cells (so the DP cells too). That maybe complex (and also unnecessary since they can now culture the cells, so no need to induce them from iPSC, it's just an alternative route). But the way it is stated there, just makes NO sense. Again, follicles have already been made in the lab.

I think they are talking about getting a treatment to market. And as I have asked numerous times lately, what are out options when it comes to avoiding the 10 year delay till it gets to market?

[nameless]

Hell, they even did it themselves "The cells were able to produce human epidermis and hair follicles, which Xu says were “nearly identical to the epithelial stem cells directly isolated from a hair follicle—biochemically, in gene expression, as well as functionally". So they already made a follicle in the lab. So again, that remark has been taken out of context. I think he's talking about making EVERYTHING out of iPS cells (epethelial + DP cells) AND most probably about the day a therapy based on that can hit the market. That's nice, but there's just no need (from the market, us baldies) if DP cells can be cultured.

I saw the complete paper somewhere and I think that the Chinese are talking about partial preservation of inductivity/trichogenicity. If that is the case then Jahoda accomplished that last year so perhaps the Chinese have not advanced the cause.

[sdsurfin]

wrong

actually nobody has made a follicle in a lab. at least not a fully functional, anatomically correct, cosmetically viable one. Not even close. Tsuji made one with mouse dermal papillae and human epithelial cells. The Upenn people made hair-like structures with epithelial cells.

As far as the congress is concerned, if you really read the titles, none of them really hint at moving far beyond what jahoda announced last year. They are all about culturing 3D papillae structures and having SOME induction retained. Jahoda already proved that. Hopefully Aaron gardner, who works for him, will announce that they managed to retain more inductivity using epithelial cells. In any case, it's still years away from making a full follicle, and I am very skeptical that even an implanted follicle will thrive in bald scalp. What makes transplants work is that they are transplanted with a chunk of scalp. I'm pretty sure all skin cells in the scalp have androgen receptors, not just DP cells, and so surrounding cells will influence the fate of the follicle.

The hair follicle isn't too much less complicated than say the human lung, and maybe it is more so, because we're trying to grow them in a part of the body that doesn't want to grow them. I'd say we're about as close to making new follicles from scratch as we are from using a functional human heart from scratch, about 20 years. In ten years they will probably be able to make them, and then add at least ten years for testing and perfection of implantation etc. These things never move fast.

No one has "solved" the problem of hairloss, as people on here have been throwing around. No one knows how the interactions between the native scalp and new hair can be mediated (huge hurdle) or how to make a really cosmetically viable follicle. the only thing they have done this year is prove that DP cells can be cultured without totally losing their genetic markers. bleh. I'm not sure why Xu and the upenn people say that DP cells have to be made from scratch, someone should email that team and tell them to clarify. Couldn't you just culture DP cells?

If hairloss is really to be solved anytime soonish, i think they better route is to try to use DP cells and epithelial cells to try to revive split donor hair, or hair selectivelly pruned from the donor using pilofocus. that way at least you can keep a full donor zone and get more transplants. putting new follicles on balding skin is gonna keep involving new problems. It's like trying to put a new sapling in shitty soil.

[sdsurfin]

mice

Hell, they even did it themselves "The cells were able to produce human epidermis and hair follicles, which Xu says were “nearly identical to the epithelial stem cells directly isolated from a hair follicle—biochemically, in gene expression, as well as functionally". So they already made a follicle in the lab. So again, that remark has been taken out of context. I think he's talking about making EVERYTHING out of iPS cells (epethelial + DP cells) AND most probably about the day a therapy based on that can hit the market. That's nice, but there's just no need (from the market, us baldies) if DP cells can be cultured.

He made follicles using epithelial cells and mouse DP cells. When there are no mice involved i'll be impressed. mice grow hair like it's their job. their cells are better at it than ours. similarly, tsuji used human epithelial cells and mouse DP cells.

[Arashi]

actually nobody has made a follicle in a lab. at least not a fully functional, anatomically correct, cosmetically viable one. Not even close. Tsuji made one with mouse dermal papillae and human epithelial cells. The Upenn people made hair-like structures with epithelial cells.

Nope. You're wrong there mate. Check out their paper: http://www.tsuji-lab.com/en/pdf/Toyo...ncomms1784.pdf


"Furthermore, the human bioengineered hair follicle germ, which was composed of the dissociated bulge region-derived epithelial cells and scalp hair follicle-derived intact DPs of an androgenetic alopecia patient, grew a pigmented hair shaft in the transplantation area within 21 days after intracutaneous transplantation into the back skin of nude mice (Fig. 2b)"

AND

"By analysing the nuclear morphology with Hoechst staining40, we confirmed that the cells in the bioengineered hair follicle were of human origin (Fig. 2b)"

So they took exisiting DP cells from human patients and grew human follicles on mice that way.