Final Days: Chinese Scientists Have Solved the DP Culturing Problem! (2014)

[joely]

I give you a piece of advice. Take fin if you can tolerate it and get off this forum. Look forward to the Shiseido trial with the Replicel-method, stop worrying that much and maybe check things put once per week as I do. If you are really 2young2bald, just try fin with a positive attitude and hope for the best. Just because we do not get any updates, does not mean that nothing happens. Replicel posts a lot of interesting stuff on their Twitter-page.

Pretty much on the money there

[IAmAce]

I'm not too up to date with this but, roughly how long are we looking until we have a long term solution for halting hairloss beyond just fin?

[cichlidfort]

I give you a piece of advice. Take fin if you can tolerate it and get off this forum. Look forward to the Shiseido trial with the Replicel-method, stop worrying that much and maybe check things put once per week as I do. If you are really 2young2bald, just try fin with a positive attitude and hope for the best. Just because we do not get any updates, does not mean that nothing happens. Replicel posts a lot of interesting stuff on their Twitter-page.

What's the Shiseido trial?

[hellouser]

What's the Shiseido trial?

Shiseido bought the rights to sell the Replicel treatment in in Asian countries, however they are going to be running their own Phase II clinical trials alongside Replicel's Phase II clinical trials in Europe.

I wonder though, if Shiseido's clinical trials are a test trial for them to see if the procedure actually works. They spent 30 million on them... that's peanuts for them as they hold billions of dollars. Is it not possible they thought 'Well, heres a small project we could toy with and potentially make a huge return... why not?'

[FearTheLoss]

Shiseido bought the rights to sell the Replicel treatment in in Asian countries, however they are going to be running their own Phase II clinical trials alongside Replicel's Phase II clinical trials in Europe.

I wonder though, if Shiseido's clinical trials are a test trial for them to see if the procedure actually works. They spent 30 million on them... that's peanuts for them as they hold billions of dollars. Is it not possible they thought 'Well, heres a small project we could toy with and potentially make a huge return... why not?'

I'd be they are having Shiseido run a trial of there own so they could release in Asia after phase II.

[hellouser]

I'd be they are having Shiseido run a trial of there own so they could release in Asia after phase II.

Yes, but that's basically saying they know it works.

The other thing I don't understand is this: why culture DP cells and inject them when follicles never die anyway and the DP Cells from existing follicles are there already? Could DSC cells actually be the missing link that Replicel's been working on?

[hgs1989]

I wonder if dp cells or replicel dsc cells when cultured in embryonic like conditions(similar to that histogen applies to fibroblasts: low oxygen and low gravity) would maintain hair inductive properties.histogen says thatt embryonic genes are upregulated using their method. jahoda's is trying to make a follicle,wouldn't embryonic conditions be the ideal way to do it. after all our hair follicles develop in 9 week old embryos. I wonder if they looked at it at some point

[sdsurfin]

I wonder if dp cells or replicel dsc cells when cultured in embryonic like conditions(similar to that histogen applies to fibroblasts: low oxygen and low gravity) would maintain hair inductive properties.histogen says thatt embryonic genes are upregulated using their method. jahoda's is trying to make a follicle,wouldn't embryonic conditions be the ideal way to do it. after all our hair follicles develop in 9 week old embryos. I wonder if they looked at it at some point

I think this is incredibly important, and I'm not sure which researchers are dealing with it. here is a recent article from washenik about recreating human skin with follicles:

http://online.liebertpub.com/doi/abs/10.1089/ten.TEA.2013.0759?url_ver=Z39.88-2003&rfr_id=ori:rid:crossref.org&rfr_dat=cr_pub%3dpubmed&

Interestingly they only were able to grow follicles when neonatal cells were used, but not with adult skin cells. I have said this many times, there is probably no way for adult hair cells to induce hair the way that embryonic cells do it. The answer may lie in programming new DP cells to have the characteristics of neo natal DP cells. With IPS cell technology this should be possible, but they need to figure out what makes neonatal hair cells different from adult hair cells. I hope someone is on that, but you guys on here should ask researchers about this (gardner, Xu, christiano, etc). My hunch is that if the questions are good, they will read them, even if you might not get an answer.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24017993

I recommend that article too (might have to buy it) to get a picture of where we're at. Washenik essentially says that if vellus hair still exists, then cells seem to combine with existing structures (very promising in my view, and essentially what replicel is after). He says if the area is scarred, then its more complicated, but that methods such as Tsuji's may be possible. Essentially it seems like he thinks that a cell based solution to alopecia is coming relatively soon. I would put all my money on the fact that this will be the last generation to not have a cure, which is crazy and pretty upsetting, but unfortunately we live right on the cusp of insane medical progress in general. Hopefully it will benefit us before we are ancient. Even if I can get all my hair back when I'm 50 it will be pretty cool. Washenik also says that the lack of an existing scalp model is holding back experimentation, but hopefully with all the push for skin regeneration they will have that soon too. I think it's very hard for them to know how to proceed without injecting these things into humans, and obviously the results could be terrible.

I really do think that the difference between neonatal and adult cells is incredibly crucial though, and hop that the scientists aren't getting too excited about culturing adult DP cells when it might be in vain.

[sascha]

Yes, but that's basically saying they know it works.

The other thing I don't understand is this: why culture DP cells and inject them when follicles never die anyway and the DP Cells from existing follicles are there already? Could DSC cells actually be the missing link that Replicel's been working on?

The phase 1 trial lasted for 6 month, the data they presented was "6 month-data", in reality the looked at the results again after 12+ months and we do not know about that data. There is no doubt in my mind that they got great results with the treatment and that Replicel will be enough for most NW3, maybe NW4 and below.
Plus, we may do not have to wait until the trial is finished. Could be that they release the treatment after 6,9 or 12 . Who knows. We will have to wait and see as always.