Final Days: Chinese Scientists Have Solved the DP Culturing Problem! (2014)

[sdsurfin]

roadblocks

I'm just waiting for the days where they simplify this stuff and give us more of a specific timeline.

also questions:

1.) Is there any reason to believe this type of thing won't work, is there any doubt left still from the scientists?

2) what would be the next step?

Here are two emails I received from one of the top researchers at Penn. His team was able to make epithelial cells from stem cells this year. I basically asked him the same question:


"Maintaining the folliculogenicity of DP cells may not be as easy as it appears despite several papers in the literature. We are gearing up to make hair follicles composed entirely of human cells from a same person. We all hope the solution to baldness can be sooner. Research funding has been cut in recent years, it would be great if we can get more funding to do some of the research that we would like to do. Thanks"

In response to me saying that he should crowdfund:


"I would love to work with you on this. Could you please let me know your background? You CV would be fine. I will contact our medical school to see whether there is any restriction on these types of effort to raise fund for research and will let you know. I think 4-5 million will make a huge difference in the research. Thanks"


George


Xiaowei Xu, MD, PhD

Associate Professor of Pathology and Dermatology

University of Pennsylvania

[cichlidfort]

10 to 20 years is realistic.

It's not even just about culturing the follicles .. what about implanting them back? Will we get an auto-immune response? Would the new follicles be considered "foreign" by your body regardless of them being cultured by your own follicle to begin with? Are there going to be other implications? Who knows... Everything in science involves tedious testing and especially with something like hair that takes months to grow .. trials can take ages .. especially with refinements being made and restarting the whole process.

I would say 10 years is realistic but 20 is just a SAFE guess. Everyone in my opinion keeps forgetting that advances in science and technological world creates a snowball effect in a sense. Unlocking pieces to puzzle that were unknown before makes it easier to solve more advanced puzzles. Advances are going to be exponential in the future. In 2034 (20 year guess), we aren't going to be discussing hair anymore, we are going to be looking at singularity, complete organ regeneration, etc. Hair follicles are one of the more simple organs in our body. This isn't a 20 year puzzle. If in theory we know how to culture DP cells now, 10 years is all it should take if these scientists are constantly proactive.

And there will not be an autoimmune response since it's our own tissue that we are implanting in ourselves. No chance of rejection, unless it was some other guys hair follicles.

[nameless]

Of course there are still uncertainties but the ones you bring up I dont see as potential problems. Cultured cells have been used in tons of experiments, there are now even people walking around with complete lab made organs, created out of their own cultured cells (like a trachea: http://abcnews.go.com/Health/groundb...ry?id=20650841). Auto immune response has never been an issue, in NONE of those experiments/treatments. Safety of course needs to be examined but again I doubt there will be issue's (if performed by REAL doctors and not some Dr Nigams). Really, if they can culture DP cells, retain gene expression, get them to form spheroids and grow follicles that way, then the rest I would call trivial.

Hey Arishi, I thought you agreed to stop interjecting Nigam into threads that are not about Dr. Nigam????

It looks to me like what you really want is to be allowed to do your Nigam-bashing while disallowing people with a favorable opinion of Nigam to voice their opinions.

On another note, I agree with you that concerns about the cells causing an auto-immune reaction are unfounded. There's just too many people walking around with cultured cells in their bodies for this to be a legitimate concern. Of course that won't stop the FDA from making scientists spend years proving that re-implanted cultured hair cells won't cause immunologicial reactions so I hope you're right that there will be a lot of doctors who will start doing the cellular injections offshore once a breakthrough comes along, but it's hard to take serious a person who lacks enough self control to stop badmouthing Nigam in non-Nigam threads just days after he promises to stop.

Get a grip if you want me to take you seriously.

[nameless]

If the findings prove that they're now able to clone follicles as we desire... what's the excuse for waiting 10-20 years when we already have a working treatment?

How about because it takes numerous years to get any new treatment through clinical trials?

[Number47]

The title of this thread seems more and more ridiculous as the posts come in.

Yipeeeee its solved we are cured ...well its actually probably 10 years away


We all get excited at things that are in a research level cause we look for them and we find them. But there are also so many cures for cancer in a research level, cures for blindness, cures for alzheimer you name it. From time to time there is a breakthrough a step closer and then another step closer and then...usually a wall.


researchers hype these things up for investors so that they get funding and they can keep on researching.

Stop hyping these things up with "big headline" like forum titles, you are not CNN

[sdsurfin]

The title of this thread seems more and more ridiculous as the posts come in.

Yipeeeee its solved we are cured ...well its actually probably 10 years away


We all get excited at things that are in a research level cause we look for them and we find them. But there are also so many cures for cancer in a research level, cures for blindness, cures for alzheimer you name it. From time to time there is a breakthrough a step closer and then another step closer and then...usually a wall.


researchers hype these things up for investors so that they get funding and they can keep on researching.

Stop hyping these things up with "big headline" like forum titles, you are not CNN

completely agreed, there have been positive steps taken towards curing pretty much anything. just look at HIV, there's a new breakthrough every day, but even with all the interest and funding it's still not too close to being cured. A better maintaining treatment for hair loss is undoubtedly also in the works for the next ten years or so, and probably a new follicle will be made in about ten years based on where they are at now, but then you have to add a lot more time for making it a cosmetic cure.

[cichlidfort]

The title of this thread seems more and more ridiculous as the posts come in.

Yipeeeee its solved we are cured ...well its actually probably 10 years away


We all get excited at things that are in a research level cause we look for them and we find them. But there are also so many cures for cancer in a research level, cures for blindness, cures for alzheimer you name it. From time to time there is a breakthrough a step closer and then another step closer and then...usually a wall.


researchers hype these things up for investors so that they get funding and they can keep on researching.

Stop hyping these things up with "big headline" like forum titles, you are not CNN

1.) Research findings/discoveries especially the recent ones just made is something to make a big announcement about. It's news all us hair sufferers have been waiting for.

2.) Are you implying we keep discoveries a secret? The more noise these discoveries make, the faster the process of getting this out to the public becomes. There's a LOT of $$$ to be made here. I really don't know what the point of your post was. It's useless.

[Arashi]

The title of this thread seems more and more ridiculous as the posts come in.

Yipeeeee its solved we are cured ...well its actually probably 10 years away


We all get excited at things that are in a research level cause we look for them and we find them. But there are also so many cures for cancer in a research level, cures for blindness, cures for alzheimer you name it. From time to time there is a breakthrough a step closer and then another step closer and then...usually a wall.


researchers hype these things up for investors so that they get funding and they can keep on researching.

Stop hyping these things up with "big headline" like forum titles, you are not CNN

You got to differentiate between 2 things: a preclinical cure and a cure on the market. The difference is about 8-10 years. When Desmond created this thread he obviously was talking about the pre-clinical level.

[sdsurfin]

yup

You got to differentiate between 2 things: a preclinical cure and a cure on the market. The difference is about 8-10 years. When Desmond created this thread he obviously was talking about the pre-clinical level.

exactly, and we still don't even have a pre-clinical cure. the fact that they can *maybe* restore more inductivity than jahoda did last year is great, but doesn't come close to a pre-clinical cure. I'm not trying to be negative, I just don't want people to be thinking that this is near to being over. any news like this is great, but really the most productive things we can do are try to help these researchers in a practical manner and accept our own hairloss, cause it's here for a while. debating on here how long a cure is going to take is pointless and masturbatory, cause it's going to be a long time. even if they had a solution today, which they don't, trials take a decade. Every year and perhaps every month we will get good news regarding stem cell research on hair, but that won't make the waiting time for a cosmetic cure any shorter. the science is there, but we're at the breaking of the dawn, not the time for celebration of a cure.

[Arashi]

exactly, and we still don't even have a pre-clinical cure. the fact that they can *maybe* restore more inductivity than jahoda did last year is great, but doesn't come close to a pre-clinical cure.

How is that exactly ? If those Chinese can really culture DP cells, while retaining gene expression and can get those disassociated cells to form agglomerates, then we can create HF's from a bunch of cells and that IS a pre-clinical cure.

And again, once the science is out on how to do this, I'll bet the farm that there will be doctors offering this in less regulated countries WAY before official trials in the Western world ended. It's a great and easy opportunity to make a sh*t load of cash for them.

[hellouser]

How is that exactly ? If those Chinese can really culture DP cells, while retaining gene expression and can get those disassociated cells to form agglomerates, then we can create HF's from a bunch of cells and that IS a pre-clinical cure.

And again, once the science is out on how to do this, I'll bet the farm that there will be doctors offering this in less regulated countries WAY before official trials in the Western world ended. It's a great and easy opportunity to make a sh*t load of cash for them.

That's also an insane amount of money GUARANTEED for the next '10-20 years' while the FDA and other health ministries stall and crap all over biotechs ability to progress their trials at an acceptable pace.

We could help fund a clinic and competent doctor do this through crowdfunding itself. It'd be an amazing opportunity for them get a business started FOR FREE and then earn cash after as well!

[nameless]

exactly, and we still don't even have a pre-clinical cure. the fact that they can *maybe* restore more inductivity than jahoda did last year is great.

Where is the proof that any of the presenters have stated that they improved on the degree of inductivity Jahoda announced last year?

[sdsurfin]

How is that exactly ? If those Chinese can really culture DP cells, while retaining gene expression and can get those disassociated cells to form agglomerates, then we can create HF's from a bunch of cells and that IS a pre-clinical cure.

And again, once the science is out on how to do this, I'll bet the farm that there will be doctors offering this in less regulated countries WAY before official trials in the Western world ended. It's a great and easy opportunity to make a sh*t load of cash for them.

Again, dig your optimism, but that statement has a lot of assumptions tied to it. No one has shown that this chinese team can retain FULL gene expression, all the paper says is that improved levels of certain genes have been shown using their method. Also, "creating HFs from a bunch of cells" is more complicated than just getting DP cells to show full expression and inductivity. Even IF they show full expression, that doesnt necessarily mean that they can be used to make a completely functional follicle. Look back at the tsuji threads, they stated that they have a ton of work to do even after knowing how to make engineered follicles. No one knows or has studied how these new follicles will thrive in bald scalp, how to get them to grow in the right ways, etc. We have a theoretical possible way to cure baldness, that is all, and some good advances into the way that follicle cells work. which is why people with money ,like yourself, should be getting other people with money to help fund the efforts of the big teams.

[Arashi]

Look back at the tsuji threads, they stated that they have a ton of work to do even after knowing how to make engineered follicles.

Of course, that was in 2012, when nobody could expand DP cells while getting those cells to from Hair follicles and grow hair ! Jahoda solved that part a year later. And now, another year later, several research groups have been working on improving that method and who knows, those chinese might have cracked it. So yeah, you can say we are damn close.

[nameless]

Of course, that was in 2012, when nobody could expand DP cells while getting those cells to from Hair follicles and grow hair ! Jahoda solved that part a year later. And now, another year later, several research groups have been working on improving that method and who knows, those chinese might have cracked it. So yeah, you can say we are damn close.

What do you mean "who knows, those chinese might have cracked it."? According to you they definitely did crack it.

Will you please get your story-line straight? Either they did or they didn't. And if your posit is that they did will you please post the text that confirms that they did?