Dr Nigams - NSN Donor regeneration!

[gc83uk]

I think Iron Man has summed it up correctly on this occasion regarding Nigam using Gho's old FM technique in the NSN case.

Arashi has also made some good points on why we don't have the NSN before and after donor photos. We need to see these photos asap. The photo around the birthmark is simply not worth the screen it's viewed on.

Until we see these photos then we can't really accept donor regeneration in NSN case. However what I do believe is, even if NSN has only 50% regeneration, he will have absolutely no scarring.

Dr Nigam has also said he does not like to use his invivo technique, he much rather uses the invitro, but because NSN was concerned about the scarring he went with the invivo. Nigam told him there will be no scarring with invivo, correct me if I'm wrong?

However the 15 graft test he did on his staff member is a different story completely. I still don't know what to make of that yet.

[534623]

Yes its unethical, but its not illegal. I don't approve of this for health related concerns. Obviously for food no one will care about as its just food, but to give people false impressions or implied empty promises through their website...

What the hell are you talking here?

What Arashi is telling you is true - or aren't you aware about this story ...

http://www.haarweb.nl/forum/showpost.php?p=324864&postcount=63

What's the "RCC" in Holland - it's, for example, the FDC in the USA.

In India it's the ASCI for such cases.

In simple words, what these "doctors" did with Dr. Gho via the RCC, Indian HT doctors could do exactly the same with Dr. Nigam via the ASCI.

[Arashi]

Your semantics suck. I said the practice (goal and method) is the same.

If your point is that both McDonalds (or pretty much any advertising company for that matter) uses photoshop as well, yeah I agree, but nobody ever doubted that. McDonalds adjusts the lighting a bit and cut out some small imperfections in the bread. Nothing wrong with that. They're using the exact same ingredients as in the product you buy in the restaurant and theoretically you could get a hamburger just like that.

What Dr Nigam did, is he presented 'proof' of his method, which was no proof at all. He conducted fraud by simulating hair growth with photoshop, while in reality growth maybe didn't even occur at all. And yes, that IS illegal in most Western countries.

[hellouser]

Well, you claimed they were the same, so no, not a rhetorical question. I really don't see what you're trying to say with that Mc Donalds video. Styling a hamburger somewhat is TOTALLY different than committing fraud with patient photo's.

Your semantics suck. I said the practice (goal and method) is the same. I never agreed with it for health related issues and made it VERY CLEAR a number of times that I disagree it with it for THIS issue. Obviously for food its a non-issue though there will be people who dislike the practice as well (watch the movie 'Falling Down') but again, its not illegal so as long as you are very careful with wording... VERY careful with wording as anything can be taken out of context and made into a legal case.

[Arashi]

Is this a rhetorical question?

Well, you claimed they were the same, so no, not a rhetorical question. I really don't see what you're trying to say with that Mc Donalds video. Styling a hamburger somewhat is TOTALLY different than committing fraud with patient photo's.

[hellouser]

I just watched your video. You really think that styling a hamburger somewhat is exactly the same as photoshopping hair of you 'patients' as a demonstration of your technique, to lure in customers to come to your clinic to have that procedure performed on them ? You don't think this is something TOTALLY different ?

Is this a rhetorical question?

[Arashi]

Yes its unethical, but its not illegal.

No. I'm sure this is illegal in the Netherlands and in most Western countries for that matter. You're trying to sell customers a product, by demonstrating it worked, while actually it (most probably) did not work at all. That's not just unethical, it's plain fraud and illegal.

[534623]

A good, honest doctor is not going to use 'trickery' like this. I'm sure in any Western country, having photoshopped pictures on your website like this is enough to have your medical license retracted.

Seriously, it really doesn't matter which country - no serious doctor, researcher, scientist on this planet exhibits such a behavior.

[Arashi]

McDonald's goes to great lengths as well to adjust their photographs too before theyre marketed, watch this as it explains everything:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSd0keSj2W8

I just watched your video. You really think that styling a hamburger somewhat is exactly the same as photoshopping hair of you 'patients' as a demonstration of your technique, to lure in customers to come to your clinic to have that procedure performed on them ? You don't think this is something TOTALLY different ?

[hellouser]

A good, honest doctor is not going to use 'trickery' like this. I'm sure in any Western country, having photoshopped pictures on your website like this is enough to have your medical license retracted.

HOWEVER I'm willing to forget all about this, once we see SOLID proof of what he claims he can do. Until now we've seen none.

Yes its unethical, but its not illegal. I don't approve of this for health related concerns. Obviously for food no one will care about as its just food, but to give people false impressions or implied empty promises through their website... I won't stand for that... and I work in marketing, and most of the time I feel like a cheap shill doing all this creative work (though not at the moment as I'm in publishing, next job will be either teaching or for a non-profit, gonna put my skills to help others).

[534623]

The second set looks like bad use of the clone too to give the impression of bokeh (depth of field which makes objects further away more blurred out.... are you listening, IronMan? This is where photography knowledge comes in...

Sure. Have you EVER checked out ...

http://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showthread.php?t=11858

... this fraud?

[Arashi]

Now I know these tactics are really shady for hair loss sufferers, but this 'trickery' exists everywhere.

A good, honest doctor is not going to use 'trickery' like this. I'm sure in any Western country, having photoshopped pictures on your website like this is enough to have your medical license retracted.

HOWEVER I'm willing to forget all about this, once we see SOLID proof of what he claims he can do. Until now we've seen none.

[hellouser]

Sure. He posted these 2 on his website:

http://postimg.org/image/ju8l872sn/

http://postimg.org/image/eo3qhea5x/

If you compare them, the before and after photo are EXACTLY the same, pixel for pixel, except the hair, LOL.

Thank you.

First set has to be photoshopped, however there are two distinct differences; obviously the hair but theres also a very faint mark down the middle of his forehead and a little to the left. You'll only see it if alternating between the before/after photographs when theyre overlaid. Otherwise, the lighting, angle and DOF are exactly the same. That's almost TOO good for consistency... even I as a pro photographer can't accomplish that in two takes separated days apart. Even the eyebrows are exactly the same.

The second set looks like bad use of the clone too to give the impression of bokeh (depth of field which makes objects further away more blurred out.... are you listening, IronMan? This is where photography knowledge comes in, something which you know squat about). However, the image on the right is larger. Scaling it down did show a very very similar result as the one on the left, but not 100%.

Still, this before/after doctoring of photographs isn't any different than say, Kellogg's taking photographs of a bowl of cereal, they use GLUE instead of milk and place the corn flakes very strategically. McDonald's goes to great lengths as well to adjust their photographs too before theyre marketed, watch this as it explains everything:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSd0keSj2W8

Now I know these tactics are unethical and really shady for hair loss sufferers, but this 'trickery' exists everywhere. I just hope this was done innocently with good intentions whilst still having a legitimate solution for hair doubling.

[didi]

arashi

ok , how do you think dr nigam will 'fake' reciopient area, NSN is expecting 1200 or so grafts to grow....

as for donor 1200 extractions will show 1200 white fue dots if theres no regeneration, nsn is dark skinned man, fue dots will stand out...


very hard case to commit fraud UNLESS he bribed NSN

[Arashi]

And is it only me who finds it VERY fishy that Dr Nigam posted pre-op pictures of NSN's scalp, but NOT of the donor area and now has supposedly has mailed these pictures to NSN ? Why not post them immediately after surgery ? With all the photoshopping from the past, this really is not going to make the case any stronger ...