HST / Gho cost - beware!!

[cocacola]

I believe thats a poor recipient yield for 11k grafts

[didi]

ive seen some nice FUE work from Belgium and dr cole where they extract couple of 1000s and thers no visible scarring,

it isn't too much to ask 15 000 hst grafts and lose 3000...its very logical after all
all people would be happy to sacrifice 3k to gain 15k.. (which would fix everyone, even dean saunders would be pleased, that's 3 times what he got now)

some guys lose 6-7k via fue...it would take 30 000 hst grafts to lose that many(and who need 30 000 grafts)

IDK,theory dnt seem to work in practice

[Arashi]

yeah but all this foggy atmosphere starts to piss me off of bit...
looking at the technique and the claims of percentage regenration, we should be able to achieve the triple of what good FUE surgeons best results...

this is frustrating...investing thousands of K's in something uncertain, that's crap, I would then rather wait, the longest possible, until they are a bit more effective... here, all these doubts are a bit of too much regarding what money you are asked to give...

I'm with you on this one Caddarik. Not sure why it's taking so long for HASCI to respond to the questions and why they're even suggesting a max of 3 times. If 80% would really regrow, that would mean that 5 HST's would equal 1 FUE (donor wise), so in that case it would make more sense to advise a max of 5 HST's instead of 3 HST's.

Anyway I'll guess we'll just have to wait for more info ...

[caddarik79]

yeah but all this foggy atmosphere starts to piss me off of bit...
looking at the technique and the claims of percentage regenration, we should be able to achieve the triple of what good FUE surgeons best results...

this is frustrating...investing thousands of K's in something uncertain, that's crap, I would then rather wait, the longest possible, until they are a bit more effective... here, all these doubts are a bit of too much regarding what money you are asked to give...

[FearTheLoss]

but as I understand it, the maximum of 3 is only if you plan to shave to the bone...do you guys intend to do that? and it also depends how many grafts you have in each HST....

We know Dean Saunders got 5k grafts and can still shave to the bone.. so I don't think it is necessarily just 3 HST's...it varies for each person

[Arashi]

Silly, I'm in a period where I think about a second procedure, and now, you can read that they advice to do 3 maximum...

Yup same here. I was planning my 2nd HST already but this 'maximum 3 HST' thing is holding me back.

[caddarik79]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjoHgkzKsXw&feature=endscreen&NR=1

what about that?

If this is achievable by FUE, HST should do 3 times better (if they are true)

Silly, I'm in a period where I think about a second procedure, and now, you can read that they advice to do 3 maximum...

[cocacola]

I cant believe that after a 10000 fue, your donor can be ok. And i dont think hst can achieve 20000 grafts, because by then you at least lost 4000 and that would be visible for sure. Realistically speaking hst potential is probably between 10-15k, but thats only my opinion.

[caddarik79]

it's kind of contradictory with what Gho himself claimed in his last interveiw with Spencer, saying that they had a case with 13.000 grafts, 9 procedures, and only a SLIGHTLY depleted donor...


When you see that Lorenzo did FUE to more than 10.000 grafts and the donor is still OK with hair at 2 or 3 cm, looks weird to me that only after 3 HST, donor will start to be visibly depleted.
If 10.000 is managable by a FUE king, means that we should be able to reach 25.000, 30.000 with HST and with a 6000 gaps in the donor only!!!!

And aestheticly, I would prefer to have hair on top and weak side and back then dense horseshoe and thinning surface or slick bald surface...

+ you could like, "kill" your donor by doing a huge amount of HST, reach a very close to nature density on top, let them grow long or half long, and leave a 3-4 cm lenght on sides and back.... you would have a kind of "horseshoe combover"... not even, and if HM or progress or holy grail show up, you reconstruct your donor, you put harmony back...and voilà...
CONCLUSION, I would always prefer a depleted donor, then a comb-over or slick bald on top, it's more managable, you can be more peaceful until cure shows up, with a strong density on frame and top and a 6000 or even 10.000 loss in the donor (which future might give you back anyway, especially that HST is not invasive or leaving big scar tissue, it would be a HST's repair)

[cocacola]

Ok i see, means that if ur gonna shave slick bald, more than 3 it will start to show a little i guess ( depending on ur density, hair color and skin color i guess).

However we are not limited to around ~5000 total grafts, you can do more but it will progressively become visible in your donor if u shave to 0.

Thank you arashi for being our question center for hasci lol

[Arashi]

I see that Google translate doesn't translate the last sentence correctly. Correct translation is "If clients indicate that they want to regularly shave their hairs completely, we advise to use the donor max 3 times".

They don't say you should stop after 3 HST's. Only that it will start to show in your donor if you do more than 3 HST's, just like after a (single) FUE. I'm not sure if you can draw this conclusion but to me it seems that she's saying that doing 2x2000 FUE would then equal 6x2000 HST's, donor wise. I've asked for a more detailed explanation here but haven't gotten a response just yet. Will let you guys know once I do.

[Arashi]

arashi can you give the direct quote where they mention no more than 3. Also Gc had 3 so far and his donor still looks almost virgin. Hasci are always very careful and conservative with their claims. Im pretty sure u can safely do more than 3, if u assume 80% regen. after 5000 grafts u should have lost like 1000 grafts max, which is no big deal spread out on the whole donor area.

Sure. I asked why Dean Saunders only did 3 procedures. Kristel gave 3 reasons, this was one, and I'll copy and paste her answer:

" De 2e reden is dat de hergroei, zoals iedereen weet, niet 100% is en er dus na multipele behandelingen uit het donorgebied (in zijn geval reeds 3x ruim 1700) als we nog vaker gaan uihalen hetzelfde beeld gaat ontstaan als na FUE. Als cliënten aangeven dat ze toch regelmatig hun haren volledig willen kunnen afscheren, adviseren we maximaal 3x het donorgebied te gebruiken."

[cocacola]

arashi can you give the direct quote where they mention no more than 3. Also Gc had 3 so far and his donor still looks almost virgin. Hasci are always very careful and conservative with their claims. Im pretty sure u can safely do more than 3, if u assume 80% regen. after 5000 grafts u should have lost like 1000 grafts max, which is no big deal spread out on the whole donor area.

[Arashi]

in another words NW5+ and those destined to become high NWs are still screwed

Well, of course you could have more HST's, but according to HASCI, it will start to show in your donor as of the 4th HST. I've seen people do as much 10,000 grafts with traditional FUE/FUT, but their donor looks horrible in my opinion.

Question is of course: after how many HST's will your donor start to look bad ? I don't know. HST isn't the holy grail, that's for sure. But it's still the best we have. Well, hopefully Dr Nigams will prove that statement wrong soon

[didi]

Cost and you still lose hairs in donor. HASCI therefore recommends not more than 3 HST's.

in another words NW5+ and those destined to become high NWs are still screwed