a second HST session in september

[caddarik79]

Choosing for a second HST in these doubting times is a bit torturing.
And I'd like to share my points here.

1) speculations: NO ONE knows for sure what is the regeneration rate.
IM will defend the 85% claims, didi will pretend it's less than 50%, GC and Arashi are in between.
When asking HASCI, they keep on saying it's 80-85% regeneration.
My french speaking correspondant there confirmed me a 11.540 grafts patient who got 9 procedures and also underlined that this was the maximum achieved at THIS time and NOT that it was the limit of the patient.
He said, it's not the maximum achievable, he said, it is the maximum achieved by now.

My opinion is that you can really go nuts by following each speculative threads on this forum and comparing with the confident speeches and replies of HASCI.

Deborah also told me that the high paying patients don't want to be public, they don't give their agreement and she also reminded me or kind of opend my mind on one thing: if we show a gallery of high paying patient with great results, it will gie to much hope for laymen... not everybody can give 50 or 60K for hairs.


2) Bridging!!!
If they have a 80% or 85% regen, bridging seems to be the best move.
They are working on Hair Multiplication, there is a section about it under "science".
If Gho and his staff assure 80-85%, they even use the word hair multiplication for HST.
and if Gho is working on an even better technique, I can only thing that the right move, right now, is to bridge with the actual HST and HSI.

Let say, you do three procedures in the coming 5 years, leaving you an average covered and acceptable head of hairs...and then, they release the big deal, 1 hair= 5hairs... then you are cured, and you did not spend a grumpy balding 30's.

Because, what is the point of waiting the holy grail if it comes in ten years and you are 36 now?
You will for sure less give a shit about a NW 1 when you turn 46.

I also am very cautious about what I'm doing with my donor...
But even if I deplet it a bit with 2 or 3 procedures, it might buy me a 5 years OK situation...in 5 years we are in 2018... Gho my be proposing something better.
And even if it's in ten years... and you did 5 HST or 6...and you have gaps when shaving to the bone... who cares, as soon as something really unlimited comes, you can refill your depleted donor.
The difference is that you will have spent your 30's with hair on top thanks to your bridging HST's.

The problem is the price...it's a real deal but apparently no choice now.

3) Nigam and Mousseigne...
They did not show something better yet, and there are big chances that they will be as much controversed as Gho, because you can always doubt.
But even if they release something, they might reach Gho level or slightly better, but when? and what do you do in the meantime?
And what if they don't do better? and what if Nigam vanishes?


My best case scenario is:

bridging with HST until they release Hair Multiplication in Gho clinic.
what is your plan?

[caddarik79]

I actually came to that reasonning when looking at Gerard Joling journey.

The dude bridged it with FUT in the late 90's.

Then he jumped for HST in 2009-2011 and 2012.
And I think he is OK, maybe even better with one or two more HST.



US, our generation can do


Bridging with HST -----------> until hair multiplication is REAL and OUT.
Even after 6 HST, you will ALWAYS have hairs left in donor for a hair multiplication in the future, especially if they only need smaples.


Because again, what's the point of living your youth with a depressing hairloss that progress and get tons of hairs when we are 50?

Isn't it better to keep on being a "head of hair" man, and improving the density when better tools come out?

[didi]

Dude

wait for dr nigam , he might be real deal


dr nigam claim 100%+ donor and recipient..no loss in donor whatsoever


dr cole is playin a role of mythbuster...
xciting times ahead

[caddarik79]

Dude

wait for dr nigam , he might be real deal


dr nigam claim 100%+ donor and recipient..no loss in donor whatsoever


dr cole is playin a role of mythbuster...
xciting times ahead

It can take a while before we have proofs and feedbacks and insurance that it is well 100% regen.

In th meantime, performing two HST will not kill a pristine good donor, far from it.

My point is, we live now, the present matters...
I am open to Nigam, especially as a Gho patient, that would be interesting to see how greater he is IF he is.

For the moment, I have the impression we have nothing better than Gho, I mean, "for the moment".

I can enjoy a satisfying coverage with my second HST and then monitor the forum quietly and jump for whatever is better to come out.

[ANW]

there is no time to enjoy more than the present no matter what age you are .. time waits for no one

[caddarik79]

yes and GC case is exceptionnal, he did HST with less than 9 months waiting, his donor from his words, was not the best.
And still he might reach 6000 and maybe even more with a slight depletion.
To me it kind of proves legit and even the 80-85% regen...

I mean, you claimed 65% but with no 9 months fully rest in between.

Joling got two FUT before going to Gho, and still got three HST (around 4500 grafts) and his donor looks great.
As IM said, you can not really prove on this forum that their 80-85% regen is a lie, it's only speculation.

And Saunders with poor limited donor got more than 5000 grafts and still able to shave to the bone with no scars of gaps or white dots...
These examples go in the sense of their claims...

We speculate here, they have a patent, a study, and patients.

I am sure Joling could do another two or three and I can only picture that with another 3000 or 4000 grafts, the dude is cured and dense...and 54 years old.

[clarence]

And even if it's in ten years... and you did 5 HST or 6...and you have gaps when shaving to the bone... who cares, as soon as something really unlimited comes, you can refill your depleted donor.

Those of us care who want better density than what implantation techniques will be able to provide, even when the time comes for unlimited donor supply. What is there coming along which is going to get us around the limitations on density?

[ANW]

at the moment im not aware of any technique that allows for implanting high density, but I guess it is a rare problem at the moment since the majority of people I would guess don't have the luxury of this problem.

.. but when this does become a luxury for everyone then I would be surprised if a solution it not found

[caddarik79]

HSInjection will bring the density possiblilities to 0.1mm space between hairs when the HST technique offers 0,2 and 0,3mm space between hairs.

If you can reach 0.1mm density, it's more than enough, if you have unlimited donor + HSInjections, you are cured...

Meanwhile, we have a controversial rate of 80-85% regeneration.
I have no position on this, they keep on reassuring me via email that it is 80-85% regen.
Here we have people with doubts and self made studies, but I repeat, GC did procedure in a shorter time in between, he is an "unusual" patient and still, his results rock!!!

The only issue is the money and the fog around 5k+ >> 10k results.


If in five to ten years, they release Hair Multiplication = unlimited donor supply and they perfect their HSInjections technique, we have a cure, very expensive, but we have a cure.

We can not deny that Joling result is satisying, I don't say "great" but pretty satisfying for a guy who was balding in the 90's.
If he was doing another 2 procedure (1 on densifying HL and the other on densifying crown and mild) he would have awesome result and almost pretty sure his donor would still look kind of OK.

[caddarik79]

at the moment im not aware of any technique that allows for implanting high density, but I guess it is a rare problem at the moment since the majority of people I would guess don't have the luxury of this problem.

.. but when this does become a luxury for everyone then I would be surprised if a solution it not found

For someone who is down the road of being NW5, getting a full head at 50grafts/cm2 is already a big achievement.
I guess, at the time you reach this goal, technology might have improved, and then, you can densify it every two years, deciding to start by reinforcing your HL and then see...

[gc83uk]

Choosing for a second HST in these doubting times is a bit torturing.
And I'd like to share my points here.

1) speculations: NO ONE knows for sure what is the regeneration rate.
IM will defend the 85% claims, didi will pretend it's less than 50%, GC and Arashi are in between.
When asking HASCI, they keep on saying it's 80-85% regeneration.
My french speaking correspondant there confirmed me a 11.540 grafts patient who got 9 procedures and also underlined that this was the maximum achieved at THIS time and NOT that it was the limit of the patient.
He said, it's not the maximum achievable, he said, it is the maximum achieved by now.

My opinion is that you can really go nuts by following each speculative threads on this forum and comparing with the confident speeches and replies of HASCI.

Deborah also told me that the high paying patients don't want to be public, they don't give their agreement and she also reminded me or kind of opend my mind on one thing: if we show a gallery of high paying patient with great results, it will gie to much hope for laymen... not everybody can give 50 or 60K for hairs.


2) Bridging!!!
If they have a 80% or 85% regen, bridging seems to be the best move.
They are working on Hair Multiplication, there is a section about it under "science".
If Gho and his staff assure 80-85%, they even use the word hair multiplication for HST.
and if Gho is working on an even better technique, I can only thing that the right move, right now, is to bridge with the actual HST and HSI.

Let say, you do three procedures in the coming 5 years, leaving you an average covered and acceptable head of hairs...and then, they release the big deal, 1 hair= 5hairs... then you are cured, and you did not spend a grumpy balding 30's.

Because, what is the point of waiting the holy grail if it comes in ten years and you are 36 now?
You will for sure less give a shit about a NW 1 when you turn 46.

I also am very cautious about what I'm doing with my donor...
But even if I deplet it a bit with 2 or 3 procedures, it might buy me a 5 years OK situation...in 5 years we are in 2018... Gho my be proposing something better.
And even if it's in ten years... and you did 5 HST or 6...and you have gaps when shaving to the bone... who cares, as soon as something really unlimited comes, you can refill your depleted donor.
The difference is that you will have spent your 30's with hair on top thanks to your bridging HST's.

The problem is the price...it's a real deal but apparently no choice now.

3) Nigam and Mousseigne...
They did not show something better yet, and there are big chances that they will be as much controversed as Gho, because you can always doubt.
But even if they release something, they might reach Gho level or slightly better, but when? and what do you do in the meantime?
And what if they don't do better? and what if Nigam vanishes?


My best case scenario is:

bridging with HST until they release Hair Multiplication in Gho clinic.
what is your plan?

Good post mate!

I am on a similar way of thinking as you are, even if Dr Nigam is the Messiah, we won't know for at least 6 months to a year.

I would rather do what I can TODAY and NOW with Dr Gho and I can reconsider my options next year. And even if my donor is damaged then if Dr Nigam can do what he say's he can do then he can repair my donor too. SIMPLE.

Until then for me it's Dr Gho.

[ANW]

true of coarse, but implanting greater than 60g/cm2 isn't easy what about attempting 80g/cm2 for those that would like to do shampoo commercials.

there is already 1cm2 of skin, what happens when one adds the extra skin of 80 grafts without removing any of the existing 1cm2 skin ? will there be distortion ?

[caddarik79]

Good post mate!

I am on a similar way of thinking as you are, even if Dr Nigam is the Messiah, we won't know for at least 6 months to a year.

I would rather do what I can TODAY and NOW with Dr Gho and I can reconsider my options next year. And even if my donor is damaged then if Dr Nigam can do what he say's he can do then he can repair my donor too. SIMPLE.

Until then for me it's Dr Gho.

Exactly, that's my point.
I considered my situation with a pristine good donor for a start.
And your situation with your last post-op donor pics which showed a still great donor.

AND I was comparing us (you and me) to Joling.

Joling started in the 90's with FUT and big scar in donor + big loss in donor supply.
We started with HST.
Joling, I'm sorry to tell you, but give him another two procedures, and the guy looks cured.
And his donor seems to allow it.

It means that for us, it can only be even better cause we have a better basis to start with...

OUR scenario will probably be: nice satisfying coverage with HST in our 30's and probably better to come in 5 to 10 years.


Matt Mcconaughey is also an example of smart move with HT, he did a first one in early 2000 and then probably got one or two follow up procedures.
If you have seen MUD, the dude has a fair amount of hair for a 40's years fellow.
He was f*cking balding in late 90's... good strategy, I mentalise him as a "full of hair" actor, not as a balding actor, because he moved at the right time.

Now with his money and in 2013, he might only improve what he has already achieved.

I think, it's the only way... (no bullshit pills or lotion)
5 to ten years is 2018-2023... it can only improve...the MEANWHILE is the most important!!!


And yes, I pray and hope that Nigam will break it, like a real lifechanger, I would not mind flying to India for a full restoration...even twice or three times if it's for a real definitive cured result.

The point is money, but when you have it, you know that it comes and go, I prefer to enjoy a full head of hair with a VW then a Maseratti and NW6.

[caddarik79]

Good post mate!

I am on a similar way of thinking as you are, even if Dr Nigam is the Messiah, we won't know for at least 6 months to a year.

I would rather do what I can TODAY and NOW with Dr Gho and I can reconsider my options next year. And even if my donor is damaged then if Dr Nigam can do what he say's he can do then he can repair my donor too. SIMPLE.

Until then for me it's Dr Gho.

+ the cool thing is while waiting for the Messiah and the proofs in Nigam side, we will enjoy a new improved hair situation... 2014 will then be a cooler year than 2013, 2012, 2011 for us...
And if it comes in 2015, it's still fine...

The thing in your case, after a couple of HST, if you are kind of happy with the result on top...I would temporise, to give my donor the best chances to meet the real deal treatment that should come anyway...

I mean, I will do the same, if I can keep being happy with two HST and a good hair care, and if I can make it last the longer, I will, if I need three, I will go for three, but there will be a time where I will decide to freeze it and wait the real deal...

All this is like a life lesson about enjoying what you get...it's really like a plan, a strategy and the right balance between enjoying the present, reaching a good hair situation, monitor this kind of forum and keep knowledges, communicate with HASCI and stay optimistic and BUSY.

[caddarik79]

http://www.hasci.com/en/science/hair-multiplication/

This is what I'm waiting for, I'd like to meet Gho in person to ask about it and when can we wish it would be released? and also if having HST's now is not a problem...