a second HST session in september

[Arashi]

In a few months we'll know if Dr Nigam's procedure works or not. Also, gc83uk is going to photograph every single graft on his scalp for his next procedure. I think he said he's going back fall this year, right Gaz ? This mean we'll have final proof of Gho's procedure 6-9 months after that. I've also thought about doing it myself, buy a high quality cam, do a smaller procedure, like 600 grafts and photograph EVERYTHING. Cause if regrowth is really 80-85% (which I personally seriously doubt, like you said), then it's just plain stupid to not plan the next procedure ASAP. But if regrowth is only 40% (or even less), then that means that your donor is still very limited and you should choose wisely how to use it (e.g. not double up the temples, like I initially planned to do). So my personal agenda is for the moment to wait and see how Tom's and gc83uk's develops and if for some reason Gaz doesn't want to do another procedure, I'm going to seriously consider doing that smaller procedure and document everything, cause we really need to have this sorted out !!

[caddarik79]

In a few months we'll know if Dr Nigam's procedure works or not. Also, gc83uk is going to photograph every single graft on his scalp for his next procedure. I think he said he's going back fall this year, right Gaz ? This mean we'll have final proof of Gho's procedure 6-9 months after that. I've also thought about doing it myself, buy a high quality cam, do a smaller procedure, like 600 grafts and photograph EVERYTHING. Cause if regrowth is really 80-85% (which I personally seriously doubt, like you said), then it's just plain stupid to not plan the next procedure ASAP. But if regrowth is only 40% (or even less), then that means that your donor is still very limited and you should choose wisely how to use it (e.g. not double up the temples, like I initially planned to do). So my personal agenda is for the moment to wait and see how Tom's and gc83uk's develops and if for some reason Gaz doesn't want to do another procedure, I'm going to seriously consider doing that smaller procedure and document everything, cause we really need to have this sorted out !!

yes I totally understand you, but they answered me several times that they were not in the position of being even allowed to pretend and spread false claims.
The thing is that, we don't know...
But it also dépends on the way you look at it.
GC did procédures with less than 9 months in between, it might have played a role.
Joling got three HST, each time he received more grafts, so it was not even going less and less but more and more, from 1500 to 1620 for his third...
Saunders got three procedure with no white dots at all when shaving at zero...

They keep on saying 80-85% when you send them e-mails, they have a patients who got 9 procédures with a slightly donor depletion Gho's interview... and they reached 11.600 grafts and its not the maximum, it's just where they are now with him.

Deborah told me that if they start showing a gallery of 10k+ results, people, average laymen who can afford one or two procédures will have very high hopes.

I know you think there is something fishi, but GC might reach 6000 grafts with not the best profile...

I'm tortured with the HERE and NOW, because we can have exactly the same scenario with Nigam and Mousseigne, and spend years of doubting about them...

[caddarik79]

also like GC said, numerous HST might deplet a bit the donor at some level, but if the plan of all the coming cutting edge treatments is the "unlimited donor", then it's OK to have three or four HST, enjoy a nice coverage and then, as soon as something better is available, you densify everything and refill the depleted donor.

All this process brings us in 5 years from now anyway, and in 5 years from now, we will be in 2018...cutting edge treatment section at this time will prbably be more exciting then now!!!!

or not....

But then again, don't you wish to enjoy your "youth" time with hairs?

Who cares of getting NW1 at 60... it's time for retirement décisions and going to rest on some Philippines or Hawaii beaches...

Bridging is torturing, but balding for ten years...is even more shit

[534623]

If Gho and his staff assure 80-85%, they even use the word hair multiplication for HST.

You're right. They should use the word "hair reduction" instead of "hair multiplication".

[Arashi]

yes I totally understand you, but they answered me several times that they were not in the position of being even allowed to pretend and spread false claims.
The thing is that, we don't know...
But it also dépends on the way you look at it.
GC did procédures with less than 9 months in between, it might have played a role.
Joling got three HST, each time he received more grafts, so it was not even going less and less but more and more, from 1500 to 1620 for his third...
Saunders got three procedure with no white dots at all when shaving at zero...

They keep on saying 80-85% when you send them e-mails, they have a patients who got 9 procédures with a slightly donor depletion Gho's interview... and they reached 11.600 grafts and its not the maximum, it's just where they are now with him.

Deborah told me that if they start showing a gallery of 10k+ results, people, average laymen who can afford one or two procédures will have very high hopes.

I know you think there is something fishi, but GC might reach 6000 grafts with not the best profile...

I'm tortured with the HERE and NOW, because we can have exactly the same scenario with Nigam and Mousseigne, and spend years of doubting about them...

I don't think we'll need years to doubt Nigams and Mousseigne. We'll know within 6 months if Tom's case was a success. If not, Dr Nigams will probably say "yeah but I have a new method which works a lot better", but personally I will have lost all confidence in Dr Nigam's if Tom's case fails. And if Dr Nigams fails, then what do we have left ? Histogen ? I don't think so. Replicel ? Nah. Aderans ? Highly doubt it. Follica ? Not even started official trials. So basically if Dr Nigam's fails and donor regrowht for gc83uk turns out to be quite bad, then you know you'll have to be extremely conservative with your donor. So in my opinion it's best to wait 9-12 months before making a decision.

[gc83uk]

In a few months we'll know if Dr Nigam's procedure works or not. Also, gc83uk is going to photograph every single graft on his scalp for his next procedure. I think he said he's going back fall this year, right Gaz ? This mean we'll have final proof of Gho's procedure 6-9 months after that. I've also thought about doing it myself, buy a high quality cam, do a smaller procedure, like 600 grafts and photograph EVERYTHING. Cause if regrowth is really 80-85% (which I personally seriously doubt, like you said), then it's just plain stupid to not plan the next procedure ASAP. But if regrowth is only 40% (or even less), then that means that your donor is still very limited and you should choose wisely how to use it (e.g. not double up the temples, like I initially planned to do). So my personal agenda is for the moment to wait and see how Tom's and gc83uk's develops and if for some reason Gaz doesn't want to do another procedure, I'm going to seriously consider doing that smaller procedure and document everything, cause we really need to have this sorted out !!

Yes mate, it's booked for the 10/11th September or something like that. Ironically exactly 2 years from my first HST.

[caddarik79]

I don't think we'll need years to doubt Nigams and Mousseigne. We'll know within 6 months if Tom's case was a success. If not, Dr Nigams will probably say "yeah but I have a new method which works a lot better", but personally I will have lost all confidence in Dr Nigam's if Tom's case fails. And if Dr Nigams fails, then what do we have left ? Histogen ? I don't think so. Replicel ? Nah. Aderans ? Highly doubt it. Follica ? Not even started official trials. So basically if Dr Nigam's fails and donor regrowht for gc83uk turns out to be quite bad, then you know you'll have to be extremely conservative with your donor. So in my opinion it's best to wait 9-12 months before making a decision.

Tom's case will not be easy to check, he is not shaving at all...
I have the impression it will be another year with speculative things...

You're right about the conservative approach, I will for sure use my grafts to guarantee a nice density on top and I keep my expectations of a full hair line temples recovered for when we have real unlimited proved thing!!!

[Arashi]

Yes mate, it's booked for the 10/11th September or something like that. Ironically exactly 2 years from my first HST.

Awesome !! That would mean we'll have a good indication regarding donor regrowth quite soon after that. I mean currently the 2 unknown factors are the failed extractions and recipient regrowth. So maybe I'll wait till the end of year then: we'll know about Tom's case and we'll know about your regrowth (excluding recipient of course), which might be enough for me to schedule my new appointment. I have quite a good shot of my recipient immediately after surgery, so I'm planning to compare that to my 'final' situation, which should give me at least a good indication regarding recipient growth. So combining all that info I think it should be enough to make a good decision on how to proceed by the end of this year.

[gc83uk]

Awesome !! That would mean we'll have a good indication regarding donor regrowth quite soon after that. I mean currently the 2 unknown factors are the failed extraction and recipient regrowth. So maybe I'll wait till the end of year then: we'll know about Tom's case and we'll know about your regrowth (excluding recipient of course), which might be enough for me to schedule my new appointment. I have quite a good shot of my recipient immediately after surgery, so I'm planning to compare that to my 'final' situation, which should give me at least a good indication regarding recipient growth. So combining all that info I think it should be enough to make a good decision on how to proceed by the end of this year.

I don't mind being the guinea pig lol.

Make sure your about on here about 1 week before my HST because I'll be uploading a set of photos and they're going to need vetting so to speak to make sure they are usable, basically I'll need a 2nd opinion to make sure I haven't missed anything.

[Arashi]

I don't mind being the guinea pig lol.

Make sure your about on here about 1 week before my HST because I'll be uploading a set of photos and they're going to need vetting so to speak to make sure they are usable, basically I'll need a 2nd opinion to make sure I haven't missed anything.

Of course mate ! Highly appreciating the effort you're putting into this, to help us baldies out

[caddarik79]

will have mine on the 3 september if nothing bad happens in between :-)

[aim4hair]

I think i'll wait for my next HST till next year. i wanted to have another one, but the thing is, i still wanna use my donor and money wisely, and i can't go for an HST every year, not just because of budget issues but also because i have limited time i can get off from work, and i don't wanna spend every year just going through procedures while i could have traveled and enjoyed my time.

I am pretty satisfied with my first HST, i keep my hair buzzed and i look way better than before since my hairline is intact, of course i would like to add more density, but im not sure where my hairloss is going, and i don't wanna thicken the front and then lose the rest of my hair, which will look way unnatural, that's why i will wait for next year, assess my hairloss situation and hopefully go for a big session to cover any new bald areas and improve density.

[Arashi]

How many grafts are you planning to have Caddarik ? And where are you going to have them placed ?

[caddarik79]

I think the best move would be to densify... and be conservative.
I hope I can get 1800 like last time or even more...

I would give a good 1000 front, 800 on the crown and everything that would be higher, even 100 grafts, I will ask to put on my very hairline to lower it, even from a 1mm

But with Deborah, we said we will decide what we do on the very day, they need to see my scalp, I will be wise...

I want to have a good density in order to enjoy a good two or three years without considering any procedure...and then monitor what's new!!!

When I see GC donor after 3000, i'm confident, my second HST is to buy me some peace time for more than a year... one HST is not enough, you start being happy, but grumpy Under a spotlight or with a sunlight pics of you!!!

Then if in two or three years, they have better options or I see that the 85% is legit and demonstrated, I can still go for a third to improve HL and crown situation...

My point is really to enjoy my 30's, not waste my donor, monitor the cutting edge, put a little bunch of money aside while I'm enjoying the result of two HST and keep it the longest possible.

If I can have my 33, 34 and 35 rather OK, and then when i'm 36 reconsider the situation (we will be then in 2016-2017), it's cool...

Actually, i though that I would go maximum for three if the technique is still controversed, and if not, if 85% demonstrated, I will still be strategic, but less cautious with donor, because 85%, if you have money, is not that far from the cure, or at least, the perfect bridge until the cure comes in!

I really think that the temples, the Norwood 1 or zero, is something you can consider when we have a real unlimited method...
Now, NW2 with a good density for bridging, is OK, I can sleep with that idea.

I know lowering hairline is exciting, but maybe in five years, we will be able to do that blindly and safely... for now, Gho and others are too much controversed, but I don't agree with people claiming and so sure about less then 80-85% regen...
They showed study, they have a patent, Gho did two interviews, the telogen theory makes sense, the example of patients are there...Saunders shaving to the bones after three procédures, GC resurrecting and with pristine donor (he might have lost 600 grafts in the journey), Joling---->> give him two 1500 grafts procédures more and he is OK;

+HSI+ Hair multiplication research

[Arashi]

one HST is not enough, you start being happy, but grumpy Under a spotlight or with a sunlight pics of you!!!

Tell me about it man ... under optimal conditions (in the shades) my new hair looks quite nice but yesterday I saw a picture of me in direct sunlight (on a very sunny day) and man ... it's like the new hair (my temples) wasn't there ! Horrible ... So yeah I definitely do understand your decision. But densifying means that you'll lose donor which you might really need if the rest of your scalp starts to get bold. If regeneration is really 85%, it's not a problem at all, but if it's only 40% (or less), you might run into problems. It's hard to make the 'right' decision, but I think I'll wait a bit for more data (gc83uk's case), to make my decision on how to proceed.