US government owned patent on hair follicle neogensis

[lacazette]

I agree, but you would also agree that when you read the two patents, there's a clear knowledge difference in all the processus details about neogenesis,etc..
They have better technologies, better knowledge, better methods , countless regenerative medecine studies all over the world those last years that lead to better methods, cheaper methods,etc.. We can't really put this and aderans exactly on the same balance in my opinion, exponential science progress is a reality, moreover in regenerative medecine, so we can't compare at 100% the two periods.
I lived the intercytex, aderans,etc..deceptions, 10 years that I am in the sad "in 5 yrs"'s road ^^, but I still think that we can't compared in every aspect the past with the near future
Execpt Aderans ( who don't explain (cause they didn't know at that time) in their patent about which exactly type of cells and their functions in the processus, are involving in neogenesis, growth,etc..with which compositions, with which methods, etc..), execpt aderans (and a bit cotsarelis) I don't remember another company with neogenesis claims and details like that, so that's good to know that US army is in the game

What is make me hope is that they hadn't and won't have any founding problems and their main goal is to find an effective solution for soldiers with a life threatning problem.
So yes the technology for hair loss people will come years after, but that it still a great new to hear that they work exactly on what we need, follicular neogenesis.
And 21st century cure bill that should pass, and Japan's timeline for regenerative medecine, are things to take in consideration now comparing comparing at few years ago

But of course you're right, we still have to stay realistic in term of timeline and hopes. But we will at least know more soon if their methods/composotions are effective with the military trials for burned soldiers. If it work for them, that will be huge huge huge new. yes it will take years before any civil hair loss therapy, but in my opinion IF it works in military trials, I think that the "cure in five years" troll could be the good one this time haha

What is good also is that US army is not the only army who work on regenerative medecine. Russia, china, japan, etc..I'm sure there are interesting things that's going on this domain, and we just don't have infos

as you said fingers crossed, we'll see
sorry for the English, there's weird sentences i know but didn't know how to formulate hehe

[Slam1523]

The statement by Desmond that it would take 10 years for clinical trials just disappoints me. We don't even have developed a cure and even after a developed cure we have to wait 10 years because of trials. If that is true we are looking at 15-20 years. Our only hope is japan.

Renee you didn't read his entire post... Methods of testing have come a long way making it possible to cut clinical trial times down... The fda in America still has ridiculous time lines, but other countries that have reduced regulations will see things speed up because of this... Like others have said we can wait and hope, but patents have been filed again and again... This isn't being pessimistic it's being realistic! Hopefully we see something come in the next couple years!

[hellouser]

The statement by Desmond that it would take 10 years for clinical trials just disappoints me. We don't even have developed a cure and even after a developed cure we have to wait 10 years because of trials. If that is true we are looking at 15-20 years. Our only hope is japan.

Depends; USA & FDA may be going through some (much needed) reform similar to Japan's.

I wouldn't count on USA though, my money is going into the Japanese economy.

[Renee]

The statement by Desmond that it would take 10 years for clinical trials just disappoints me. We don't even have developed a cure and even after a developed cure we have to wait 10 years because of trials. If that is true we are looking at 15-20 years. Our only hope is japan.

[Renee]

Hi Desmond, what happen to the group from Germany, They were suppose to release a website? Any contact with them?

[Banana Republic]

Another point many have forgotten is Replicel was aiming to commercialise their product in 2016 when they began their Phase I trials in 2011. They have now announced 2018 for early release in Japan and 2021 in Western countries.

Damn. No way I could have waited that long. I would have been bald as a cue ball.

[Desmond84]

Guys I think the first thing we need to investigate is what topical they are using. From a medical standpoint, cell-based products can not be applied topically due to their cell wall structure and their shear size. If we could do that, any bacteria or fungi could also have penetrated our skin, as they are cell based organisms and that would have made the sole purpose of our skin tissue obsolete. If this is actually a topical agent they are using than it is definitely unrelated to their "engineering a hair follicle from scratch" project. I think we should simply ring and ask

I also think it is important for all of our new members to know more about the last few years so they can assess researcher's claims with more scrutiny. ADERANS is the perfect example who made very similar claims in their patents. They claimed forming fully functional human hair follicles through their muti-cell-based product they trademarked as JI-GAMI. At the 2010 Hair Congress in France, they released the following timeline for their product:



Please note 2014 was the year of commercialisation. In July 2013, they quietly auctioned off all their lab equipment and sent everybody home. One month later, they announced they are folding on the hair cloning idea as they were unable to gain consistent results and in many cases the regrowth they got was less than Finasteride. It was a sad day indeed.

Their failure to receive consistent results raised a lot of questions as to the reasons why such varied response was observed in different sites of injections. After all, Replicel is still in the game and is also based on a very similar ideaology albeit different cell-lines. Now Aderans, tried to inject patients 2-3 times to try and get the cells to finally find their way to no avail. A strong hypothesis is that the "fire & forget" methodology of injecting a whole bunch of cells into the extracellular matrix and hoping they'll find their way to the hair root is naive and does not work in in vivo models. Replicel's last trial also showed a wide range of results: from 0% to 16% increase in hair count. Replicel is now trying the same thing and Dec 2016 will be the answer we've been waiting for.

Another point many have forgotten is Replicel was aiming to commercialise their product in 2016 when they began their Phase I trials in 2011. They have now announced 2018 for early release in Japan and 2021 in Western countries. Unfortunately, the clinical trial process is so thorough and extensive that any new idea in medicine undergoes so much scrutiny over a decade that significantly slows down any exponential growth in human understanding of biological models . Some even go as far as blaming the "Do No Harm" ideaology for such slow advancements in medicine. Nevertheless, tissue engineering is finally providing researchers with better test models which may one day reduce clinical trials from 10-15 years down to 2 or 3. Until then, we just have to wait and hope for a miracle.

[hellouser]

Point is that 2 weeks ago no body here knew about the wake forest trial or US military involvement in research for hair loss. I'm sure there is other research and trials going on that we don't know about. With the way technology is advancing cure can be here very soon.

If the cure is released, expect a slew of arrogant people saying bald men dont deserve a cure and that cancer is a bigger priority.

....because the BILLIONS of dollars, thousands of researchers and decades of work is NOT ENOUGH evidence of cancer being a priority.

[Renee]

Point is that 2 weeks ago no body here knew about the wake forest trial or US military involvement in research for hair loss. I'm sure there is other research and trials going on that we don't know about. With the way technology is advancing cure can be here very soon.

[Slam1523]

The other guy was arguing that you can patent "mere ideas" when in fact that is untrue.

I can say with relative confidence that wake forest has made a tangible innovation, because they wouldn't go through the patent process if they hadn't.

Now, is the idea scalable? Does it work? Can it be used in consumer applications? How long will it take to get it to market? Does it need FDA approval? How long is the process to take it from patent to FDA to Consumer? Does that process give us enough time to profit from the idea within the confines of our protection? Those are just some of the types of questions that will need to be answered in order for us to find out if regular joes will benefit.

Sorry I wasn't pointing that comment at you specifically, but more or less branching off of it... Let's all cross our fingers there's something to this! Time will tell!

[Gbalding]

I am involved in the process of licensing and patents as well, and I think the bottom line is that a patent does not mean anything with regards to the success of the process or product patented... They are reserving rights in case it works, the know the process, and have patented it in the circumstance that it proves successful... If you think that patenting something is anything more than doing ones due diligence in most cases with the idea it may work, then you're nuts...

The other guy was arguing that you can patent "mere ideas" when in fact that is untrue.

I can say with relative confidence that wake forest has made a tangible innovation, because they wouldn't go through the patent process if they hadn't.

Now, is the idea scalable? Does it work? Can it be used in consumer applications? How long will it take to get it to market? Does it need FDA approval? How long is the process to take it from patent to FDA to Consumer? Does that process give us enough time to profit from the idea within the confines of our protection? Those are just some of the types of questions that will need to be answered in order for us to find out if regular joes will benefit.

[Slam1523]

I agree with you in its fine to hope, I'm just saying hope within reason... Maybe it sounds as if I'm being pessimistic, but to me I haven't found anything to get pumped about, but this is something that is interesting to follow...

[Slam1523]

slam we just have different opinion relax ^^ we'll soon know more if it's working with the military skin graft trial that will go faster.
You think Im too optimistic,but I think you're too pessimistic, so let's just hope for us the reality is in between

neogenesis and development is the most important thing for a quasi perfect solution in future ( something that histogen, CB, Seti,etc won't do). and in this game they are the most promising, for several reasons. I think you can agree ( S and B researchers, jahoda, lauster, are far away from clinical trial) Cotsarelis could make a surprise with follica, but it's unlikely to be the case. So us army trying to help 30% of their injuried soldiers and working on a crucial point that we need for hair loss is really good!

When you say relax do you mean I need to stop writing in all caps? I guess I didn't realize I was worked up?

[lacazette]

slam we just have different opinion relax ^^ we'll soon know more if it's working with the military skin graft trial that will go faster.
You think Im too optimistic,but I think you're too pessimistic, so let's just hope for us the reality is in between

neogenesis and development is the most important thing for a quasi perfect solution in future ( something that histogen, CB, Seti,etc won't do). and in this game they are the most promising, for several reasons. I think you can agree ( S and B researchers, jahoda, lauster, are far away from clinical trial) Cotsarelis could make a surprise with follica, but it's unlikely to be the case. So us army trying to help 30% of their injuried soldiers and working on a crucial point that we need for hair loss is really good!

[Slam1523]

I like your choice of words because if you knew anything about patent law you'd know that you can't patent theories or concepts.

Patents give the inventor the right to exclusively make/sell/licence the physical embodiment of their "invention".

I can spend a lot of dough applying for a patent based on a "concept", but unless I show that it can be physically manifested right away, I won't be granted one.

All this information is available for free at www.ustpo.gov

I am involved in the process of licensing and patents as well, and I think the bottom line is that a patent does not mean anything with regards to the success of the process or product patented... They are reserving rights in case it works, the know the process, and have patented it in the circumstance that it proves successful... If you think that patenting something is anything more than doing ones due diligence in most cases with the idea it may work, then you're nuts...