Final Days: Chinese Scientists Have Solved the DP Culturing Problem! (2014)

[hellouser]

You think just cause aderans invested so much and failed that hair multiplication would go into a lull but unbeknownst to you we got our homies out in taiwan and china + Jadhoada&TeamTokyo (which everyone was aware of)
puttin in that work! We gone see!!!!!

Face it IM these asian guys are killing the game right now, way more intelligent, capable and dedicated compared to most euro/NA researchers

Where you at Kurt Stenn and Ken Washenick!? That's what I though!

Dan26, let's book a flight to Asia with all the Toronto home boys for a cure once available. We all go out for heavy celebration.

[mjolnir]

Guess I picked a good day to check the forum again. The questions now then are when, how much, and how safe. Price doesn't concern me too much - by the time this is available as part of an actual treatment, I should have enough in the bank to cover anything short of six digits (though of course cheaper is always better). Timewise, it would be nice to have a full head of hair by the time I'm thirty, but four years is probably far too soon to expect anything. I expect I'll either start shaving or go for a hair piece well before then. As for safety...that's the tricky one. There are limits to what I'll do for vanity, and while I am on fin, that's about as risky as I'm willing to go. I need well run clinical trials and FDA approval to happen before I allow myself to consider this a real solution.

[Desmond84]

Guys check out the World Hair Congress thread I just posted. There are another 6 teams who have found a way to culture DP cells!!! It's mind boggling

Arashi make sure you sit down before you read the titles...ROFL

[karxxx]

cloning

What happens if you fail in perpetuity China and Taiwan will be finished?

[Dan26]

You think just cause aderans invested so much and failed that hair multiplication would go into a lull but unbeknownst to you we got our homies out in taiwan and china + Jadhoada&TeamTokyo (which everyone was aware of)
puttin in that work! We gone see!!!!!

Face it IM these asian guys are killing the game right now, way more intelligent, capable and dedicated compared to most euro/NA researchers

Where you at Kurt Stenn and Ken Washenick!? That's what I though!

[Conpecia]

This pretty much sums it up. You just didn't understand it at all. Again, Tsuji lab wanted to demonstrate how to grow human hair out of some exisiting cells and they succeeded. Those Chinese wanted to show they could culture DP cells while preserving gene expression (so succeeding where Jahoda failed) ! Totally different objective. To show the DP cells didnt lose their follicle inducing ability (like normally happens when culturing DP cells), they even induced some hair like fibers. But all in a dish !! This is TOTALLY different than growing REAL hair (like Tsuji did) on skin. This doesnt somehow show the Chinese failed (like you make it look) at all. It just showed that the DP cells retained their HF inducing capability after culturing them. Now, again, the next step would be to repeat what Tsuji did but this time using CULTURED dp cells, instead of using existing ones taken from human donors. But if the DP cells really are the same as their original counterpart (and not have lost gene expression), then there's theoretically no reason why that wouldnt work.

IM do you have a counterargument to this or is this why desmond and others are calling this such a breakthrough?

[burtandernie]

Yeah well fast I guess, but its not fast enough because the foreseeable future is still MPB progressing as it does now.

[brocktherock]

Things are taking off at a faster and faster rate as time goes on. I do think that if they have a viable profitable solution then all of these pesky clinical trials will be streamlined much faster. Their are a lot of others that have a ton of research that they are probably keeping to themselves. When competition is introduced to the market place then the consumer wins. Keep hope alive because nobody was expecting tsujis progress nearly this fast. They are trying harder than it seems, I think.

[Thinning87]

I think both IronMan and Arashi are actually saying the same thing on the facts related to the experiments.

The only difference is, IM has this tone like there is some kind of scam, or lie, and these facts are not to be taken as positive news because they have not achieved the ultimate cure.

Arashi, more objectively in my opinion, puts the facts related to the experiments in the right perspective i.e. in their context. The experiments were designed to show partial steps for the achievement of a final cure. If those steps can be put together in a new experiments, we really are basically waiting for it to be done in clinical trials.

I still do not understand if the Taiwanese clinical trials will include a combination of the Tsuji and Chinese experiments, to combine creation of the follicle following Tsuji's method with DP cells that will be able to undergo that growth.

[Arashi]

(or better: they now need to repeat Jahoda's last year's experiment and try it on human skin ! Jahoda grew hair but 78% gene expression was lost and the hair didnt have the right cosmetic features as a result. Theoretically that should now be solved !)

[Arashi]

So the question remains why the scientists from the Tsuji-Lab could, at least, produce 1 normal fully functional hair-bearing follicle and the Chinese scientists just a "hair-like fiber"?

This pretty much sums it up. You just didn't understand it at all. Again, Tsuji lab wanted to demonstrate how to grow human hair out of some exisiting cells and they succeeded. Those Chinese wanted to show they could culture DP cells while preserving gene expression (so succeeding where Jahoda failed) ! Totally different objective. To show the DP cells didnt lose their follicle inducing ability (like normally happens when culturing DP cells), they even induced some hair like fibers. But all in a dish !! This is TOTALLY different than growing REAL hair (like Tsuji did) on skin. This doesnt somehow show the Chinese failed (like you make it look) at all. It just showed that the DP cells retained their HF inducing capability after culturing them. Now, again, the next step would be to repeat what Tsuji did but this time using CULTURED dp cells, instead of using existing ones taken from human donors. But if the DP cells really are the same as their original counterpart (and not have lost gene expression), then there's theoretically no reason why that wouldnt work.

[Arashi]

I am going to use this document as my reference: http://www.tsuji-lab.com/en/pdf/Toyo...ncomms1784.pdf

Fortunately, you are the one understands everything correct ...Pffffft ...

Not sure what you mean but do those hairs to you look like normal mouse hair ? Tsuji did 3 their hair bio engineering experiment for 3 types of hair:
1) Mouse pelage hair
2) Mouse vibrissa hair
3) Human hair.

About that last: "Furthermore, the human bioengineered hair follicle germ, which was composed of the dissociated bulge region-derived epithelial cells and scalp hair follicle-derived intact DPs of an androgenetic alopecia
patient, grew a pigmented hair shaft in the transplantation area within 21 days after intracutaneous transplantation into the back skin of nude mice (Fig. 2b)"

AND

"By analysing the nuclear morphology with Hoechst staining40, we confirmed that the cells in
the bioengineered hair follicle were of human origin (Fig. 2b) "

Really? Scientists from Tsuji's lab? Just existing human cells?
Come on, learn reading ...

It's obviously you who can't read. Again: "Furthermore, the human bioengineered hair follicle germ, which was composed of the dissociated bulge region-derived epithelial cells and scalp hair follicle-derived intact DPs of an androgenetic alopecia patient , grew a pigmented hair shaft in the transplantation area within
21 days after intracutaneous transplantation into the back skin of nude
mice

Please re-read Tsuji's paper you didnt understand 1 single thing it seems. Tsuji combined existing human DP cells + epethelial cells and grew hair that way. That's all there is to it ! Now those Chinese have proven that they can culture DP cells. They need to repeat what Tsuji did now, as the next step.

[534623]

Btw tsuji extracted the dp from the follicle itself, I said otherwise earlier.

Let me look ...

You misunderstood some things Ironman. Tsuji lab wanted to show that it is possible to bio engineer human hair grafts producing human hair. They just took existing cells and hair grew.

So according to your IQ and all my misunderstandings, every lab out there can simply took existing cells - and hair grows. That's nice. Fantastic. I'm really pissed that I never had this simple idea and protocol. Damn ...

Arashi, do you really think that all the other guys on these forum suffer also from ADHD like you?

Personally, I think you should put yourself into the "just reading" mode. Would be more helpful not just for you only - for many others too. Just a good advice ...

[Arashi]

Haha you are funny Ironman. I am not at home right now but will prove everything with source references when I am at home. You totally misunderstood everything like we are used from you

[Arashi]

Btw tsuji extracted the dp from the follicle itself, I said otherwise earlier. But fact remains all that about drivers and stuff Ironman talks about is irrelevant. An exact copy of dp cells should be able to achieve exactly the same as the existing counterpart