Dermarolling Community Trial

[Thinning87]

What is their basis for this?
But if you think about it, the needles from a derma roller might enter obliquely, but as the roller continues, it inevitably has to hit a 90 angle before exiting doesn't it?

I wouldn't be so sure the angle is always 90 degrees. It depends on the shape of the scalp and the precision of the dermaroller. I'll read some more and report here what I find

[PatientlyWaiting]

In fact, I was the first one in this forum to read the whole study. It was I the one who oppened the original thread (theres a link in the fist post of this thread to the thread I oppened before) like a week after it was originally published on *** where nobody gave a damn.

Fine then. I do think this work, I just think that the study is completely fake (well, at least their results are bollocks). But it's OK. I will shut my mouth for a couple of weeks more. We'll see at the three months mark what happen.

What do you think they are selling? They mention "minoxidil" and micro-needling. I haven't read the study in a while but from what I remember, they didn't mention any brands. So what exactly are they trying to sell if this is fake?

You have to be more specific if you are going to accuse the study of being fake. Why are they faking it? What do they gain from this?

Edit: Okay I just read the study again. There's a "Microneedling group" and a "Minoxidil group". There is no mention of any brand at all.

[greatjob!]

I was reading other forums and people express doubts based on the angle th dermaroller makes contact with the skin.

Apparently oblique vs perpendicular makes a big difference, the latter being better, and they say the dermaroller doesn't guarantee that 90 degree angle

If you are concerned about that you could always just use a derma stamp

[bigentries]

What do you think they are selling? They mention "minoxidil" and micro-needling. I haven't read the study in a while but from what I remember, they didn't mention any brands. So what exactly are they trying to sell if this is fake?

You have to be more specific if you are going to accuse the study of being fake. Why are they faking it? What do they gain from this?

Edit: Okay I just read the study again. There's a "Microneedling group" and a "Minoxidil group". There is no mention of any brand at all.

Someone that contacted them said they told him they offer the procedure at their clinic, that's a big conflict of interest

[Stocione]

Someone that contacted them said they told him they offer the procedure at their clinic, that's a big conflict of interest

It's a conflict of interest to offer a procedure that they know works? Actually I just think that's how science and treatments work... you prove the concept and then you offer it as a service.

[bigentries]

It's a conflict of interest to offer a procedure that they know works? Actually I just think that's how science and treatments work... you prove the concept and then you offer it as a service.

And where are the other studies claiming that dermarolling alongside minox works? As far as I know this is the first one

We haven't even found out here if it works or not

Companies paying for biased studies just to sell something is rampant in the supplement industry, I don't see how this could be any different

[Stocione]

Because this is published in a reputable journal. The supplement studies are almost never accepted for publication. What's more, we've posted ad nauseum the research that supports the theory behind wounding + minoxidil.

Additionally, not all the researchers offer this service. The one I spoke to, for example, doesn't have his own practice and is a research doc for the hospital. Only the lead researcher does, to my knowledge.

[bigentries]

Because this is published in a reputable journal. The supplement studies are almost never accepted for publication.

So what? As far as I know it wasn't peer reviewed. And publication is not enough, the FDA authorizes laser therapy for hair loss and we know it just doesn't work

What's more, we've posted ad nauseum the research that supports the theory behind wounding + minoxidil.

The theory behind wounding is strong, but again, we are not talking about the same stuff.
People have been using dermarolling with minox for years and until someone decided that 1.5mm was the right size then it suddenly started to be touted as the cure

Additionally, not all the researchers offer this service. The one I spoke to, for example, doesn't have his own practice and is a research doc for the hospital. Only the lead researcher does, to my knowledge.

Still bias exists

[Stocione]

So what? As far as I know it wasn't peer reviewed. And publication is not enough, the FDA authorizes laser therapy for hair loss and we know it just doesn't work


The theory behind wounding is strong, but again, we are not talking about the same stuff.
People have been using dermarolling with minox for years and until someone decided that 1.5mm was the right size then it suddenly started to be touted as the cure


Still bias exists

.... the journal of trichology is the OFFICIAL PEER REVIEWED journal for hair research in India.

1.5mm isn't some random size. It relates to the depth necessary for disrupting the epidermis.

You are right, every study related to hair loss (and most medical fields) is biased. People run studies because they think it will work. That creates an inherent bias.

Hair lasers are not approved by the FDA for the treatment of hair loss and no studies are published supporting their use in peer reviewed journals (that I've seen). There are some bullshit publications, but they aren't in real journals. Hair lasers were approved as safe for use, not as efficacious for the treatment of alopecia. Devices have a separate approval process from drugs.

[MackJames]

I'm on week 5. I'm going to take a picture tonight. The problem for me is that I shaved my hair down to the scalp a week ago because of my psoriasis. I also had been rolling only hard enough to cause redness with minimal blood.

This week I rolled considerable harder. I'm going to let my hair grow out a little and keep it at the same length for the full 12 weeks.

Should I continue to consider this week 5 or week 1?

[Stocione]

I'm on week 5. I'm going to take a picture tonight. The problem for me is that I shaved my hair down to the scalp a week ago because of my psoriasis. I also had been rolling only hard enough to cause redness with minimal blood.

This week I rolled considerable harder. I'm going to let my hair grow out a little and keep it at the same length for the full 12 weeks.

Should I continue to consider this week 5 or week 1?

Don't consider it week 1 or week 5. Just keep rolling every week for the next five months to judge accurately. None of us know enough about how hard you need to roll to actually see results.

[DesperateOne]

Don't consider it week 1 or week 5. Just keep rolling every week for the next five months to judge accurately. None of us know enough about how hard you need to roll to actually see results.

That's true, after finding that the initial study was not as accurate and the fact that we found follicla's patents, none of only the entire picture. So just roll to a couple of months and then report you findings.

[clandestine]

Can I wash my scalp with something afterwards to get the blood off?

Is the saline solution only to be used before, or can I use this? What about lukewarm water?

[LevonHelms]

I've quit smoking for this; I'm two weeks out. So as not to affect collagen levels and such.

Not easy, but damn if hair loss isn't motivation to quit, I don't know what is.
Second roller session tomorrow, using the 1.5mm.

Congrats man, that's no small feat. I've quit too, using an e-cig. Still count it as a victory though.

[MackJames]

Can I wash my scalp with something afterwards to get the blood off?

Is the saline solution only to be used before, or can I use this? What about lukewarm water?

I have a buzz cur and I use alcohol pads to wipe the blood away.