Dr Cole-Dr Nigam to meet up!!

[KO1]

But arguing this is fun. Fin haters cry about the drug, I post evidence showing they're wrong. They cry more, and so it goes...

[Breaking Bald]

What potential damage though? You're speculating that this drug might cause some damage, but you cannot identify what that damage is, how it may happen, or to how many people. You cannot prove that rate is large, that the side effects will be persistent. But you just continue insisting upon vague notions of "something really really bad might happen"....yeah despite the fact that men have been taking this for twenty years.

Lol, exactly my point. In no way is playing with a males hormones sensible, we do not know the potential dangers, so why risk it? You keep arguing your point, what evidence do you have? Merck's outdated, questionable trials? No thanks.

[KO1]

What potential damage though? You're speculating that this drug might cause some damage, but you cannot identify what that damage is, how it may happen, or to how many people. You cannot prove that rate is large, that the side effects will be persistent. But you just continue insisting upon vague notions of "something really really bad might happen"....yeah despite the fact that men have been taking this for twenty years.

Arashi is not warning about potential sides, he actively discourages people from taking the drug, and then drapes himself under the flag of "just giving info". I'm pretty open to the chance of side effects, but the fin haters take to the extreme.

[Breaking Bald]

and the debate continues...

So I may as well weigh in, yes it is outdated. Do you really trust Merck and their studies? We know so little about the operation of the brain and the importance of DHT as a male hormone that I just don't think it worth the risk. People may be damaging themselves in ways we do not even understand yet. Everybody on this forum has the right to warn others about the potential damage that this drug can cause.

[KO1]

I am taking the drug, and so should men who are worried about losing their hair. You don't take fin, I believe you have never taken fin before, and yet you comment. Why is that?

The problem is for you that you have little or no evidence backing up your claims that this drug causes sides in anything but a small number of people, and usually those dissipate upon cessation of treatment. Hence you keep arguing, posting your opinion as fact, and just generally posting drivel. You have pretty much no basis for your claims. You don't take fin, then fine, stop posting about it.

[Arashi]

So is it 1.1% or 18.5%? You may not realize it, but there's a big difference. LMAO.

This data you cite doesnt tell you what the population taking the drug was. Was the population those that suffer sides? Was it the total population taking the drug? Was it a double blind trial? Single blind? No blind? Random reporting? Nothing, just terrible citation.

If you feel 0.1% chance of PFS is bad, then don't take it, just don't discourage others from taking the drug.

We have a great drug for stopping and slowing down hair loss, but...I'm terrified of a 5% chance of reducing my libido! Even though the side effects will likely dissipate after stopping the drug! EBIL EBIL MERCK!

If you feel the importance of keeping your hair outweighs the risks of (persisting) side effects, you should take the drug, the others shouldn't. Simple as that

[KO1]

Genitourinary side effects have included impotence (1.1% to 18.5%)

So is it 1.1% or 18.5%? You may not realize it, but there's a big difference. LMAO.

This data you cite doesnt tell you what the population taking the drug was. Was the population those that suffer sides? Was it the total population taking the drug? Was it a double blind trial? Single blind? No blind? Random reporting? Nothing, just terrible citation.

If you feel 0.1% chance of PFS is bad, then don't take it, just don't discourage others from taking the drug.

We have a great drug for stopping and slowing down hair loss, but...I'm terrified of a 5% chance of reducing my libido! Even though the side effects will likely dissipate after stopping the drug! EBIL EBIL MERCK!

[Arashi]

But even if risk of the Post Fin Syndrome (http://www.pfsfoundation.org/) were only 0.1%, I personally feel it's not worth the risk. But then again I'm maybe one of the lucky ones, balding at slow speed. I would never risk my life (and taking away my dick is taking away my life) to keep my hair. But to each their own.

[Arashi]

Genitourinary side effects have included impotence (1.1% to 18.5%), abnormal ejaculation (7.2%), decreased ejaculatory volume (0.9% to 2.8%), abnormal sexual function (2.5%), gynecomastia (2.2%), erectile dysfunction (1.3%), ejaculation disorder (1.2%), and testicular pain
Nervous system side effects including decreased libido (1.6% to 10.0%), dizziness (7.4%), and somnolence (1.7%) have been reported.
Cardiovascular side effects including postural hypotension (9.1%) and hypotension (1.2%) have been reported.

http://www.drugs.com/sfx/propecia-side-effects.html

[Zao]

Well discuss it somewhere else! Not in the Cutting Edge/Future Treatments section, seeing as it is an outdated, potentially unsafe treatment!

Outdated treatment? It's the most effective hair loss treatment ever invented and works to some level for most men who take it with little or no side effects. Merck invented the first anti- baldness pill that actually works and yes there is a very slim chance of side effects, just like any other drug on the market, but when I read people saying stupid things like "Merck is just capitalizing on the insecurities of balding men" I have to laugh! Do you have any idea how many balding men have had great success with this drug? Millions, me included.

[KO1]

That's why it's not a safe drug. Nobody should get onto a drug and experience irreversible sides (of this nature) to begin with.

Merck are just capitalising on the insecurities of balding men. That's it.

As has been stated multiple times, this thread is not for the discussion of finasteride, yet you continue bothering me with your stupidity. I find it great that Merck is capitalizing on the insecurity of bald men, I wish more drug companies did that, unfortunately, thanks to the fin hating brigade, drug companies will think twice about releasing MPB treatments.

It has nothing to do with "fin worked for me", and I do not get side effects from it, btw, I take 2 dutasteride pills a day - no sides. This dose is far more potent than 1mg fin, which in theory should give me sub-castrate levels of DHT. No ED, no lack of libido, no brain fog, no male breasts, energy levels are great, in fact, I'm lifting more than ever before. (fin and dut raise testosterone levels).

Finasteride is a safe drug because very few people get side effects, subsequently, the chance of getting them is LOW. Get that through your thick skull. Only a miniscule portion of people get these "irreversible effects". If you are uncomfortable with taking the drug, that is your right, but don't give us your verbal diarrhea, or spread stupidity or misinformation about its safety profile, or worse, discourage people from the drug.


As for breasts, again, very few get them, but hey....who needs facts when you can have shock value?

[clandestine]

I got serious side effects from taking Saw Palmetto, after the doctor told me there were NO known side effects. It completely killed my libido, entirely, plus other serious effects (seriously no joke, I have a thread detailing the effects of it, I still can't believe it). I am, still to this day, paranoid that I have not, and will not fully recover, especially when I have penis problems. This stress outweighs the stress of balding.

I think for many people who value their virility, 5% (if it really is that low) is simply too high of a risk, so to us it IS russian roulette, therefore, not a solution.

Strong agree.

I'm sorry this has happened to you.

[clandestine]

Then you may be just fine.

Feel free to experiment with things like RU or CB or w/e.

But if you're a guy who has significant loss ahead of him, I don't think you can be picky about sides, and I find it amusing when people complain about "watery semen". Really buddy?

What about male breasts?

[Alclops]

Then you may be just fine.

Feel free to experiment with things like RU or CB or w/e.

But if you're a guy who has significant loss ahead of him, I don't think you can be picky about sides, and I find it amusing when people complain about "watery semen". Really buddy?

I got serious side effects from taking Saw Palmetto, after the doctor told me there were NO known side effects. It completely killed my libido, entirely, plus other serious effects (seriously no joke, I have a thread detailing the effects of it, I still can't believe it). I am, still to this day, paranoid that I have not, and will not fully recover, especially when I have penis problems. This stress outweighs the stress of balding.

I think for many people who value their virility, 5% (if it really is that low) is simply too high of a risk, so to us it IS russian roulette, therefore, not a solution.

[yeahyeahyeah]

That's why it's not a safe drug. Nobody should get onto a drug and experience irreversible sides (of this nature) to begin with.

Merck are just capitalising on the insecurities of balding men. That's it.

KO1 I suspect that you are getting sides but ignoring them due to thinking that they are minor.