Aderans

[Desmond84]

ah, yeah, right. In the past, Dr. Hoffmann has always very impressed about the Intercytex guys. Here is the reason in chronological order ...
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2nd March 2001

http://www.intercytex.com/icx/news/releases/pr2001/2001-03-02/

Hair loss affects approximately forty percent of men and twenty percent of women aged fifty and over. In the US alone, an estimated 40 million men and 20 million women suffer from baldness and spend $1.5 billion annually on hair loss therapies. Addressing this market, Intercytex is pioneering novel methods for the transplant of dermal hair follicle cells. This technology could be used as a means of regenerating hair, overcoming the need to remove whole hairs from one part of the body and subsequent transplant to another. It also opens the potential for large numbers of hair-generating cells to be expanded in tissue culture and packaged as a one-step solution to hair-loss.
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6th May 2004
Based on emerging positive results from its Phase I study, Intercytex also announced it is planning to initiate Phase II US and UK multi-centre clinical trials of TrichoCyte later this year.
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6th October 2006

http://www.intercytex.com/icx/news/releases/2006/2006-10-06/

Intercytex awarded £1.85m grant from the DTI to automate production of innovative hair regeneration therapy
The grant will be used primarily to develop a dedicated robotic system to support the commercial-scale production of dermal papilla (DP) cells, the main cells involved in hair regeneration and the key component of ICX-TRC. ICX-TRC, a hair regeneration product which has recently entered Phase II clinical trials.
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25th September 2007

http://www.intercytex.com/icx/news/releases/2007/2007-09-25/

Hair regeneration – first 12 patients treated in Phase II trial of ICX-TRC
Post period-end highlights
Preliminary data from Phase II trial of ICX-TRC for hair regeneration shows increased hair counts and good safety profile
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18th December 2007

http://www.intercytex.com/icx/news/releases/2007/2007-12-18/

In September this year we announced the first results from the current Phase II trial. In the sub-group of subjects (5 in total) whose scalp was pre-stimulated at the time of injection all subjects showed substantial and visible increased hair counts at 6 and/or 12 weeks (13-105&#37. We believe this increased hair production is attributable to the interaction between the injected DP cells and the stimulated resident hair producing cells.
A further 5 subjects have now been treated with ICX-TRC using the pre-stimulation technique with 2 more expected in January. By the end of March 2008 we expect to announce preliminary 12 week data on up to 16 subjects in total and preliminary 24 week data on up to 10 subjects.
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18th September 2008

http://www.intercytex.com/icx/news/releases/2008/2008-09-18/

Intercytex Group plc – Interim results for the six months ended 30 June 2008
ICX-TRC - hair regeneration
Data from the Phase II trial shows increase in hair count in 11 out of 14 (79%) evaluable subjects at 24 weeks
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26th January 2009

http://www.intercytex.com/icx/news/releases/2009/2009-01-26a/

Intercytex implements restructuring actions to reduce cash burn
Completion of the Phase II trial of ICX-TRC for hair regeneration continues to be expected at the end of this quarter
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26th March 2009

http://www.intercytex.com/icx/news/releases/2009/2009-03-26/

ICX-TRC, a hair regeneration product. Phase II trial completed
· Positive data from Phase II trial announced today - increase in hair count in the majority of evaluable subjects observed at 48 weeks.
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The big OOOPS...
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October 16 2009

http://www.baldingblog.com/2009/10/16/did-intercytex-fail/

Did Intercytex Fail?
"What happened was that the positive results of clinical trials were not as efficient as the lab ones. In other words although promising and exciting, not quite good enough to justify applying for a therapeutic product for the public."
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Anyway, so what can we learn from these "confident and exciting trial results" reports?

Anyway, Aderans bought "OOOPS" a few years ago - and they are still in the "OOOPS phase" ... ... even with the usage of BOTH cell types, epithelial and mesenchymal ("inducer and responder cells") - from the DHT resistent donor area.

Wow! Reading this really made me depressed! Is ADERANS really going down the drain like Intercytex!?

Why is MPB so complicated!

[Desmond84]

Boldy are you serious!!!!

Aderans gave up on the DP idea! when did they announce that? What's going on all of a sudden!!!!!!!

I just read Dr Nigam claiming the same thing!!!!!!!!!!!

[Boldy]

Boldy are you serious!!!!

Aderans gave up on the DP idea! when did they announce that? What's going on all of a sudden!!!!!!!

I just read Dr Nigam claiming the same thing!!!!!!!!!!!

yes I just found out after science @ hairloss help posted the youtube video...

Its not that bad, I mean if you have allot of money and patience, Aderans could give you a head with hair with their current strategy, but Im not supprised if it took xx amount sessions + years to get there. and then is still the question will these hairs last for ever? I must read or find literature of what they are currently doing.


they seem to isolate the cells around the dermal sheeth, culture them for 2 weeks (what I understand from the video), and then inject them back into the client. this process is less complicated then DP culture, but less efficient..


I guess we have to find our own lab if we want DP culture within 1-2 years.

anything is possible that is fore sure, but it would take knowledge and efforts.


I

[StinkySmurf]

yes I just found out after science @ hairloss help posted the youtube video...

Its not that bad, I mean if you have allot of money and patience, Aderans could give you a head with hair with their current strategy, but Im not supprised if it took xx amount sessions + years to get there. and then is still the question will these hairs last for ever? I must read or find literature of what they are currently doing.


they seem to isolate the cells around the dermal sheeth, culture them for 2 weeks (what I understand from the video), and then inject them back into the client. this process is less complicated then DP culture, but less efficient..


I guess we have to find our own lab if we want DP culture within 1-2 years.

anything is possible that is fore sure, but it would take knowledge and efforts.


I

I can't seem to find that post by Science. Do you mind sharing that link?

Thanks!

[534623]

they seem to isolate the cells around the dermal sheeth, culture them for 2 weeks (what I understand from the video), and then inject them back into the client. this process is less complicated then DP culture, but less efficient..

hi DP paranoia,
can you tell me please, in which literature did you find out, that culturing of hair follicle (stem)cells (=MULTIPLYING them) is "less complicated" then DP culture?

I mean, I know lots of papers which tell the contrary and these papers even explain about the problems involved - contrary to your beloved (but useless) DP culturing.

Oh, and what part of the Intercytex results don't you understand? Guess what they did, and which cells they multiplied and injected thereafter - and how "efficient" doing this has been.

[StinkySmurf]

hi DP paranoia,
can you tell me please, in which literature did you find out, that culturing of hair follicle (stem)cells (=MULTIPLYING them) is "less complicated" then DP culture?

I mean, I know lots of papers which tell the contrary and these papers even explain about the problems involved - contrary to your beloved (but useless) DP culturing.

Oh, and what part of the Intercytex results don't you understand? Guess what they did, and which cells they multiplied and injected thereafter - and how "efficient" doing this has been.

I know you've said this before, but I'm not a science guy so maybe I just don't get it. Can you explain in some very simple way why you think Ji Gami doesn't work? Is it because you don't think they solved the shedding problem or is there more to it?

Thanks!

[Boldy]

I know you've said this before, but I'm not a science guy so maybe I just don't get it. Can you explain in some very simple way why you think Ji Gami doesn't work? Is it because you don't think they solved the shedding problem or is there more to it?

Thanks!

hey man, read my post on past page, I have not said that it would not work:

Its not that bad, I mean if you have allot of money and patience, Aderans could give you a head with hair with their current strategy, but I'm not surprised if it took xx amount sessions + years to get there. and then is still the question will these hairs last for ever? I must read or find literature of what they are currently doing.

because the old good aga DP cells will be reactivated again with this new aderans approach. questions will rise will the miniaturize again by dht?

secondly you saw on the video some results are good, but not a full head of hare not a cure after 1 session, like the quote says, it will probably require multiple sessions to (maybe ) reach the desired results (full thicks NW0 for example). and than still it will leave us with the first question howling will these hairs no one knows that yet.


Its a good start, but not what I hoped for. healthy dermal papilla's that are not affected by DHT thats the perfect cure.

thats my opinion.

[StinkySmurf]

hey man, read my post on past page, I have not said that it would not work:

Hey Boldy,

No, I'm actually asking 534623 why he thinks it won't work. He has obviously read this stuff so I kinda just want to hear what his reason is for thinking it doesn't work.

Thanks!

[534623]

No, I'm actually asking 534623 why he thinks it won't work.

I thought I've already explained this issue in this thread here?

http://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showpost.php?p=99905&postcount=887

The scientific quote in my post (I couldn't edit the post anymore) is from this paper (last paragraph):

http://www.nature.com/jid/journal/v121/n6/full/5602054a.html

By the way - why don't you guys give me a simple ANSWER?

http://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showpost.php?p=101226&postcount=898

Now I'm asking the 4th time: what exactly is Dr. Washenik saying in this video concerning this problem, or in other words:
why did they cast away their initial idea of creating thousands of brand new follicles from scratch?
Is it really so difficult to watch the video and to report here what exactly he is saying concerning this issue? I even described with a pic where in the video you can easily find this point. I mean, WHAT FOR is this thread? Discussing WHEN they will sell you "the cure"?

[StinkySmurf]

Now I'm asking the 4th time: what exactly is Dr. Washenik saying in this video concerning this problem, or in other words:
why did they cast away their initial idea of creating thousands of brand new follicles from scratch?
Is it really so difficult to watch the video and to report here what exactly he is saying concerning this issue? I even described with a pic where in the video you can easily find this point. I mean, WHAT FOR is this thread? Discussing WHEN they will sell you "the cure"?

Yes, I could see that you have a point. I just wasn't sure where in the video you were talking about, and I got really busy, but I know exactly the part you're talking about now. I thought those pictures looked familiar

Yes, I thought this part was crucial. My interpretation is that they put neogenesis aside because they felt like it was much more difficult due to the aesthetic issues, and so instead they went for rejuvenating follicles. Thats why he says this will only work on people with miniaturized follicles like with male and female pattern baldness right after that, but I guess my question for you is why do you think it doesn't work just because it's not neogenesis?

[534623]

My interpretation is that they put neogenesis aside because they felt like it was much more difficult due to the aesthetic issues, and so instead they went for rejuvenating follicles.

Right - he is basically talking about TWO different approaches:

- follicles neogenesis (implants of "hair seeds" to produce brand new hair follicles from scratch);

- injections of different cell types (similar approach) to "rejuvenate" existing hair structures in the (balding) scalp.

Before I explain the "rejuvenation thingy" problems again, could you please explain more specific the neogenesis thingy, and WHAT EXACTLY is he saying (simply say what he is saying - he doesn't say that much about it!) concerning the "difficult due to the aesthetic issues" thingy. This would be really great.

[StinkySmurf]

Before I explain the "rejuvenation thingy" problems again, could you please explain more specific the neogenesis thingy, and WHAT EXACTLY is he saying (simply say what he is saying - he doesn't say that much about it!) concerning the "difficult due to the aesthetic issues" thingy. This would be really great.

"The problem with the hair patch assay was it was not very translatable to the human condition, and early on we spent a lot of time looking at developing architecture that... err scaffolding... that we can put our cells in to try to orient the growth of hair follicles because despite all of the success that we are so proud of this is of limited utility in an aesthetic environment."

So there you go. They went with an approach they could make it through Phase 3 with on a $150 million dollar budget instead of going for something so complex as creating a follicle with a scaffolding because that involves aesthetic issues like the angle of hair growth that are an order of magnitude more difficult and these are not folks that want to go outside the company for money. This is a slightly down on it's luck $500 million dollar company where the majority of shares are held by just three parties, and lets face it, they don't want to go after the market of people that are willing to have surgery... thats the whole point of the opening chart where they say they want to be the botox of hair. In other words, they want to reach economies of scale. They are not looking for a solution that involves needing a bunch of artist grade plastic surgeons. They're looking for something thats mass market at least initially.

[hellouser]

"The problem with the hair patch assay was it was not very translatable to the human condition, and early on we spent a lot of time looking at developing architecture that... err scaffolding... that we can put our cells in to try to orient the growth of hair follicles because despite all of the success that we are so proud of this is of limited utility in an aesthetic environment."

So there you go. They went with an approach they could make it through Phase 3 with on a $150 million dollar budget instead of going for something so complex as creating a follicle with a scaffolding because that involves aesthetic issues like the angle of hair growth that are an order of magnitude more difficult and these are not folks that want to go outside the company for money. This is a slightly down on it's luck $500 million dollar company where the majority of shares are held by just three parties, and lets face it, they don't want to go after the market of people that are willing to have surgery... thats the whole point of the opening chart where they say they want to be the botox of hair. In other words, they want to reach economies of scale. They are not looking for a solution that involves needing a bunch of artist grade plastic surgeons. They're looking for something thats mass market at least initially.

Yup. Its a different approach. The investors looking to cash in on this are probably anxious as hell to get the ball rolling and watch their bank accounts explode. I've already started saving up cash for any procedure necessary. At the moment I'm set to go with Gho in the meantime just for my hairline and thicken up whatever else on the crown, but if Aderans has a commercial product like they said they would by Q1 of 2014, those investors will be happy to know I will easily hand over even a large sum of money just for their procedure. And I don't care what it costs... its my psychological health, that DOESNT have a price. These guys are out to make a killing.

Having said that.. is Aderans a publicly traded company? Cuz holy crap I'd like to buy some stock.

[Desmond84]

If they're not using DP cells then there will not be DHT resistance! Their current treatment will probably only delay the inevitable!

Replicel, Aderans, Follica & Intercytex have all folded!

Histogen is all that's left to give us a slight regrowth before we lose it all within 5 years!!!

It's all over I think! Baldness will not be cured in this decade

We lost out!

[Jairus]

If they're not using DP cells then there will not be DHT resistance! Their current treatment will probably only delay the inevitable!

Replicel, Aderans, Follica & Intercytex have all folded!

Histogen is all that's left to give us a slight regrowth before we lose it all within 5 years!!!

It's all over I think! Baldness will not be cured in this decade

We lost out!

WTF!! - Are you serious or mimicking some of the haters?