2015 outlook.

[breakbot]

Maybe someone could contact leo pharma who owns the patent and ask why they didn't finish the trials.If it was effective but the constant changes of the rights of this drug was the main problem.

[lilpauly]

Maybe someone could contact leo pharma who owns the patent and ask why they didn't finish the trials.If it was effective but the constant changes of the rights of this drug was the main problem.

yes , if u look at the all forums people got results , they posted pics , etc. Legit psi was around 2004 , to many people got results!

[breakbot]

yes , if u look at the all forums people got results , they posted pics , etc. Legit psi was around 2004 , to many people got results!

I have read about people who had decent results and i believe it works.
I read from another member that he contacted them but the person he spoke was ignorant about it. It would be very nice to have an answer from them.

[KO1]

Psi can grow hair but unfortunately we need to get in contact with the people who hold the patent to make sure it's produced correctly

Actually, if you google you will find many suppliers

[jamesst11]

even educated people sound ridiculous and uncredible when their posts are riddled with personal insults. You people bickering may have tons of knowledge, but the way you convey it is horrible. Y'all have different views, regiments and beliefs... we get it. Now grow up.

[sdsurfin]

sdsurfin, I also think that the absence of Perceivable side affects is not evidence of no damage being done... I never tried to say it before cause it's kind of difficult to explain, but you put it quite concisely.

Here's my neurotic long winded version:
I imagine that DHT is having all kinds of important complex physiological biochemical effects on the body and mind that science has no clue about and perhaps will never get near analysing.
What if DHT is shaping neurological structures in the mind over time, that lead to subjective abstract behavioral patterns that evolved allowing mans survival. Big fundamental natural traits of masculinity, like raw ambition, natural emotional understanding of the importance of power, courage ...basically the psychological profile of natures "real man".

And then if you block this hormone, you might keep your sexual potency, but what if your completely unaware that your masculinity is being sapped away from you?
you would keep your hair, think you've been lucky to avoid the sides, but in reality you might be a shadow of what nature meant for you..
just that little bit too tame, slightly hesitant in life, the edge taken off you. Evolutionary, small phenomenon are the difference between extinction and survival. DHT is an evolved hormonal phenomenon. If you mess with something so fundamentally essential to physical development, how could it not have an impact on psychological development?

I think that is all correct, especially for younger guys using it. Your natural hormonal balance is extremely crucial to the brain's development as well as the body. I know that in my case, RU and especially Fin made me sluggish, brain foggy, feel depressed, low sex drive, sore testicles all day, watery semen, and generally just not vivacious. These all went away a few weeks after stopping. I can easily see these effects just being reduced in others to the point where they don't really notice, but over time it may build up. Or your body may over-adjust in other ways, and then when you stop you're gonna be all out of wack. Maybe there are people out there who have way higher DHT and 5ar levels, and fin balances them out. who knows, but I know from feeling what it does that the risks to many people are real. Also, it's not even DHT that is the real issue. Finasteride is a steroidal inhibitor of 5ar, which is an extremely important enzyme in your body, especially in regards to the brain. Most people who do not notice things like sore balls or a limp dick are still undergoing changes in how they feel, their energy, anxiety etc because of a reduction in 5ar. I do not personally know any men that have not noticed a difference in their overall energy and health when they got off of finasteride. I do know many people who have very mild sides and put up with them, and also guys who didn't notice the changes it was causing until they stopped.

And swooping, I'm not bitter about anything. I don't exceedingly care whether I lose my hair or not at my age, I have a good life and a lot going for me, and I'm honestly very happy for anyone who can stop their hair loss. I say go for whatever you want, fin is certainly proven to work. I just want to help people expand their options, and people deserve to have good information and not just propaganda from HT doctors and drug companies that declare their drugs are "side free" when they are compounds that can have really bad effects over many decades. Most of the guys on here seem really young, and the smart and productive ones will wake up one day and realize that hair is not worth compromising their health. RU is potentially safer than fin because it is not steroidal and this has less chance to permanently change your chemistry, but it is also a drug that never finished trials and on which the safety info is incredibly spare. For all we know it could have detrimental effects that none of us can even guess at. PGD2 blockers and follicept and other things may not work. You're right we don't have much evidence yet. I'm as skeptical as anyone else. But right now, and despite what your opinions are there is also not much evidence that they WONT work. and the fact that they are things with a long and proven safety record is enough for me to be interested in giving them a shot.

[dus]

even educated people sound ridiculous and uncredible when their posts are riddled with personal insults. You people bickering may have tons of knowledge, but the way you convey it is horrible. Y'all have different views, regiments and beliefs... we get it. Now grow up.

Couldn't have said it better.

[jamesst11]

Now it's time for all of you to state your credentials in the field of cellular and molecular biology.

[EXprettyboy]

You don't need a PhD to know that hormones play a central role in human development and that removing one is likely to dramatically distort what nature intended.

Also, the kind of questions raised by doing so are not easily answered, perhaps impossible to answer. How could we know how it would effect ones personal expression over decades? There is no science that can measure "masculine psychology". Does that mean the question shouldn't be asked? Science can only prove what it can tangibly measure, that does not mean that what it cannot measure doesn't exist.

[It's2014ComeOnAlready]

You don't need a PhD to know that hormones play a central role in human development and that removing one is likely to dramatically distort what nature intended.

Also, the kind of questions raised by doing so are not easily answered, perhaps impossible to answer. How could we know how it would effect ones personal expression over decades? There is no science that can measure "masculine psychology". Does that mean the question shouldn't be asked? Science can only prove what it can tangibly measure, that does not mean that what it cannot measure doesn't exist.

You guys need to chill about fin. It works for most people with no sides. DHT is necessary for sexual development up until a certain point. That's why it is safe to use for most men. Those who get long term side effects have pre-disposing factors - low testosterone, hypertension, diabetes etc. If your testosterone is healthy and you have no other issues, you should be fine.

We want new treatments of course, because we shouldn't have to play with any hormones in wanting to keep something cosmetic. I agree that fin is stone-age medicine, but it's all we got right now.

[KO1]

You don't need a PhD to know that hormones play a central role in human development and that removing one is likely to dramatically distort what nature intended.

Also, the kind of questions raised by doing so are not easily answered, perhaps impossible to answer. How could we know how it would effect ones personal expression over decades? There is no science that can measure "masculine psychology". Does that mean the question shouldn't be asked? Science can only prove what it can tangibly measure, that does not mean that what it cannot measure doesn't exist.

You are just making things up now. You lack any serious data so you cover with narratives and feeling.

[It's2014ComeOnAlready]

You are just making things up now. You lack any serious data so you cover with narratives and feeling.

He doesn't have any real information. However, I can speak from experience, as I haven't taken any fin over the last 3-4 days. I feel much better, physically and mentally then I had been since taking the medication over a year and a half ago.

Going to wait till I feel completely back to normal, and then slowly introduce it again. Don't wanna lose ground lol. Hopefully it takes. If bimatoprost would just come out already, I wouldn't have this problem.

[EXprettyboy]

"He doesn't have any serious data"

..that's the whole point I'm making. It's the things that science can not measure that is most disconcerting.

I don't have valid answers, but I do have a valid questions. Is it just possible that DHT is doing things to your brain over time that naturally lead to the full expression of masculine psychology?
Moreover, is it possible that you would not perceive it happening over time?

As sdsurfin originally put it, "slow feminisation".
We are not talking about normal side affects, we are talking about something you couldn't possibly detect that is still happening anyway. Do smokers feel the side affects of the plaque in their arteries? Can you feel a cancer growing internally? Just because you don't percieve it doesn't mean it's not there.

[sdsurfin]

Everyone is obsessed with masculinity. It's not even about that. It's about brain health. 5ar is necessary for neurotransmitter interactions that basically make you happy and not anxious. Fin is not going to make you a woman. But it might make you unable to enjoy sex and feel depressed for the rest of your life. And there are many doctors and scientists that concur with a very strong possibility of permanent damage.

First you say to chill out about fin and then you say that you feel like a different person off of it. This just proves that people care more about their hair than their own mental and physical health. It's not about being an alpha male or any of that bodybuilder nonsense. It's about not ****ing up your hormonal system which controls things you don't even know about. dHt and 5ar are used for many things in the body, and it's no surprise that to a of people are very hurt by this drug. It's not really a gamble. You might not suffer too much or maybe not at all in the short term, but you are still slowly poisoning your body.

If you can't understand that then Godspeed and good luck, it's not that complicated. Prob wouldn't kill you to use it for a couple years as a bridge but honestly we should have CB and pgd2 blockers to buy soon which should be just as good. Even RU is potentially more safe as it does not affect 5ar

[It's2014ComeOnAlready]

"He doesn't have any serious data"

..that's the whole point I'm making. It's the things that science can not measure that is most disconcerting.

I don't have valid answers, but I do have a valid questions. Is it just possible that DHT is doing things to your brain over time that naturally lead to the full expression of masculine psychology?
Moreover, is it possible that you would not perceive it happening over time?

As sdsurfin originally put it, "slow feminisation".
We are not talking about normal side affects, we are talking about something you couldn't possibly detect that is still happening anyway. Do smokers feel the side affects of the plaque in their arteries? Can you feel a cancer growing internally? Just because you don't percieve it doesn't mean it's not there.

you are equating side effects from a medication to cancer? That's absurd. Also there is no "slow feminization." No man has ever become a woman taking finasteride, even over the course of 15 years. Is Spencer Kobren a woman? How bout the very numerous doctors that have taken it for years? No. You both are wrong.