2015 outlook.

[Swooping]

Yup, it's impossible. Hair does not grow that fast under any condition. Those pics are a scam. As for Bim, I think Spencer had it right: If the trials had been successful, Allergen would have been crowing about them. That's the point of a corporation - to make money. If they have something that will make money, they would tell the market so that the stock would rise. There's no good reason for keeping the results secret.

They do that with every of their other compounds. If the results are positive they shout it out as loud as they can, as fast as they can. Bimatoprost just probably couldn't match minoxidil so it isn't interesting for them anymore. Kinda expected. Next.

[It's2014ComeOnAlready]

They do that with every of their other compounds. If the results are positive they shout it out as loud as they can, as fast as they can. Bimatoprost just probably couldn't match minoxidil so it isn't interesting for them anymore. Kinda expected. Next.

You know nothing. Bimatoprost is a widely available chemical. If they "shout it out as loud as they can, as fast as they can," they stand to lose money, because others will try and sell higher concentrations for hair loss before it becomes available by them.

"Kinda expected" - Yeah, by you.

[Hairismylife]

You know nothing. Bimatoprost is a widely available chemical. If they "shout it out as loud as they can, as fast as they can," they stand to lose money, because others will try and sell higher concentrations for hair loss before it becomes available by them.

"Kinda expected" - Yeah, by you.

No…he knows RU,RU and RU. He knows his broscience.

[Swooping]

No…he knows RU,RU and RU. He knows his broscience.

The reality that finasteride + minoxidil will still reign king for the next coming years and can't get outperformed;

[alfon]

Hi guys, old time lurker, been out of this world for a while, just a curiosity:


What happened with that OSH101 thing? Sh** was promising indeed, and some guys had amazing results on it.

If I make a couple of good trades maybe I will investigate into it.

Cheers

[Occulus]

When did Spencer say this?

On the last episode of the podcast, during Joe's call-in.

[It's2014ComeOnAlready]

The reality that finasteride + minoxidil will still reign king for the next coming years and can't get outperformed;

You're nothing more than a petty little internet troll, and you add nothing of value to the discussion. If you're so pleased with RU or fin or minox, then go use them and stfu. Don't try and troll people actually looking for good news based on REAL information.

[Swooping]

You're nothing more than a petty little internet troll, and you add nothing of value to the discussion. If you're so pleased with RU or fin or minox, then go use them and stfu. Don't try and troll people actually looking for good news based on REAL information.

Sure will continue to do so, do you know how awesome my hair got because of them and that I stopped my hairloss? U mirin’ brah?

Look there is a difference between you and people like me. I’m not a dreamer like you. I’m someone who takes the matter in his own hands and is a realist.

People like you said the same thing 2 years ago, 5 years ago, 10 years ago. Most are blinded by hope & desperation up the point that they can’t think rationally anymore. It’s the same thing occurring over and over again. People like me who put out criticism and are very skeptical get attacked by these people. Why?

I’ll tell you why. The thought of it being a reality crushes your hopes. I’m your fear. That’s why you don’t like it. The only thing you clamp on is your “hope”. That’s why you attack me.

I do really think that most if not all of these pipeline treatments are going to fail, that’s my opinion and speculation. Just as much as you speculate and have a opinion. The fun thing is that I actually do often build my speculation with more objectivity than you do. In the case of Bimatoprost it has been outperformed almost by 100% by minoxidil from the results we have seen on a lower dosage. It’s objective data, whether you like it or not. Replicel has shown shit results. Histogen has shown shit results. Setipiprant is merely based on a hypothesis with no foundation of any real evidence. The list goes on.

It’s funny because I watched Spencer his show for the first time this week and he is also a realist in that sense. He advocates the same thing. It’s simple. You either work with the current treatments we have, or you need to come to terms that you will be going bald. It’s a cold hard reality currently, simple as that. And he is 100% right. Prevention is also extremely important in AGA.

I balance dreamers like you out. You live in a fantasy world. I would rather advocate realism to people. Dreaming won’t get you far. If you have a problem with this all that’s your problem not mine <3.

[Occulus]

It’s funny because I watched Spencer his show for the first time this week and he is also a realist in that sense. He advocates the same thing. It’s simple. You either work with the current treatments we have, or you need to come to terms that you will be going bald. It’s a cold hard reality currently, simple as that. And he is 100% right. Prevention is also extremely important in AGA.

I balance dreamers like you out. You live in a fantasy world. I would rather advocate realism to people. Dreaming won’t get you far. If you have a problem with this all that’s your problem not mine <3.

I've been on the forums since 2000. Do you know how many treatments have come and gone since then? Intercytex? Follica? Acell? Aderans? The list goes on and on and on. When I was a child - about ten years old - I remember seeing a report on a news program details some "revolutionary" hair treatment that would end hair loss in "five years." That was thirty years ago lol.

There are two approved treatments, some off-label stuff, and hair transplants - and that is it and will be it for the foreseeable future. As you said, you either get with the protocols that are available, or get use to being bald, because false hope does nothing to grow hair.

[I am ready]

You are absolutely right! I am 33 and I think the same things as you... I am just trying to earn some extra money and then I go to visit dr. GHO. I think 43000 € should fix my NW6 ;-)

[sdsurfin]

I've been on the forums since 2000. Do you know how many treatments have come and gone since then? Intercytex? Follica? Acell? Aderans? The list goes on and on and on. When I was a child - about ten years old - I remember seeing a report on a news program details some "revolutionary" hair treatment that would end hair loss in "five years." That was thirty years ago lol.

There are two approved treatments, some off-label stuff, and hair transplants - and that is it and will be it for the foreseeable future. As you said, you either get with the protocols that are available, or get use to being bald, because false hope does nothing to grow hair.

all of those failed treatments that you mentioned are cell based approaches that were not fully developed in terms of their science and potential. Not only that, but folic and a cell were never treatments that even began trials, acell is not targeted for hair loss and folic is just a company that was set up to test things. Aderans was effective at maintaining and growing back some hair. They just weren't effective enough to market anything. other companies are currently building on their knowledge. this is how science works, and eventually you get something good. The people who run follica shifted their focus to the PGD2 pathway, which is currently being explored for a new treatment. Get your facts straight. Swooping is broadly negative without stating true facts.

for instance: "In the case of Bimatoprost it has been outperformed almost by 100% by minoxidil from the results we have seen on a lower dosage." This statement has no factual basis. Bimatoprost at low concentrations was equal in performance to minoxidil according to the company developing it and a separate duke U study. if it was less effective at all, it was not 100% less effective. Allergan decided to run more trials at higher doses because they want something much more effective. It might or might not have worked. the best guess is that it worked or sort of worked and needs more tweaking, otherwise they would have scrapped the trials and stopped recruiting at this point. i don't know if Bim will be a huge thing or not, but my only point is that swooping is not being objective or "realist". he is being negative. period. Earlier he trashed follicept as being garbage and worthless and then did a 180 when it suited him. Follicept, him, SM, and CB all have very solid science behind the and there are professionals spending millions of dollars to pursue these things. They know more than we do, and if they have hope for the to work then there's no reason to discount them. in no other time in history have there been treatments targeted at hair loss, because no one knew shit about it. the last ten years saw some failed cell based approaches for many conditions, but that means almost nothing except that we are getting closer to real and effective cell treatments in all branches of medicine.


It is so completely retarded to say that because something has not panned out that it will not soon. it's not proper logic. Its like saying that we will never have an aids vaccine because we haven't gotten one in the past 30 years. They have been talking about that forever, and just now we are starting to come close to a real vaccine. it will happen, and soon. You can say the same thing about pretty much any disease or condition, the only difference is that balding gets talked about a lot because people have always wanted to cure it and also take advantage of peoples insecurities. Is it possible that every single treatment in the pipeline right now fails? possible. but definitely not probable. we have already proved we can control and treat baldness with finasteride. to say that we won't come up with a treatment that is equally effective but different is nonsense. maintenance of hair is a current reality, and one that WILL be improved upon. Cell based science will be the real cure, but that is probably a matter of a couple of decades at least (my guess based on trial times and procedures. we probably will have a method for growing new follicles much sooner).

[Hairismylife]

And he repeatedly glorifies his negativism as realitism.

[FooFighter]

all of those failed treatments that you mentioned are cell based approaches that were not fully developed in terms of their science and potential. Not only that, but folic and a cell were never treatments that even began trials, acell is not targeted for hair loss and folic is just a company that was set up to test things. Aderans was effective at maintaining and growing back some hair. They just weren't effective enough to market anything. other companies are currently building on their knowledge. this is how science works, and eventually you get something good. The people who run follica shifted their focus to the PGD2 pathway, which is currently being explored for a new treatment. Get your facts straight. Swooping is broadly negative without stating true facts.

for instance: "In the case of Bimatoprost it has been outperformed almost by 100% by minoxidil from the results we have seen on a lower dosage." This statement has no factual basis. Bimatoprost at low concentrations was equal in performance to minoxidil according to the company developing it and a separate duke U study. if it was less effective at all, it was not 100% less effective. Allergan decided to run more trials at higher doses because they want something much more effective. It might or might not have worked. the best guess is that it worked or sort of worked and needs more tweaking, otherwise they would have scrapped the trials and stopped recruiting at this point. i don't know if Bim will be a huge thing or not, but my only point is that swooping is not being objective or "realist". he is being negative. period. Earlier he trashed follicept as being garbage and worthless and then did a 180 when it suited him. Follicept, him, SM, and CB all have very solid science behind the and there are professionals spending millions of dollars to pursue these things. They know more than we do, and if they have hope for the to work then there's no reason to discount them. in no other time in history have there been treatments targeted at hair loss, because no one knew shit about it. the last ten years saw some failed cell based approaches for many conditions, but that means almost nothing except that we are getting closer to real and effective cell treatments in all branches of medicine.


It is so completely retarded to say that because something has not panned out that it will not soon. it's not proper logic. Its like saying that we will never have an aids vaccine because we haven't gotten one in the past 30 years. They have been talking about that forever, and just now we are starting to come close to a real vaccine. it will happen, and soon. You can say the same thing about pretty much any disease or condition, the only difference is that balding gets talked about a lot because people have always wanted to cure it and also take advantage of peoples insecurities. Is it possible that every single treatment in the pipeline right now fails? possible. but definitely not probable. we have already proved we can control and treat baldness with finasteride. to say that we won't come up with a treatment that is equally effective but different is nonsense. maintenance of hair is a current reality, and one that WILL be improved upon. Cell based science will be the real cure, but that is probably a matter of a couple of decades at least (my guess based on trial times and procedures. we probably will have a method for growing new follicles much sooner).

Stem cell science evolve so much in last 10 years, but not enough, because its still “forbidden apple“ in many countries. The law and goverment money stops stem cell therapies to move fast, because of the controversies about stem cell therapies.

[Keki]

I balance dreamers like you out. You live in a fantasy world. I would rather advocate realism to people. Dreaming won’t get you far. If you have a problem with this all that’s your problem not mine <3.

How huge is your ego lol, you seems to have all the answers and the billions of dollar spent in the development of new products are a waste, people and reserchers are retard and you are the only smart one here, what a bunch of bullshits, and even if you are right and they are worse then minox in term of hairs regrowth they can still work and be a weapon for people who can't use minox or fina

[Swooping]

I've been on the forums since 2000. Do you know how many treatments have come and gone since then? Intercytex? Follica? Acell? Aderans? The list goes on and on and on. When I was a child - about ten years old - I remember seeing a report on a news program details some "revolutionary" hair treatment that would end hair loss in "five years." That was thirty years ago lol.

There are two approved treatments, some off-label stuff, and hair transplants - and that is it and will be it for the foreseeable future. As you said, you either get with the protocols that are available, or get use to being bald, because false hope does nothing to grow hair.

Well there you go, you put it even better. It’s funny because if we would indeed take the opinion of those dreamers for granted we would have a cure for AGA indeed probably already 30 years ago. Unfortunately based on latest research we are finally beginning to see the pathology of AGA more and more clearly. It becomes clear why it’s so difficult to cure. If we follow the dreamers philosophy we would have cured cancer and heart diseases ages ago too but we see how that goes .

How huge is your ego lol, you seems to have all the answers and the billions of dollar spent in the development of new products are a waste, people and reserchers are retard and you are the only smart one here, what a bunch of bullshits, and even if you are right and they are worse then minox in term of hairs regrowth they can still work and be a weapon for people who can't use minox or fina

You call it ego, I call it confidence. Billions of dollars spent in the development of AGA? God don’t make me laugh please, these pipeline treatments are pocket change. Take cancer or heart disease now there are billions invested in and the effort put into it is 100x the magnitude of AGA. In fact even in benign prostatic hyperplasia there is put way more effort, funding & research into than AGA. Yet we see how incredibly hard it proves to really put out a “cure” or a very effective treatment in those branches.

You do think that everything needs to fit into your world, right? Oh boy, Allergan won’t give a shit if they can’t match or outperform minoxidil because it won’t be a interesting treatment for them. They will drop it immediately. They need a monetizing product. Not a product that can’t match itself with a generic minoxidil which is 35 years old. They are in it to make money not to make you happy. Something that will go to market needs to be extremely exciting or it just won’t be profitable.

Furthermore I don’t consider myself smart. I view everyone equally. I don’t like ignorance though it leads to miseducation, that’s all. I would be a hypocrite if I think people and researchers are retarded because I learn from them on a daily basis. In fact I have never been so excited about the new recent findings of researchers regarding AGA because I do really feel we are grasping now how the pathology of AGA works more day by day. All of them are important in that aspect because they all contribute to our understanding, all credit goes to them.

I just think it’s naïve and unrealistic to expect better treatments coming in the foreseeable future, without even seeing any evidence pointing towards it. Ironically the evidence that is there, shows bad results. Take follicept as an example, they have good intentions. But the fact that people are already hyped up shows me how incredibly desperate people are up the point that they can’t think rationally. Based on what are they hyped? A rodent model lol.

Perhaps they don’t want to after all. They want to keep grasp of their “hope”. In fact people go that far that they will even fabricate stuff or say stupid shit to keep grasping on to their hope. But someone just said it really well here; Hope will do nothing to grow you/keep your hair. The cure will come one day, better treatments will arrive one day. We’ll just be a lot older. Meanwhile everyone has a choice.