Dr Nigam-Neversaynever update-hair doubling

[Arashi]

I've just thought of another way: all Dr Nigam needs to do to provide solid proof, is make a video. Get a good camera, 1080p. Then, after the procedure, make a video which shows continuous shots of the WHOLE scalp, in close up, slowly, so we can easily see that the grafts were actually taken from the shown area and not somewhere else. I suggest to make the video a few minutes and circle around the head different speeds. Would also be great if this could be done pre-op of the shaved head, with enough detail so we can count hairs/graft if we'd freeze the vid.

This in combination with what GC83UK outlined should be good proof imho. Dr Nigam can then go ahead and use somebody from his staff as a test person.

Also, a regular forum member here could be invited to watch the whole procedure in person, if anyone would be interested of course, this would even add more proof. But I don't think it's necessary, if good photo's and video's are being made.

[didi]

Would our Dutch test man be interested in flying to india if dr gho refuses to do the test

we need someone we can trust like NVN

[hellouser]

Thing is, Dr Nigam has been caught photoshopping.

I took graphic design in college for 3 years, worked in the industry for another 2 years prior and have been in the industry since graduationg 7 years ago, for a total of 12 years.

I'd LOVE to see these 'photoshopped' images, I'll easily tell you guys if this accusation is true.

[Arashi]

I think it's best to just see how NSN's case develops. He's been 8 days out, he should see regrowth by now. If his case looks convincing, then there's most probably another regular forum member here that has no problems participating in a transplant testcase, which would be a lot better proof than some staff member, which in my opinion really won't proof anything at all, since it's going to be a piece of cake to manipulate it.

[Arashi]

Thing is, Dr Nigam has been caught photoshopping. How do we know he's not going to try something 'funny' again ? It's damn easy to manipulate this, especially if he's using a staff member. Like, extract the grafts elsewhere and just extract *hairs* (not the grafts) in the observation area. Then transplant the extracted *grafts* (taken elsewhere). Result: 100% donor regeneration AND recipient growth.

[gc83uk]

This is hilarious

fuking hysterical

[tonypizza]

This is hilarious

[gc83uk]

GC,
Yes i will do this next week.
With the recipient there will not be a problem documenting, as the recipient will be slick bald.
But the problem is how to monitor donor regeneration unless we make a tatto.
I convinced one of my staff for the same yesterday, to be the volunteer.
He who is slick bald and is ready to get a tattoo on his scalp donor.
My clinic staff would be ideal as i can take daily pics,otherwise it is difficult to ask a patient to make a tattoo and visit the clinic regularly for follow up.
Thats why me and neversay agreed to count the donor extraction around his birth mark at the donor scalp, which we will be following up as and when he sends his pics.
I think you would have taken a look at my other thread where i have done exactly the same documentation with all the grafts implanted at the recipient with tattoo mark showing doubling of 6 single follicles to 12/13 single follicle unit.
We will take both macro and video microscopic pics around the tattoo mark
I think it is better to do the documentation with less number of follicles/FU to analyse correctly without any doubt.Infact i was about to do hair tripling trial and pluck graft documentation on him,now we will do all three with 10 grafts for each technique.
.

To be honest with you, you do not need a tatoo.

Here would be my suggestion:

1) The first thing to do is to pick an area of the donor area to extract, lets say a maximum area of 5cm x 5cm. The smaller the area the better!!!

2) Then take a photo of this area BEFORE extraction. The hair needs to be shaved down, just like my photos. The photo has to be clear, cannot be blurry. We need to be able to see each graft in our 5 x 5cm area!

3) Extract 50 x 2FU's from the 'test area'. And photograph immediately this area after the 50 extractions have been done. We should be able to see 50 bloody tiny wounds, which will be easy to identify.

4) Take a clear photo of the recipient area, BEFORE any new grafts are implanted. We need to be able to identify EXISTING HAIRS in the slick scalp area if there is any!(This can be done at the same time as step 1).

This photo much show the bald slick area where the new 2FU grafts are going to be placed. Ideally we should locate a small area in the recipient area which these will be implanted. If this is not possible and the patient rather you spread the grafts out over the scalp, then it's not a big problem, but we need to be able to find EVERY 2FU implanted later on. So this is why I suggest they are all implanted in a small area of say again 5 x 5cm. If your feeling brave put it in a 2 x 2cm area.

5) Implant the grafts into the area as stipulated in step 4.

6) Take photo of the recipient area with the newly implanted grafts immediately after procedure. Close up! Not blurry. Must be able to see all 50 grafts in 1 shot.

7) A few days later take more pictures of the donor area ( the exact area of the extractions, we should easily be able to circle all 50 extractions and see how many have grown back.

8) A few weeks / months later you take another photo of the newly grown 50 x recipient grafts. The hair needs to be short again in the recipient otherwise the long hairs will ruin the study. And important see if the 2 hair FU has grown back or if in fact it's just a 1 hair FU .

How does that sound? I think it will be a walk in the park for you

[drnigams]

GC,
Yes i will do this next week.
With the recipient there will not be a problem documenting, as the recipient will be slick bald.
But the problem is how to monitor donor regeneration unless we make a tatto.
I convinced one of my staff for the same yesterday, to be the volunteer.
He who is slick bald and is ready to get a tattoo on his scalp donor.
My clinic staff would be ideal as i can take daily pics,otherwise it is difficult to ask a patient to make a tattoo and visit the clinic regularly for follow up.
Thats why me and neversay agreed to count the donor extraction around his birth mark at the donor scalp, which we will be following up as and when he sends his pics.
I think you would have taken a look at my other thread where i have done exactly the same documentation with all the grafts implanted at the recipient with tattoo mark showing doubling of 6 single follicles to 12/13 single follicle unit.
We will take both macro and video microscopic pics around the tattoo mark
I think it is better to do the documentation with less number of follicles/FU to analyse correctly without any doubt.Infact i was about to do hair tripling trial and pluck graft documentation on him,now we will do all three with 10 grafts for each technique.
.

OK that all makes sense. Do you think it would be worthwhile for you to pick a subject patient and extract 50 x 2FU grafts from his donor from a say 3cm x 3cm area or near that size and implant these 50 x 2FU's into the recipient area, again roughly the same area size. Ideally a slick bald area.

This will demonstrate perfectly how well your doing with this method.

What do you think?

Obviously we need to take good photographs of the donor area so we can clearly see the 50 extracted grafts and the 50 grafts implanted in the recip area.

We will be looking for 50 x 2FU's regrowing in the donor area AND
At least 45 (hopefully 50) x 2FU's growing in the recipient area?
Does that seem theoretically possible?

This is something that the users on this forum are screaming out to happen with Gho, however it seems they are hitting a brick wall at the moment.

If you were to do this, it would be 'ground breaking'.

[gc83uk]

I agree with the above, I would love to see Dr Nigam perform this for us.

It would give us a lot of confidence as customers.

I am really looking forward to the DP cell culture, I truly think (as Dr Nigam has rightfully stated) that it is the missing link in the ascertainment of 95 - 100% donor regeneration and also the possibility of new hair growth.

Precisely, but I want to see this basic test done first of the doubling. I can't even comprehend the more technical stuff until this is done. He will gain credibility just by doing this simple exercise.

[UK_]

OK that all makes sense. Do you think it would be worthwhile for you to pick a subject patient and extract 50 x 2FU grafts from his donor from a say 3cm x 3cm area or near that size and implant these 50 x 2FU's into the recipient area, again roughly the same area size. Ideally a slick bald area.

This will demonstrate perfectly how well your doing with this method.

What do you think?

Obviously we need to take good photographs of the donor area so we can clearly see the 50 extracted grafts and the 50 grafts implanted in the recip area.

We will be looking for 50 x 2FU's regrowing in the donor area AND
At least 45 (hopefully 50) x 2FU's growing in the recipient area?
Does that seem theoretically possible?

This is something that the users on this forum are screaming out to happen with Gho, however it seems they are hitting a brick wall at the moment.

If you were to do this, it would be 'ground breaking'.

I agree with the above post, I would love to see Dr Nigam perform this for us.

It would give us a lot of confidence as customers.

I am really looking forward to the DP cell culture, I truly think (as Dr Nigam has rightfully stated) that it is the missing link in the ascertainment of 95 - 100% donor regeneration and also the possibility of new hair growth.

[gc83uk]

GC,
Regarding your query that 2FU would grow at the recipient and the 2FU at the donor after bisection outside the scalp ,you are correct.
Regarding the % regeneration, theoretically it should be around100%.
But as in traditional FUE/FUT where there is 90 to 98% regeneration , depending on the skill of the surgeon and how the respective scalp takes up the graft.In vitro hair doubling will have the similar regeneration.Another advantage is if the you have a stemcell reponsive scalp you may get the benefit ofadditional new hairs or activation of vellous hair secondary to stemcellinjection.I always prefer patients to take atleast 1 injection of multiplied stemcells after 6 weeks.
Jahoda and few other researchers have shown that with bisection of FU outside the scalp ( 1/4th proximal FU and 3/4th distal FU),the regeneration is upto 60%.
But in our case, with the addition of epithelial and dermal stemcells and growth factors we are able to provide the missing link for higher regeneration.
I am waiting for the dp culture in next 2 months at our lab when the results should further improve.

OK that all makes sense. Do you think it would be worthwhile for you to pick a subject patient and extract 50 x 2FU grafts from his donor from a say 3cm x 3cm area or near that size and implant these 50 x 2FU's into the recipient area, again roughly the same area size. Ideally a slick bald area.

This will demonstrate perfectly how well your doing with this method.

What do you think?

Obviously we need to take good photographs of the donor area so we can clearly see the 50 extracted grafts and the 50 grafts implanted in the recip area.

We will be looking for 50 x 2FU's regrowing in the donor area AND
At least 45 (hopefully 50) x 2FU's growing in the recipient area?
Does that seem theoretically possible?

This is something that the users on this forum are screaming out to happen with Gho, however it seems they are hitting a brick wall at the moment.

If you were to do this, it would be 'ground breaking'.

[drnigams]

GC,
Regarding your query that 2FU would grow at the recipient and the 2FU at the donor after bisection outside the scalp ,you are correct.
Regarding the % regeneration, theoretically it should be around100%.
But as in traditional FUE/FUT where there is 90 to 98% regeneration , depending on the skill of the surgeon and how the respective scalp takes up the graft.
In vitro hair doubling will have the similar regeneration.
Another advantage is if , you have a stemcell responsive scalp you may get the benefit of additional new hairs or activation of vellous hair secondary to stemcellinjection.
I always prefer patients to take atleast 1 injection of multiplied stemcells after 6 weeks.
Jahoda and few other researchers have shown that with bisection of FU outside the scalp ( 1/4th proximal FU and 3/4th distal FU),the regeneration is upto 60%.
But in our case, with the addition of epithelial and dermal stemcells and growth factors we are able to provide the missing link for higher regeneration.
And also the fact that we will be bisecting from next week at the level of dermal cup sheath,hence our both the bisected parts will have epithelial and dermal components of the follicle to increase the regeneration potential further.
I am waiting for the dp culture to get ready in next 2 months at our lab, when the results should further improve.

Just to be clear, when using invitro bisecting outside the scalp, if you extract a 2 hair FU and bisect it outside the scalp and put one half back in the donor and one half in the recipient...

You end up with a 2 hair FU growing in the recipient and a 2 hair growing the donor, correct?

Assuming I have this correct, can you tell me the percentages of this being successful each time? I'm also assuming it's 100% or close to it?

[gc83uk]

Just to be clear, when using invitro bisecting outside the scalp, if you extract a 2 hair FU and bisect it outside the scalp and put one half back in the donor and one half in the recipient...

You end up with a 2 hair FU growing in the recipient and a 2 hair growing the donor, correct?

Assuming I have this correct, can you tell me the percentages of this being successful each time? I'm also assuming it's 100% or close to it?

[gc83uk]

Also Dr Nigam,

You are an expert in the field, there is no doubt of that, but I must say it's difficult to read your posts. Please paragraph your comments to make them more readable.