Histogen and hair transplant

[25 going on 65]

Maradona I would definitely tell the doc about taking fin. Being referred to an endocrinologist isn't the worst thing in the world, maybe they can help you. I'd be really cautious about self-diagnosing in general let alone self-diagnosing something as rare and poorly understood as PFS.

As for the thread topic, I must say I'm also paranoid about hair transplants hurting the effectiveness of future treatments. No one knows for sure whether it will, and if so which treatments would be affected/by how much. It makes me want to hold off on surgery as long as I can. I personally will be on dutasteride before setting foot in a surgical clinic though unfortunately some guys don't have the medication option.
Of course if it turns out not to matter, it would suck that some men went for years with more visible balding when they didn't have to. You can't get that time back.
All the uncertainty in this industry is so annoying

[Jasari]

I very much doubt a hair transplant with have any effect on future treatment. Histogen for example is injected into area experiencing hairloss. Lets say for example your a norwood 3a and you get a fue transplant into the front third to adress your hairline, even when histogen is readily available you wont require it in the front third area anyway as it has been adressed by the transplant.

Essentially where histogen will be a godsend is to reverse people progressing down the norwood scale. In that regard if your a norwood 3/4 you can fix up the front third and histogen can prevent the hair behind the transplant ever falling out.

Futher the donor area is a moot point because you will never require histogen there in the first place.

The people that would potentially have to think seriously about a transplant are those at a norwood 5 and above level. They more than likely cannot achieve full density with a transplant and may be unresposive to histogen when it comes out if they have said transplant. For those adressing a smaller area i really cant see why you would rule out a transplant now, especially if it can stop you losing your youth. That being said however if the density of a transplant is quite low chances are there should be a large amount of untouched dormant hair follicles on the scalp to provide a significant yield from histogen.

[JJJJrS]

This is exactly why there should be more of an emphasis on this forum on getting to the bottom of Gho's HST. If you're considering a HT right now and are worried about how it would interact with future treatments, obviously you'd want the most minimally invasive/scarless procedure with a greatly expanded donor.

People spend a lot of time on here talking about what-ifs and treatments that are years away. We have a hair transplant procedure available right now that, at least on paper, sounds like it's miles above all other hair loss treatments and there's some pretty compelling evidence supporting those claims. Wouldn't it better if people invested more energy in finding out how well it works? If we eventually get the conclusive proof it works, patients can start putting pressure on surgeons to start offering it as well. If on the other hand it turns out that it doesn't work as claimed, then we can stop discussing it.

[UK_]

Dr Ziering has mentioned he is currently trying HSC on scar tissue - I hope soon he will try to see what happens when HSC is applied to both donor and recipient areas after a HT, I think it will greatly help wound healing and create more hairs per follicular unit and perhaps a some NEW hair follicles.

[UK_]

This is exactly why there should be more of an emphasis on this forum on getting to the bottom of Gho's HST. If you're considering a HT right now and are worried about how it would interact with future treatments, obviously you'd want the most minimally invasive/scarless procedure with a greatly expanded donor.

But how do we do that? 10 years ago Dr Gho was making the same claims and nobody could get to the bottom of his treatment back then, now he is making similar claims and its the same thing - he will probably carry on like this until he retires.

[aim4hair]

But how do we do that? 10 years ago Dr Gho was making the same claims and nobody could get to the bottom of his treatment back then, now he is making similar claims and its the same thing - he will probably carry on like this until he retires.

Actually, dr. Gho is booked for months, and there is a long waiting list for his procedure. So that could tell you alot of people beleive in his technique despite what most of the online forum community think.

[Kiwi]

Actually, dr. Gho is booked for months, and there is a long waiting list for his procedure. So that could tell you alot of people beleive in his technique despite what most of the online forum community think.

I think all it tells us is that people are desperate and will spend their entire life savings on this greedy douche bag.

Screw Gho if he aint going to share his technique freely with other docs like FUT and FUE were shared with him

Its why this world is so screwed up. Greed.

[UK_]

Actually, dr. Gho is booked for months, and there is a long waiting list for his procedure. So that could tell you alot of people beleive in his technique despite what most of the online forum community think.

Universal truth is not measured in mass appeal.

[aim4hair]

I think all it tells us is that people are desperate and will spend their entire life savings on this greedy douche bag.

Screw Gho if he aint going to share his technique freely with other docs like FUT and FUE were shared with him

Its why this world is so screwed up. Greed.

FUE was not shared.. Woods wanted to charge docs fot it but they found out how to do it without paying him... So it seems like no doctor is able to find out how HST is done yet.
Plus, HST price is not really expensive as some skeptics make it sound to be. It's in the range with FUE.
For example 1600-1800 HST grafts cost €9400, let's check the average of FUE for some of the most famous and reputable doctors "who ironically are never accused of being greedy or over priced:

1) Dr. Bisanga: €5 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost €8000 to €9000
2) Dr. Rahal: $8 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $12,800 to $14,400
3) Dr. Feller: $10 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $16,000 to $18,000
4) Dr. Bauman: $15 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $24,000 to $27,000
5) Dr. Umar: $7 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $11,200 to $12,600
6) Dr. Shapiro: $7 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $11,200 to $12,600

(i pologize if any of the above prices were changed recently)

I know some doctors reduce the price per graft if you go above 2000 or 2500 but still they all seem to be in the same range and we are just talking about 1600-1800 grafts here.

So i don't really see why gho haters make it sound like gho is greedy and his procedure is the most expensive in the world right now.

And i don't see why gho should share his technique with other doctors freely, he has been working hard for it and many of others did nothing bad doubting and bad mouthing him.

[ccmethinning]

FUE was not shared.. Woods wanted to charge docs fot it but they found out how to do it without paying him... So it seems like no doctor is able to find out how HST is done yet.
Plus, HST price is not really expensive as some skeptics make it sound to be. It's in the range with FUE.
For example 1600-1800 HST grafts cost €9400, let's check the average of FUE for some of the most famous and reputable doctors "who ironically are never accused of being greedy or over priced:

1) Dr. Bisanga: €5 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost €8000 to €9000
2) Dr. Rahal: $8 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $12,800 to $14,400
3) Dr. Feller: $10 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $16,000 to $18,000
4) Dr. Bauman: $15 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $24,000 to $27,000
5) Dr. Umar: $7 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $11,200 to $12,600
6) Dr. Shapiro: $7 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $11,200 to $12,600

(i pologize if any of the above prices were changed recently)

I know some doctors reduce the price per graft if you go above 2000 or 2500 but still they all seem to be in the same range and we are just talking about 1600-1800 grafts here.

So i don't really see why gho haters make it sound like gho is greedy and his procedure is the most expensive in the world right now.

And i don't see why gho should share his technique with other doctors freely, he has been working hard for it and many of others did nothing bad doubting and bad mouthing him.

QFT (10 char)

[25 going on 65]

OK, this is going to get a lot of heat, but this subject keeps coming up so here is why people see Gho as greedy and untrustworthy.....and this is not directed to any post or poster, this is a completely general statement:

Because this guy knowingly, blatantly scammed hair loss sufferers for years. And now we're supposed to think, without extraordinary evidence (which the saying goes, is necessary for extraordinary claims), that the guy has had a change of heart and now wants to make up for all the damage he did.
This is a man who had hundreds and hundreds and HUNDREDS of days to wake up and say, "hey, maybe taking advantage of desperate hair loss sufferers who are devastated by a disfiguring condition isn't the most appropriate way for me to get rich." Yet he never once did. He woke up every morning and went on with his fraud.
You know what finally forced him to stop? Surprise: he got caught. And his clinic went bankrupt. AFTER leaving a long line of patients in his wake who not only overpaid for results that were weak as hell, but who did so on the notion that they would get donor regeneration, which they never did. Those are human beings who to this day, in some cases more than ten years later, are STILL waiting to see that donor hair regrow.
Those people could have been any of us--they could have been Maradona, chrisis, UK, 2020, myself, or any of the people on this forum who want nothing more than a solution to the problem that hurts them every single day.

So excuse those of us who find it very difficult to trust this publicly-exposed con artist anymore. I hope our mistrust is misplaced, I really truly hope he's put the puzzle together and that all of us can get transplants without having to sacrifice more than 20% of our donor at a time. But until I am 100% sure this isn't just another moneymaking scam, like splitting follicular units, I have no sympathy for Gho and very little reason to put faith in him.

My 2 cents. Now I yield the floor to everyone who probably wants to tear me a new one.

[JJJJrS]

But how do we do that? 10 years ago Dr Gho was making the same claims and nobody could get to the bottom of his treatment back then, now he is making similar claims and its the same thing - he will probably carry on like this until he retires.

For one, people should ask Spencer, practically the only consumer advocate in the hair loss world, to get involved with this. The more people that ask, the more willing he'll be to look into this, talk to Gho and find a way to get some evidence.

There are a lot of people, including active posters on hairloss forums, who are booked to have procedures in the near future. A few of them have even offered to get their results examined. Get one of them in touch with a dermatologist, take clear before and after pictures of the donor and recipient and count the hairs. It won't answer all questions about HST but it will prove whether the procedure works or not. Anyone arguing otherwise is nitpicking or making excuses.

[Kiwi]

FUE was not shared.. Woods wanted to charge docs fot it but they found out how to do it without paying him... So it seems like no doctor is able to find out how HST is done yet.
Plus, HST price is not really expensive as some skeptics make it sound to be. It's in the range with FUE.
For example 1600-1800 HST grafts cost €9400, let's check the average of FUE for some of the most famous and reputable doctors "who ironically are never accused of being greedy or over priced:

1) Dr. Bisanga: €5 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost €8000 to €9000
2) Dr. Rahal: $8 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $12,800 to $14,400
3) Dr. Feller: $10 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $16,000 to $18,000
4) Dr. Bauman: $15 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $24,000 to $27,000
5) Dr. Umar: $7 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $11,200 to $12,600
6) Dr. Shapiro: $7 per graft so 1600-1800 would cost $11,200 to $12,600

(i pologize if any of the above prices were changed recently)

I know some doctors reduce the price per graft if you go above 2000 or 2500 but still they all seem to be in the same range and we are just talking about 1600-1800 grafts here.

So i don't really see why gho haters make it sound like gho is greedy and his procedure is the most expensive in the world right now.

And i don't see why gho should share his technique with other doctors freely, he has been working hard for it and many of others did nothing bad doubting and bad mouthing him.

Bit my chubby looser. I suppose you think its okay for USA to have guns too - I can't wait for the UN to snatch that "right" away from you guys. Anyway...

If woods patented the FUE technique, which he didnt, and I don't care "why" he didnt, it only matters that it didnt happen, but if he did, then it would have been ILLEGAL (in lands with idiotic douche bag laws) for any other HT doc to perform that technique without paying him!!!

Its not cool. Out dated laws and douche baggery have kept us baldies suffering for too long.

Screw Gho and screw skinmedica for taking Histogen for court and delaying my peace of mind.

You can believe whatever you like. But you're still wrong.

[gmonasco]

Get one of them in touch with a dermatologist, take clear before and after pictures of the donor and recipient and count the hairs. It won't answer all questions about HST but it will prove whether the procedure works or not.

That's a start, but a substantive analysis of practicality of HST would require much more than that. You'd need to perform examinations of both the transplanted and donor hairs across time to determine how well they grow. (Are they as thick as the original hairs? Do they cycle like the original hairs?) And you'd have to perform the same types of count and quality analyses on hairs transected multiple times to determine whether the notion of "unlimited donor supply" is really feasible.

[JJJJrS]

I think all it tells us is that people are desperate and will spend their entire life savings on this greedy douche bag.

Screw Gho if he aint going to share his technique freely with other docs like FUT and FUE were shared with him

Its why this world is so screwed up. Greed.

We're only limiting our own options by saying screw Gho.

There has to be a more concentrated effort to prove whether HST works. If we can get that conclusive evidence that it works, then I'm almost certain other clinics will look into it and eventually start offering it. Gho has offered to share the procedure for a $50k fee that includes training and necessary equipment. That would be a success for those who want the procedure offered in more than one place, particularly in the hands of the more artistically talented doctors.

For those who don't trust Gho and are skeptical, like 25 going on 65, then there are even more reasons to push an investigation into how well HST works. The waiting lists at his clinic are huge and he's easily getting more attention than any other surgeon in the industry. If you believe he's conning people, ignoring the procedure isn't going to help anybody.

And I agree that greed and ethics are major problems in general, but it's even worse in this sleazy industry.