Debunking HASCI´s regeneration claim - an open letter.

[didi]

iron man

failed extractions are real and take around 40% of all extractions.

what you mistakenly believe to be regeneration is in fact failed extractions growing+other half of split FUs...



HST is dead...stick a fork in it...I know it hurts irony boy

[didi]

iron man


you are the only one left who STILL believie in hair multiplication by dr coen gho?


cant you see everyone is switching to nigam/mwamba/Wesley camp.



I recommend you do the same.

[534623]

iron man


you are the only one left who STILL believie in hair multiplication by dr coen gho?


cant you see everyone is switching to nigam/mwamba/Wesley camp.

They all can "switch" wherever they want - NOTHING of all these "camps" will help neither them nor you - at least not within the coming 5 - 10 years or so.


BUT ...

I will try to "support" each and every "legit" doc out there with "good intentions" to get 2 hairs from 1 procedures more popular in general and -the most important thing- to get it improved and finally well WORKING at all, because a real well-working 2 follicles from 1 procedure can be for MANY guys out there considered as real "cure".

[caddarik79]

BUT ...

I will try to "support" each and every "legit" doc out there with "good intentions" to get 2 hairs from 1 procedures more popular in general and -the most important thing- to get it improved and finally well WORKING at all, because a real well-working 2 follicles from 1 procedure can be for MANY guys out there considered as real "cure".[/QUOTE]



I like this very last comment, me too, I'll promote docs, legit, doing this.
If Gho becomes less controversed, I might even really spread it in my private life bubble and encourage hair loss sufferers I know and who are still making it a tabou to talk about!!!

[gc83uk]

A good argument presented by Arashi, but there are so many variables and too many unknowns to make any definite conclusions unfortunately, despite my best efforts with the photos and Arashi's analysis, the job is just too big.

It maybe a factor that re extracting numerous times from a previously extracted donor will render slightly reduced regeneration results, if I remember correctly Dr Gho said as much!

Or perhaps I should reword that, when the hairs regrow in the donor, they can grow back twisted in a slightly unusual configuration or more splayed out, which is obviously going to make it more difficult to extract on 2nd and 3rd passes. On the 1st procedure I really don't remember hearing more extractions than clicks, contrary to c5000 and Arashi.

It could be so, that on the 1st pass of my 1st HST the regeneration was indeed 85% (with no failed extractions anyway or a small amount) with latter procedures being a lower figure. It's a plausible theory!

Also Arashi and c5000 may have had huge amounts of failed extractions, which they have both mentioned, but they may well have regeneration of 85%+ from the successful extractions. And of course if you were to analyse every extraction of the donor it may well give you 95%+
Do we know any different?

Arashi has mentioned my donor is starting to look thin, granted! But it should also be said that my donor area was extremely limited to start with. You can't argue with that fact. That fact was told by even an ISHRS Dr to me. 2500 grafts he said. HDC said the same. One Dr told me I would be best having a scalp reduction and then doing a transplant.

I've had just under 5000 extracted now with Hasci. Way more than I thought ever possible. As you can see I'm trying to remain positive.

[Arashi]

Arashi has mentioned my donor is starting to look thin, granted! But it should also be said that my donor area was extremely limited to start with. You can't argue with that fact. That fact was told by even an ISHRS Dr to me. 2500 grafts he said. HDC said the same. One Dr told me I would be best having a scalp reduction and then doing a transplant.

I've had just under 5000 extracted now with Hasci. Way more than I thought ever possible. As you can see I'm trying to remain positive.

GC, your donor indeed wasn't too good to begin with. But keep in mind when comparing HASCI's graft to regular FUE grafts that HASCI seems to transplant way less hair than with a regular FUE. Based on what we've seen so far, recipients seem to contain mostly singles. So 5000 HASCI grafts might very well correlate to 2500 FUE grafts.

[gc83uk]

GC, yes your donor wasn't too good to begin with. But keep in mind when comparing HASCI's graft to regular FUE grafts that HASCI seems to transplant way less hair than with a regular FUE. Based on what we've seen so far, recipients seem to contain mostly singles. So 5000 HASCI grafts might very well correlate to 2500 FUE grafts.

No mate, closer to 25% less of recipient hairs compared to traditional FUE, not 50%.

If my avg hair count in the recip is 1.5 then it would have to be an avg of 3 hairs in the recip.

And they are telling me to come back next year.

[Arashi]

No mate, closer to 25% less of recipient hairs compared to traditional FUE, not 50%.

If my avg hair count in the recip is 1.5 then it would have to be an avg of 3 hairs in the recip.

And they are telling me to come back next year.

I'm basing my statement on the fact that the average hair/graft is 2.5 in general and if a hasci result has more singles than doubles, the average at hasci might be about 1.3 (or at least lower than 1.5), so that's about half.

However it might be an interesting thing to analyze a part of unsafe zone on your scalp that was never used, count an average hair/graft number and see if it's any different from recipient.

[gc83uk]

I'm basing my statement on the fact that the average hair/graft is 2.5 in general and if a hasci result has more singles than doubles, the average at hasci might be about 1.3 (or at least lower than 1.5), so that's about half.

However it might be an interesting thing to analyze a part of unsafe zone on your scalp that was never used, count an average hair/graft number and see if it's any different from recipient.

First thing the HDC guy said to me was, "wow you have more singles than doubles in the safe area". My heart sank.

[Arashi]

First thing the HDC guy said to me was, "wow you have more singles than doubles in the safe area". My heart sank.

But isnt that because they harvested that area a lot already ? If I take a look at your non safe area (your side of the crown area for example) I don't see many singles. I see a lot of doubles and even tripples. When I look at your recipient I see mostly singles. So that would explain why you could get so many grafts.

[gc83uk]

But isnt that because they harvested that area a lot already ? If I take a look at your non safe area (your side of the crown area for example) I don't see many singles. I see a lot of doubles and even tripples. When I look at your recipient I see mostly singles. So that would explain why you could get so many grafts.

No mate, this was before I had any transplants. This was about 3 years ago, he used one of those camera things.

I've just checked some picture just now too, if you look for example just below my scar which hasn't been harvested before on the set of photos with the marker pen you can see as many singles as doubles, well I can anyway.

[Arashi]

No mate, this was before I had any transplants. This was about 3 years ago, he used one of those camera things.

I've just checked some picture just now too, if you look for example just below my scar which hasn't been harvested before on the set of photos with the marker pen you can see as many singles as doubles, well I can anyway.

Just look at this area, aside of your crown: http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=1z5h...5#.UjI6F8a1HiQ

You see tons of doubles and tripples and an occasional single. Now look at your recipient. You see mostly singles.

Of course, it might theoretically be possible that somehow in your safe area mostly singles grew, while in other area's doubles and tripples. But does that seem likely ?

We know from analyzing the 2 50 graft tests that HASCI just transplants mainly singles, even if a donor contains enough doubles and tripples. To me that explains why you could get so many grafts.

[gc83uk]

Just look at this area, aside of your crown: http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=1z5h...5#.UjI6F8a1HiQ

You see tons of doubles and tripples and an occasional single. Now look at your recipient. You see mostly singles.

Of course, it might theoretically be possible that somehow in your safe area mostly singles grew, while in other area's doubles and tripples. But does that seem likely ?

We know from analyzing the 2 50 graft tests that HASCI just transplants mainly singles, even if a donor contains enough doubles and tripples. To me that explains why you could get so many grafts.

Look as unlikely as it sounds it is what it is. When I used to spend like an hour a day doing my hair, with the hair piece, wasting my life away, I would combine it with hair thickener. I always had to spray hair thickener in the back just to make it look as equal as the rest.

The areas near my crown and edges of the scared area was always the thickest as per the image you just linked.

I don't know why, but the area was thinner and seems to have been backed up what the other Dr's had said at the time and the camera thing. I seen it on the big projector.

[Arashi]

Look as unlikely as it sounds it is what it is. When I used to spend like an hour a day doing my hair, with the hair piece, wasting my life away, I would combine it with hair thickener. I always had to spray hair thickener in the back just to make it look as equal as the rest.

The areas near my crown and edges of the scared area was always the thickest as per the image you just linked.

I don't know why, but the area was thinner and seems to have been backed up what the other Dr's had said at the time and the camera thing. I seen it on the big projector.

Ok. Maybe another explanation then why that other doctor thought you could only get 2500 is that he didn't recognize the fact that your donor had mostly singles ? Maybe if he had recognized that fact, he would have figured it would have been possible to harvest 5000 singles from your donor ?

[gc83uk]

Ok. Maybe another explanation then why that other doctor thought you could only get 2500 is that he didn't recognize the fact that your donor had mostly singles ? Maybe if he had recognized that fact, he would have figured it would have been possible to harvest 5000 singles from your donor ?

Perhaps!

But we're talking about 2 Dr's here, both giving the same figures, seems unlikely that they wouldn't try that before suggesting a scalp reduction. It wasn't a 5 minute consultation.

To be fair I think the HDC doctor was exaggerating slightly, but take it from me as fact I had a larger number of singles in the donor area than the average. I can't say anymore than that. We're going off on a tangent with this anyway.