Gaz (Gc83uk) can you give us an update.

[Arashi]

I am more and more tempted to stay the longest with my first one, and observe other people's result...and read Nigam and Gho threads... all the rest is bullshit...

That's what I'm thinking of too. Wait till the results from the HASCI 50 grafts test are in and the one from Dr Nigams and then make a decision on what to do next.

[Arashi]

but people don't go for HT to shave to the bone!!!
If so, just accept your baldness and shave the horseshoe every f*ckin' two days ;-)

That's why I was hoping Kristel would reply with "Dear Arashi don't you worry, when you wear your hair at about 5 mm, like you do, then you can have 6 HST's without any noticeable thinning in donor, don't you worry".

Hehe. But nothing ... Well maybe she's just busy and/or on a holiday or whatever but man ... all this lack of info after that "max 3 HST's statement"is not good for my mood...

[caddarik79]

Anyway, looking to the investment, I think I will let you guyz take it, and observe your results and limitations and go for it (hoping that meanwhile, some improvements or other stuffs will come)...

Life will suck with a small procedure every year and the anxiety over the result or its limitation...


I am more and more tempted to stay the longest with my first one, and observe other people's result...and read Nigam and Gho threads... all the rest is bullshit...

if one or another brings the 1 hair becomes 10... I ****ing fly for it...

[didi]

its safe to say that 80% regeneration rate is BS,

if that's true then everybody can have 10 000 grafts and lose only 2000.

even the most fkd up cases can afford to lose 2 000...

and 10 000 grafts(that's more than jotronic had) will transform nw6 to good head of hair


another thing people forgettin about is that you cant compare 1800 grafts from gho to any other dr such as dr Lorenzo without knowing how many hairs per grafts were there.

do the math and you will see huge difference in total number of hairs which will explain everything

what was the point doing GC hst analysis when people don't wanna believe in it and prefer to believe in BS hasci marketing which doesn't translate in practice.

just to remind you, we found real regeneration was 65% and thats assuming there was no failed extractions, we saw james had huge number of failed extractions. hasci is not helping to put this confusion to an end.

[caddarik79]

but people don't go for HT to shave to the bone!!!
If so, just accept your baldness and shave the horseshoe every f*ckin' two days ;-)

[Arashi]

When I read your posts, sometimes I think Kristel is speaking Russian or
Mandarin Chinese or something to you ...

It's just that she says very little without explaining her words (like why she's advising 3 HST's max). And when I ask for a more detailed explanation I just don't get any response. You can say all you want about Dr Nigams but at least he takes the time to respond in a very detailed way and always very prompt It wouldn't hurt a bit if HASCI would put some more effort into their communication.

[534623]

Yeah, agreed and that's indeed pretty much what HASCI's saying too, if I understood Kristel's words correctly.

When I read your posts, sometimes I think Kristel is speaking Russian or
Mandarin Chinese or something to you ...

[Arashi]

In simple words, depending on your donor area quality (amount of available grafts etc), after around 3-4 HST procedures, you have to to come to a decision:

1) Do you ever intend to shave your hair down to the bone?
2) Will you rather always wear your hair in the donor area somewhat longer?

Remember - a lot depends on your donor area quality. The lesser the grafts in you donor area in general, the earlier you have to stop with HST procedures IF you intend always to shave your head down to the bone.

Yeah, agreed and that's indeed pretty much what HASCI's saying too, if I understood Kristel's words correctly.

[Arashi]

Anyway, if this were my end result, yes, then I'd be disappointed. Although it looks 'acceptable' from some slightly more distance ( http://www3.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/13206921.jpg ) looks a LOT better than my pre-op situation and I should still expect 35% to come in the next months, it's just too thin to look natural. But again, that's just the downside of hair transplants in general. You need 50 grafts/cm2 for a natural result and if HASCI only advises max 3 HST's, then that's going to be next to impossible (unless of course you get everything into your hairline/temples but that's just plain stupid)

[534623]

I was planning to go for way more than 3 surgeries and now all of a sudden HASCI says they advise a max of 3 ... It's quite disappointing !

I also wonder what's so "magic" behind this issue ...

CALCUALTION

When HSCI is talking about 3 HST procedures - that's in most cases around 5,000 HST grafts - right?

So what "exactly" would be the HST result IN THE DONOR AREA after around 5000 grafts?

Simply a loss of around 1000 (+/-) grafts - right?

And now try to imagine ...

http://www.fileden.com/files/2012/3/15/3278666/Upper-Strip-Area-Day-3.jpg

... how my personal donor area would look like, IF none of the extraction sites, which you can clearly see in the photo, would produce new hairs again.

Right - if I would wear my hair somewhat LONGER, sure, the density would be of course somewhat thinner, but NOT REALLY NOTICABLE TO THE NAKED EYE.

But SHAVED down to the bone (like Dean Saunders) - ohhh, you would notice the loss (besides round and white dots) a lot ...

In simple words, depending on your donor area quality (amount of available grafts etc), after around 3-4 HST procedures, you have to to come to a decision:

1) Do you ever intend to shave your hair down to the bone?
2) Will you rather always wear your hair in the donor area somewhat longer?

Remember - a lot depends on your donor area quality. The lesser the grafts in you donor area in general, the earlier you have to stop with HST procedures IF you intend always to shave your head down to the bone.

[Arashi]

Earnestly - what the hell did you expect from 1800 HST grafts??

This is a good remark. Oftentimes you see people talk about a 'great' or 'disappointing' result. But doesn't it all depend on how many grafts you got and in which area ? I mean if you got 1800 grafts spread all over the top of your head, and all grafts survived, the result can look 'disappointing' while in fact it was just the best possible result (all grafts survived). Hence I think we should think of graft survival in order to judge a result.

Hence, I just looked up a picture, just after the crusts came off (8 days post surgery). I hadn't lost much (if any at all) grafts then: http://www2.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/13206710.jpg

This is now, 6 1/2 month after surgery: http://www4.picturepush.com/photo/a/...g/13206707.jpg

It's a little hard to compare maybe since my hair is now longer. I'll shave it down to the size of the first picture in a few weeks (or maybe next month) and then I can do a really good comparison.

However at first glance I'd say that if indeed I get about 35% more (which is to be expected on average after 6 1/2 months), I'd say the result is going to be pretty decent.

However it also shows the limitation of 1600 grafts for such a big area (I've gotten both temples filled up, lowered the hairline AND densed up the area between the temples). And that's exactly why I was planning to go for way more than 3 surgeries and now all of a sudden HASCI says they advise a max of 3 ... It's quite disappointing !

[caddarik79]

Nothing is "weird" here, because what do you know about such patient's donor area quality, number of "available grafts", hair characteristics etc??

For example - my own donor situation, 3 days after just 1400 HST extractions:

http://www.fileden.com/files/2012/3/15/3278666/Upper-Strip-Area-Day-3.jpg

Okay, and now try to imagine (just TRY to imagine!!) around 10,000 to 13,000 normal FUE extractions in my personal donor area - I wouldn't have something like a "donor area" anymore thereafter!! My "donor area" would just consist of slick bald scar tissue thereafter!

Yes IM, I know, I tought of that, but still, HST in general should bring 3 times more than FUE...
I know you had a FUT, but the wassup case of Cole for example, reached around 8000, not shocking in his donor... if I was transfering him to Gho, I would expect a 16.000 possible...

I have some points but don't elude mines, 80-85% regeneration should really guarantee a full head ... with numerous procedures and taking it step by step every year...but still...

LOL, and yes, your drawing is kind of putting the light on what we are talking about... but let's be honest, there is something wrong in their communication...

[534623]

For example - my own donor situation, 3 days after just 1400 HST extractions:

http://www.fileden.com/files/2012/3/15/3278666/Upper-Strip-Area-Day-3.jpg

Okay, and now try to imagine (just TRY to imagine!!) around 10,000 to 13,000 normal FUE extractions in my personal donor area - I wouldn't have something like a "donor area" anymore thereafter!! My "donor area" would just consist of slick bald scar tissue thereafter!

[Arashi]

Whatever, I'll post a picture too, hold on, going to shoot one.

[Arashi]

My hair from 6 months post op to 9 did not evolve a lot...in some mirrors it looks alright, but in day light or under a spotlight, it's not very convincing, especially when you pay 9400 euros for that.

Can you maybe post a recent picture Caddarick ? Would love to see it.

If my hairs don't progress after this point (6 1/2 month) I'm going to be quite disappointed as well. However, like said, I do see quite a lot of extremely thin (=new) hairs so I'm still hopeful.