Going for HST now! Need some feedback.

[gc83uk]

Thanx guys!

I just spoke to Hasci and they don't think they will be able to do more than about 1500 grafts during my second treatment either.
Even though I suggested they do it over two days or whatever it may take.

Gc83uk, what is the most they extracted from your donor during a single HST?
Because I think your donor was kind of in the same shape as mine.
I can't believe it really isn't possible to get at least around 2000 grafts per HST! :/

1800 on the last HST mate. (over 2 days) 1300 on day 1 and 500 on day 2, half day!

If you push on the morning for them to do more they probably will. Just tell them you really want 2000 and willing to pay the extra, assuming you are.

Did they give any reasons for not going past 1500? I don't understand how they can come to this number without seeing you again since the 1st procedure. Are you willing to extract some grafts from outside the safe area, that might be able to boost your numbers.

[censur]

Thanx guys!

I just spoke to Hasci and they don't think they will be able to do more than about 1500 grafts during my second treatment either.
Even though I suggested they do it over two days or whatever it may take.

Gc83uk, what is the most they extracted from your donor during a single HST?
Because I think your donor was kind of in the same shape as mine.
I can't believe it really isn't possible to get at least around 2000 grafts per HST! :/

[inspects]

censur,

I think your hair looks much better. Like others said it takes many grafts to fill in the amount of hair you lost. I had a transplant in August of last year, so I'm at about 15 months post op. I still had a few hairs returning after the 8th month mark, so you may still have some on their way.

Mine looked similar to your original photos, it took about 3000 grafts to make me look like I have a full head of hair.

I didn't have a Gho procedure, but I'm very happy, you should be too with only about half as many I had moved. My doctor concentrated on the front and top, my crown was about like yours too, but I only had a couple hundred grafts placed in the crown. He said stay on propecia for a year and see how the crown fills in, if it even does. It did and I'm thrilled about that.

I been on propecia and rogaine since the procedure, my crown has filled in really well with just the few grafts. I didn't read all the posts in this thread but was wondering if you are taking anything to help fight further loss with possibly gaining some ground?

I also take biotin, I'm not sure what grows faster, my hair or my fingernails, but they both grow much faster when taking biotin. I was taking 10,000 mg per day for a few months after the transplant, now I'm taking 2,000 mg. I also use rogaine shampoo daily. I'm not sure if that helps much or at all, but it doesn't have the possible destructive chemicals many shampoos do.

Anyway, I think if you have another procedure you'll be really much more impressed and satisfied, its amazing what another 1,500 grafts make. I was astonished with the 2800 or more that probably survived how much better my hair looks now.

Good luck to you, I hope for the best, and then some. Keep us posted.

Dale

[cocacola]

i dont think ur crown got worse, it was already pretty much bald. For sure looks better, but not dense enough to grow out to this lenght. However, you could try going for another one.

[censur]

Here is a new update, photos taken the 6:th of december 2013, which is about 7,5 month after my HST.

When I touch the hair in my front, I can feel that it's thicker than before.
I do think the front would start to look good after another 1500 grafts in the same area. Right now the density is of course still very low.

My crown is becoming seriously bald though, but that is no surprise.
I wish I could do a much larger treatment if I go for HASCI a second time. Somewhere around 2000-2500 grafts at least.
Otherwise it's just gonna take so depressingly long to get any SERIOUS overall results.

[censur]

Hi Censur,

A few things really...

1) I really don't think you have Dupa. I actually think the back of your head, entire donor area, is looking very nice indeed, you have more hair in your donor than before I started so I don't see any problems there.

2) What cocacola said: "I definitely see an improvement when we compare October to baseline. However, ur hairloss is not mild and the area where you put 1500 grafts is large. Therefore you cant expect to have huge density. I would stay positive, see how your donor is doing and perhaps consider doing another one or two."

3) What Gandolf said: "Given the extent of your hairloss at 30 years old, you seem destined to eventually lose all your native hair on top. I would imagine you have other males in your family with NW 6/7? This is significant because, some experience mild/moderate hairloss early on but are able to keep a good bit of hair on top of their heads and their loss stops progressing either through genetics and/or propecia use. Basically, whatever you plan, you have to take into consideration that you will likely lose everything you've got on top and have to think long term about how your hair transplant will age."

4) You've had 1535 grafts and from my calculations you'll get about 2150 implanted hairs on your head in total. The yield for HST is exceptionally high, so don't worry about it being a failure, I don't think it's ever happened and from the photos there is a visible difference already. There will be a bit more growth to come yet I would think. Most of the growth happens between 3 to 6 months, but there is always a little bit extra in the later months.

5)Final point, the area you've implanted into looks approximately 100cm2, correct me if I'm wrong? 1535 grafts into an area that large is only giving you 15 grafts per cm2. My advice is to go for another HST and implant in the same area to get it closer to 35 grafts per cm2. You really need it to be closer to 50 grafts per cm2 to give you something half decent!

I sound like I work for Hasci, I can assure you I don't

There is no harm getting a second opinion from a top FUE surgeon and ask them what they think you can potentially have done / and what you can expect from say 3000 grafts and ask them about the dupa.

Keep in touch.

Thanks a lot mate! Really helpful.

Yes, I guess my only real option here is to go for another HST.
When do you think is optimal to do it again? Is 9 months okay to wait or should I wait a full year?

The thing is, this time I really can't settle for just 1500 grafts, it's just too little and I will waste too many of my valuable years waiting for this to improve. :/
Do you think it could be somehow possible to extract something like 2000 or 2500 grafts with HST?
The last time they said they wouldn't do it, at least not on my first HST. Have their policy changed anything since that? And maaaybe it could be a little bit different when I come for my second HST and not my first?
I guess they CAN do it but they WON'T because of possibly more donor damage than otherwise? What is your take on this?

I can also tell you that I am in touch with dr Mwamba.
I am looking to fly to him for a consultation as well.
I would of course be willing to do a transplant with him in the future if he could estimate at least SOME growth in the donor (although not perhaps guarantee anything).

[gc83uk]

Gc83uk, what do you say about my six month update? I would be really happy to get some more feedback from you because you have the most experience of HASCI.
I am now really wondering what my next step should be!

Since there are no other real alternatives on the market yet, pretty much my only option is to go for HASCI again I guess. If I should try any more hair transplants at all.
I must say I am a bit disappointed about the result in the recipient. I though I was gonna get at least a bit more change than I actually got.
Do you guys even see a significant improvement compared to my before pictures? Could something actually have gone wrong with the procedure, resulting in a low percentage of grafts actually growing in the recipient??

I have been thinking a little about this technique as well:

http://www.thebaldtruth.com/hair-loss/spencer-kobren-takes-a-closer-look-at-scalp-micropigmentation/

Micro pigmentation that isn't permanent could perhaps be good for me to use for example in the areas in my neck where the hair is thinner and on my sides? Or perhaps even on my crown, where I am very thin, almost bald??
I don't know it that could work even with about the hair length as I have now, or only with really short hair.

I am thinking that perhaps a good combination would be to go for another HST now and put those grafts in the crown. (The other parts of the hair I can pretty much cover with toppik, but the crown is to thin to even cover at all)
And then combine this second HST with non-permanent scalp micro pigmentation in my thin areas?

I really, really think alot of about this and feel bad about it. Would do almost anything to improve my situation.
Thank you guys.

(Regarding the issue about me possibly having DUPA, I don't think I have it. I will try to check it up with some doctor though.)

Hi Censur,

A few things really...

1) I really don't think you have Dupa. I actually think the back of your head, entire donor area, is looking very nice indeed, you have more hair in your donor than before I started so I don't see any problems there.

2) What cocacola said: "I definitely see an improvement when we compare October to baseline. However, ur hairloss is not mild and the area where you put 1500 grafts is large. Therefore you cant expect to have huge density. I would stay positive, see how your donor is doing and perhaps consider doing another one or two."

3) What Gandolf said: "Given the extent of your hairloss at 30 years old, you seem destined to eventually lose all your native hair on top. I would imagine you have other males in your family with NW 6/7? This is significant because, some experience mild/moderate hairloss early on but are able to keep a good bit of hair on top of their heads and their loss stops progressing either through genetics and/or propecia use. Basically, whatever you plan, you have to take into consideration that you will likely lose everything you've got on top and have to think long term about how your hair transplant will age."

4) You've had 1535 grafts and from my calculations you'll get about 2150 implanted hairs on your head in total. The yield for HST is exceptionally high, so don't worry about it being a failure, I don't think it's ever happened and from the photos there is a visible difference already. There will be a bit more growth to come yet I would think. Most of the growth happens between 3 to 6 months, but there is always a little bit extra in the later months.

5)Final point, the area you've implanted into looks approximately 100cm2, correct me if I'm wrong? 1535 grafts into an area that large is only giving you 15 grafts per cm2. My advice is to go for another HST and implant in the same area to get it closer to 35 grafts per cm2. You really need it to be closer to 50 grafts per cm2 to give you something half decent!

I sound like I work for Hasci, I can assure you I don't

There is no harm getting a second opinion from a top FUE surgeon and ask them what they think you can potentially have done / and what you can expect from say 3000 grafts and ask them about the dupa.

Keep in touch.

[censur]

Gc83uk, what do you say about my six month update? I would be really happy to get some more feedback from you because you have the most experience of HASCI.
I am now really wondering what my next step should be!

Since there are no other real alternatives on the market yet, pretty much my only option is to go for HASCI again I guess. If I should try any more hair transplants at all.
I must say I am a bit disappointed about the result in the recipient. I though I was gonna get at least a bit more change than I actually got.
Do you guys even see a significant improvement compared to my before pictures? Could something actually have gone wrong with the procedure, resulting in a low percentage of grafts actually growing in the recipient??

I have been thinking a little about this technique as well:

http://www.thebaldtruth.com/hair-loss/spencer-kobren-takes-a-closer-look-at-scalp-micropigmentation/

Micro pigmentation that isn't permanent could perhaps be good for me to use for example in the areas in my neck where the hair is thinner and on my sides? Or perhaps even on my crown, where I am very thin, almost bald??
I don't know it that could work even with about the hair length as I have now, or only with really short hair.

I am thinking that perhaps a good combination would be to go for another HST now and put those grafts in the crown. (The other parts of the hair I can pretty much cover with toppik, but the crown is to thin to even cover at all)
And then combine this second HST with non-permanent scalp micro pigmentation in my thin areas?

I really, really think alot of about this and feel bad about it. Would do almost anything to improve my situation.
Thank you guys.

(Regarding the issue about me possibly having DUPA, I don't think I have it. I will try to check it up with some doctor though.)

[clarence]

censur

www---.---baldingblog---.---com/2006/05/19/how-fast-can-dupa-take-effect/

There's more info on that site. His answer to how to assess the situation is to go to a "physician specializing in hair transplant surgery"

Either way, Dr. Rassmann does have a lot of information on his site. He won't diagnose you over the internet, but he might offer some speculation of why your neck seems to be lacking in density, if you drop him a question maybe with permission to post a (pre-op) pic on his blog. As long as your query with him doesn't have anything to do with HST or the post-op HST situation of course; he's not a fan of HST.

[censur]

This talk about possible DUPA really got me worried now. :/
Here is another new picture of my neck.

You know, my only hope is that I will be able to pay a huge amount of money within a couple of years to transplant something close to a total of 5000 grafts with a possible donor multiplying technique such as dr Nigams etc.
But if I would have DUPA, I won't even be able to do this even if Nigams technique works, or what?
Am I just totally scr*wed whatever donor multiplying technique that may come out in the next few years?? Will even my transplanted hairs fall out?

I would really appreciate if someone could help me out a little bit more here. :/
How bad is it actually if I would have DUPA?
And should I go and find out if I have it or not? How could I do that?
Through a dermatologist? They don't seem to know a whole lot about hairloss!

Just when I thought things couldn't get any worse and I still had some hope of fixing this problem through several hair transplants with future improved donor techniques...

[clarence]

Oh, I don't know actually.
It has been a little bit thinner even on the back of the head for quite some time I think.
If you look at the before pictures it looks about the same back there right?

Hmmm... is it DUPA? Or do some people just come with this density? I think one more HST would start to make you look rather strange as far as the neck is concerned... even if the regeneration turns out to fulfil HASCI's claims.

[censur]

Sorry if this has already been discussed, but censur it looks like your thinning in the back of your head aswell (safe zone)? Surprised Gho agreed to an op if you have dupa or something...

Or has it always been like that?

Anyways, definately see a decent improvement in your 6 month update and Im sure itll get better at the 9 month/12 month mark. But you cant expect a ton with only 1500 grafts as you were/are quite diffuse.

Oh, I don't know actually.
It has been a little bit thinner even on the back of the head for quite some time I think.
If you look at the before pictures it looks about the same back there right?

HASCI didn't say anything about dupa or something. Neither did dr Bisanga that I had a consultation with before going to HASCI.
Do you think there is a serious risk of that and how would that change everything for me? :/

What do you other guys say about this and about my results in general?
I hope gc83uk, Arashi and other forum experts have time to give me some heads up!

[LMS]

Sorry if this has already been discussed, but censur it looks like your thinning in the back of your head aswell (safe zone)? Surprised Gho agreed to an op if you have dupa or something...

Or has it always been like that?

Anyways, definately see a decent improvement in your 6 month update and Im sure itll get better at the 9 month/12 month mark. But you cant expect a ton with only 1500 grafts as you were/are quite diffuse.

[cocacola]

Ok here is my opinion.

I definitely see an improvement when we compare October to baseline. However, ur hairloss is not mild and the area where you put 1500 grafts is large. Therefore you cant expect to have huge density. I would stay positive, see how your donor is doing and perhaps consider doing another one or two.

[Artista]

Hello Censur, The old adage "Patience is a Virtue" means so much in regards to HTs.
My friend I can see that your scalp is looking very good.
The great fact about this is it is still progressing. In a years time you'll be even more satisfied .
Thank you so much for sharing your HT experience with us all.