Histogen – TrichoScan analysis vs. side-by-side comparison

[gutted]

In fact, we ARE talking here about their Phase I/II (photo)results:

http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT01501617

I think "Phase I/II" means that they, in addition, injected again into the same area after 6 weeks.

And here IS one of their (a few days ago) provided "decent macro photos":

http://ww1.prweb.com/prfiles/2012/10/18/10032346/S102M%20-%2024wk.jpg

To me, it seems that especially the temples of this guy look even densier in the BEFORE photo - what doesn't reflect their claims in their PR-web article.

the guy looks old = possible major fibrosis buildup, that will take quite some time to fix.

lets see a macro photo of a treated person who is in the early stage of hair loss.

there is some improvement, but i suspect those in the earlier stages will respond better.

[534623]

The problem is this was a Phase I study with a 2cm2 treatment area,
making it very difficult to provide a decent macro photo.

We have to wait till Phase II ...

In fact, we ARE talking here about their Phase I/II (photo)results:

http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT01501617

I think "Phase I/II" means that they, in addition, injected again into the same area after 6 weeks.

And here IS one of their (a few days ago) provided "decent macro photos":

http://ww1.prweb.com/prfiles/2012/10/18/10032346/S102M%20-%2024wk.jpg

To me, it seems that especially the temples of this guy look even densier in the BEFORE photo - what doesn't reflect their claims in their PR-web article.

[Kirby_]

Sorry to interject so abruptly, but is Aderans similar to Histogen, ie injections of growth factors? I've heard practically nothing about Aderans apart from the name since I've been following these forums.

[Desmond84]

They photos provided by Histogen are poor. They're dishing out all this amazing stats but the pictures show nothing like what they are claiming. Whats worrying is that surely they would use their best before / after picture to show obvious improvement?

They've recently updated everyone about their ever improving injections, but there is no photo evidence. I would have thought it would bring in investors aswell.

"with subjects age 40-59 seeing cosmetically significant results beginning at 12 weeks, including a mean increase of 39% in terminal hairs and 19.4% in total hair count in this age group in the current trial"

39% would be quite noticable, even without counting hairs. Prove it histogen! I suspecting they are distorting things to pull in the money. Lets hope they show us some impressive photos soon.

The problem is this was a Phase I study with a 2cm2 treatment area, making it very difficult to provide a decent macro photo.

We have to wait till Phase II when they're injecting 200-300 injections into the entire scalp and then wait for a 6 month update. My guess is by October 2013 we will know how far they can go with this treatment.

Another issue I was thinking about is Minoxidil fails to maintain efficacy after a few years. How would Histogen be different, since we don't address the DHT issue? I guess only time will tell, as it did with Minoxidil.

I really hope Aderans also releases some positive results that way we can all go nuts in world cup 2014 knowing a cure is just around the corner!

[neversaynever]

They photos provided by Histogen are poor. They're dishing out all this amazing stats but the pictures show nothing like what they are claiming. Whats worrying is that surely they would use their best before / after picture to show obvious improvement?

They've recently updated everyone about their ever improving injections, but there is no photo evidence. I would have thought it would bring in investors aswell.

"with subjects age 40-59 seeing cosmetically significant results beginning at 12 weeks, including a mean increase of 39% in terminal hairs and 19.4% in total hair count in this age group in the current trial"

39% would be quite noticable, even without counting hairs. Prove it histogen! I suspecting they are distorting things to pull in the money. Lets hope they show us some impressive photos soon.

[clarence]

He needs to get laid......

but he is right.

[534623]

Anyway, load the pic above down, and cover up my green dots with another color - and count the clicks/dots during making them again. Let me know YOUR numbers ... that's actually the INTENTION of this thread - namely, to review my results.

Okay – I just did it again …

The counting of the green dots is unchanged (that means, I counted basically correct in both pics), and in addition, I counted and added the “ignored” hairs/FU’s (RED dots) in both pics. As you can see, I can do and try what ever I want, but I still can’t find the “statistically significant increase in the number of terminal hairs and hair thickness at 12 weeks”.

http://www.histogen.com/downloads/si..._HSC_Final.pdf

A Phase I/II 55 patient trial with a similar protocol but with 8 injections of HSC and control at baseline, and a repeat dose at week 6, has reached the 12 week primary safety and efficacy time point.

http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT01501617
A total of 8 injections (about 3mm apart) will be administered into one of the 2 randomized sites (left or right) of the subject's scalp. Six weeks after the Baseline injection, the same treatment site will receive a repeat dose (the same volume and number of injections as used in the baseline) with no crossover.

The 8 blue dots in my 1st pic above mark the (estimated) position of the injection sites in the analyzed area. Remember, this trail subject got –all in all- 16 injections into this area: 8 at baseline and 8 again after 6 weeks!

Questions:

1) Why disappeared so many complete follicular units or single hairs COMPLETELY (15-18-24-26-41-45-48-58-63-70-79-81)
in the 12 weeks pic at all, if the “hair stimulating complex” is working so great?

2) Why did so many hair become THINNER in the 12 weeks pic at all,
within such a appropriate period, if HSC should actually effectuate completely the contrary?

3) Why did they inject the stuff in a completely NORMAL (hairy) cycling (anagen-catagen-telogen-anagen etc) area at all?

TrichoScan analyzed results of trail subject S2018:


Personally, I have no further comments, so at least ...
... here is what Mr. Tom Hanks is thinking about these investigated data:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjakaPkXghk

[gutted]

bringing hairs out of dormancy with one injection is a big accomplishment and quite possible this is what histogen can do!

From the publication of recent results it seems like women (or those who have mpb under control via balanced hormones/cox 2) will have the best results from histogen.

this is what the shed rate(telogen) Vs Growth rate (anagen) is all about and why thinning(density loss) appears in MPB -> desynchronised follicular cycling making it appear like a treatment did nothing regrowth.

If it is true that the basline shows the same number of FU's as the 3 month image then this could explain why.

Anyway i still think histogen for some is a major step forward than daily use minoxidil at reactivating dormant follicles.

[534623]

Dude chill out I'm not a scientist.

But you're able to count, you know, 1, 2, 3 ...

I don't know what the definition of FU

Follicular Unit - Plain Speak

[garethbale]

Instead of, I should do - what exactly?

Reading thousand user-posts to find out whether or not something is working as claimed?

Go out for a beer...chat to girls etc

[bigentries]

Correct, I forgot to mark a few hairs/FU's - in BOTH pics (before/after) ...


But it doesn't matter - that's the reason why I made this sign -> ~

Anyway, load the pic above down, and cover up my green dots with another color - and count the clicks/dots during making them again. Let me know YOUR numbers ... that's actually the INTENTION of this thread - namely, to review my results.

Dude chill out I'm not a scientist. I would not do it because I can't do it, I don't know what the definition of FU, I don't have the knowledge to do it right

I just pointed out some flaws in your analysis

[hellouser]

Instead of, I should do - what exactly?

Get laid....

[534623]

Are you sure you counted right?
I see hairs that lack a green dot in the two pictures

Correct, I forgot to mark a few hairs/FU's - in BOTH pics (before/after) ...


But it doesn't matter - that's the reason why I made this sign -> ~

Anyway, load the pic above down, and cover up my green dots with another color - and count the clicks/dots during making them again. Let me know YOUR numbers ... that's actually the INTENTION of this thread - namely, to review my results.

[534623]

You have WAY too much time on your hands...

Instead of, I should do - what exactly?

Reading thousand user-posts to find out whether or not something is working as claimed?

[garethbale]

You have WAY too much time on your hands...