CB-03-01 - new antiandrogenic

[Pate]

1. Yes you are right you can't compare a 5ar2 inhibitor with a anti-androgen. That said, as you say CB-03-01 is approximately as strong as RU, albeit a tiny little less strong from the literature we have now.

2. I don't know if I can agree with you on this one. RU has been tested in ethanol solution by kane and he said that it was stable over 6 months. Then german guys on a german hairloss forum tested it in "bifon" hairloss solution and found out the RU was stable for over 230 days in solution. Furthermore enzulatamide which is highly similar to RU58841 in structure is given in a liquid oral suspension and is also highly stable (up to 2 years i think). I use RU myself for 10 daily batches and i have my powder at room temperature 24/7. Still works perfectly. I keep my solution at room temperature too.

I totally agree with you that we need something that doesn't have any side effects, and that is where CB-03-01 might shine. Don't get me wrong, but prevention is very easy to do nowadays. If you hop on DUT + RU, you won't bald. Problem is side effects obviously. But if you can handle them you can stop AGA in it's track very easy nowadays. But its just terrible to suffer from libido issues and other side effects to safe your hair. Not fair .

Well I can only go on what I've read and my own personal experience. From my reading it seems to be well-known in the literature that RU is unstable in ethanol. In fact anecdotally it seems to be one of the major reasons it wasn't pursued.

My own experience seems to back this up but it's important to say that I have only tested this with mpbtreatments pre-mixed RU in KB, which I know some guys here are suspicious of (but it's only suspicion as nobody has ever tested it, to my knowledge).

What I found was that after I placed an order it took about 3 weeks to arrive. When I started using it, I had an instant (within 3 days) massive drop in sebum production on my scalp. I have an extremely oily scalp in the thinning area, and almost no sebum on the non-thinning area, which is obviously due to the effect of the androgens. The RU stopped it cold so that I couldn't notice any difference between the thinning and non-thinning areas. But after about 4 weeks, the oil slowly started coming back, and by the end of the 8 week supply, my scalp was almost back to its pre-RU level of oiliness. Then a new bottle would arrive it the oil would disappear again within a couple of days.

I am interpreting this as the RU losing effectiveness as it starts to degrade. But if other people are getting different results I am happy to listen, and I freely admit that mpbtreatments RU is not the final word in RU solutions. In your case, I think you have shown the freezing is not probably not really necessary, as long as you are mixing on a weekly basis.

I have always been interested in mixing it myself, but I'm a bit hesitant to important quantities of white powder from China through Australian customs, who are notoriously quick to confiscate. I actually sought out some labs here to do purity tests - I was going to send them some Kane powder and then some solutions at different ages to test how the concentration declines over time. But eventually I went off RU anyway because I wasn't getting any significant regrowth, so I never did it.

So for the moment I'm sticking with fin, and hoping for CB to be available in a few years. Because I have definitely noticed minor sides from fin and I don't like staying on a systemic anti-androgen.

Anyway, just my story to add to the mix.

[rdawg]

Hey guys, is there anywhere that ships to canada that I can buy this stuff from? Does Kane ship to Canada?

also is it worth buying right now or would you recommend waiting a bit? I was gonna buy it in sept when i get back from vacay in europe.

[ShookOnes]

Hey guys, is there anywhere that ships to canada that I can buy this stuff from? Does Kane ship to Canada?

also is it worth buying right now or would you recommend waiting a bit? I was gonna buy it in sept when i get back from vacay in europe.

depends if you want to wait at least a year for a product that has a chance of not working at all unless cosmo's got their hands on a vehicle that they're secretive with

[MancBoy]

http://www.cosmopharmaceuticals.com/~/media/Files/C/Cosmo-Pharmaceuticals/ir/presentations/2014/20140708Zurichpresentationfinal.pdf

The above link to an investor report (pg 16) seems to show alopecia in phase 2 trials!! Can someone clarify I think someone has mentioned this maybe Europe trials. However I would see this as accurate as being a listed company they are not allowed to lie to the market.

The part that worries me is the statement of possible disposal of a the derma business (incl CB 03 01) to fund the colon business. I know they state colon as a great growth potential but if you were sat on a cure for hair loss which would be worth billions and you'd have complete control of the market you wouldn't sell the product to fund a more competitive business where you aren't the market leader?

Just to end positive this quote from the annual results sounds good
"CB-03-01’s mechanism of action is based on the competitive activity between CB-03-01 and testosterone respectively dihydrotestosterone (DHT) for androgen receptors in the skin. CB-03-01 has a substantially higher cell-binding power than either testosterone or DHT, and will block the androgen receptor thus inhibiting
testosterone/DHT’s effects on the cell. CB-03-01 is devoid of systemic antiandrogenic activity, and has a moderate anti-inflammatory effect. In preclinical studies, CB-03-01 was shown to be rapidly metabolized by the skin to the
parent compound cortexolone, which is a physiological steroid lacking
antiandrogen activity and is safe. CB-03-01 has also been shown to have
good penetration through the skin, making it the first steroidal antiandrogen suitable for topical application."

Sorry I like being an optimist!!

[sascha]

http://www.cosmopharmaceuticals.com/...ationfinal.pdf

The above link to an investor report (pg 16) seems to show alopecia in phase 2 trials!! Can someone clarify I think someone has mentioned this maybe Europe trials. However I would see this as accurate as being a listed company they are not allowed to lie to the market.

The part that worries me is the statement of possible disposal of a the derma business (incl CB 03 01) to fund the colon business. I know they state colon as a great growth potential but if you were sat on a cure for hair loss which would be worth billions and you'd have complete control of the market you wouldn't sell the product to fund a more competitive business where you aren't the market leader?

Just to end positive this quote from the annual results sounds good
"CB-03-01’s mechanism of action is based on the competitive activity between CB-03-01 and testosterone respectively dihydrotestosterone (DHT) for androgen receptors in the skin. CB-03-01 has a substantially higher cell-binding power than either testosterone or DHT, and will block the androgen receptor thus inhibiting
testosterone/DHT’s effects on the cell. CB-03-01 is devoid of systemic antiandrogenic activity, and has a moderate anti-inflammatory effect. In preclinical studies, CB-03-01 was shown to be rapidly metabolized by the skin to the
parent compound cortexolone, which is a physiological steroid lacking
antiandrogen activity and is safe. CB-03-01 has also been shown to have
good penetration through the skin, making it the first steroidal antiandrogen suitable for topical application."

Sorry I like being an optimist!!

Yes its no secret. You can ask them and they will tell you that they are in phase 2. filling IND does not take that long and phase 2 trials can take as less as 18 month. Their phase 2 for acne was around 21 month, so yes why not being optimistic, its always better

[ShookOnes]

http://www.cosmopharmaceuticals.com/...ationfinal.pdf

The above link to an investor report (pg 16) seems to show alopecia in phase 2 trials!! Can someone clarify I think someone has mentioned this maybe Europe trials. However I would see this as accurate as being a listed company they are not allowed to lie to the market.

The part that worries me is the statement of possible disposal of a the derma business (incl CB 03 01) to fund the colon business. I know they state colon as a great growth potential but if you were sat on a cure for hair loss which would be worth billions and you'd have complete control of the market you wouldn't sell the product to fund a more competitive business where you aren't the market leader?

Just to end positive this quote from the annual results sounds good
"CB-03-01’s mechanism of action is based on the competitive activity between CB-03-01 and testosterone respectively dihydrotestosterone (DHT) for androgen receptors in the skin. CB-03-01 has a substantially higher cell-binding power than either testosterone or DHT, and will block the androgen receptor thus inhibiting
testosterone/DHT’s effects on the cell. CB-03-01 is devoid of systemic antiandrogenic activity, and has a moderate anti-inflammatory effect. In preclinical studies, CB-03-01 was shown to be rapidly metabolized by the skin to the
parent compound cortexolone, which is a physiological steroid lacking
antiandrogen activity and is safe. CB-03-01 has also been shown to have
good penetration through the skin, making it the first steroidal antiandrogen suitable for topical application."

Sorry I like being an optimist!!

That last sentence..good penetration thru skin? A lot of forum members fears were that it wouldn't penetrate bc of their failed vehicle/effective on skin. This could be great news!

[MancBoy]

So how do I get myself in the trial!! haha so from phase two completing how long does phase three take??

I live in the UK so all these phases being USA does this actually have any relevance for me??

[sascha]

Well I am from Italy actually and don´t know that much either, but a quick search on the Internet said IND filling does not take long if the evidence is clear that it works...after phase 2 the company meets with the FDA and decide to continue or not. phase 3 can take up to a year/year and a half, but can also just be 6 month. Unlike many other members I believe that the FDA does not hold anything back that works. The FDA may be a bit more conservative than the EU or UK version, but thats it. I don´t think that you can participate, because the recrution-phase is over if they are already in the trial.

[burtandernie]

Wait wait people on this forum arent always right about their random guesses and predictions? Now you have me worrying they might sell it off to fund the colon stuff. That would be bad if cb 03 01 goes away so does the chances of ever getting a safe topical and there is not much if anything in the near future to look forward to for prevention besides this
It sounds like its a couple years away or so which is odd because I see people saying its 6 years away at least which I guess proves few people on forums really know what they are even talking about

[FearTheLoss]

They are talking about a spin-off or getting private placement for the derma portion of their company..not terminating it. Those are two very different things. They clearly aren't going to terminate a portion of their company that is a "rich pipeline" with "very good results".

[ShookOnes]

Wait wait people on this forum arent always right about their random guesses and predictions? Now you have me worrying they might sell it off to fund the colon stuff. That would be bad if cb 03 01 goes away so does the chances of ever getting a safe topical and there is not much if anything in the near future to look forward to for prevention besides this
It sounds like its a couple years away or so which is odd because I see people saying its 6 years away at least which I guess proves few people on forums really know what they are even talking about

would be 6 years if it wasn't already in phase 2

[MancBoy]

Yeah I should of been clearer a spin off isn't termination but still they'd be handing profits to someone else in order to raise cash for their other business. Therefore they value colon as a more valuable business (or less risk). Also if you spin off it could take the company away from a strong cash rich business to a PE firm that maybe less willing to put in any extra cash. But that sounds negative so to be positive it could go somewhere that would really push it!! So if they are in phase two how long do we think until market??

But my point about spin off is if you knew you had a winning lottery ticket, why would you share the winnings??

[rdawg]

sounds like this stuff is getting fast-tracked due to high safety.

Will be interested to see the results however, and we still dont know the true vehicle! Very happy we at least have a new alternative solution soon to be approved.

[Xoxo]

CB can already be bought, but we do not know which vehicle really works.
If we can find out, which vehicle was used in the trials, we could mix it ourselves and would not need to wait for phase 2 trials, FDA approval, market release, etc.
Or we must find out ourselves, which vehicle works very well.
But how could any of that be achieved?

[ShookOnes]

CB can already be bought, but we do not know which vehicle really works.
If we can find out, which vehicle was used in the trials, we could mix it ourselves and would not need to wait for phase 2 trials, FDA approval, market release, etc.
Or we must find out ourselves, which vehicle works very well.
But how could any of that be achieved?

it can't. so wait.