OC buy

[sdsurfin]

We need to get the price of this down.

If you look up lanes shop at anageninc, and search for OC, you can see his price for it.

Everybody please email Kane and maybe we can get a group buy done. Even if we can cut it down to 100 bucks per gram that would be much more realistic. One guy on the web was getting good results with 2%, which would end up being 400 plus bucks per small bottle, which might last you a month. crazy. Kane is selling RU for like 28 bucks per gram, and theres no reason it should be easier to make. It's all about demand. Lets please get on this. The more people contact him, the closer we can get to an affordable and safe maintenance option. I have seen zero negative experiences with OC on the web, and everyone who has used it stopped their loss.

Either lets really get on kane or we need to find a new supplier.

[rambo007]

We need to get the price of this down.

If you look up lanes shop at anageninc, and search for OC, you can see his price for it.

Everybody please email Kane and maybe we can get a group buy done. Even if we can cut it down to 100 bucks per gram that would be much more realistic. One guy on the web was getting good results with 2%, which would end up being 400 plus bucks per small bottle, which might last you a month. crazy. Kane is selling RU for like 28 bucks per gram, and theres no reason it should be easier to make. It's all about demand. Lets please get on this. The more people contact him, the closer we can get to an affordable and safe maintenance option. I have seen zero negative experiences with OC on the web, and everyone who has used it stopped their loss.

Either lets really get on kane or we need to find a new supplier.

Did they use it orally or topically?

[sdsurfin]

Also please press Kane on the price issue. Basically tell him that if he can lower the price, there are many willing buyers. Tell him no one wants to pay so much for it.

[diffuseloser]

Good luck getting Kane to budge much on his prices. I've tried before with CB and didn't really get anywhere. Even with huge bulk buys the discount he was offering was nothing to get excited about. Guy must be creaming in his pants. Maybe we should have an embargo. He's got to know there will be a massive demand for this stuff so he can charge what he pleases.

[sdsurfin]

Good luck getting Kane to budge much on his prices. I've tried before with CB and didn't really get anywhere. Even with huge bulk buys the discount he was offering was nothing to get excited about. Guy must be creaming in his pants. Maybe we should have an embargo. He's got to know there will be a massive demand for this stuff so he can charge what he pleases.

Well I've been researching RU which seems to be the bulk of his business. I think using RU is a really dumb thing to do. I'm pretty sure it changes your androgen receptors, making them more sensitive to androgens in the long run, it has never been proven for safety, and it is an anti androgen, which is never good for a guy. I have found countless reports of RU making peoples' hair worse. No one should buy RU from him or use RU when we have a much safer option available to us. Everyone buying Ru from Kane should stop and demand OC

[Trouse5858]

Well I've been researching RU which seems to be the bulk of his business. I think using RU is a really dumb thing to do... I have found countless reports of RU making peoples' hair worse. No one should buy RU from him or use RU when we have a much safer option available to us. Everyone buying Ru from Kane should stop and demand OC

I don't believe for a minute that it makes your hair worse. What possible evidence, other than anecdotal, do you have to support this? My assumption is that some people were simply too far along in the process of MPB to reap any benefits and thus blamed their continued loss on the drug. Or people were not using the right dosage and the outcome was the same as above. Just because RU isn't the miracle drug people might've hoped it to be doesn't mean that it's to blame for people losing their hair. They're losing their hair because, well shitty genetics in short.

[Swooping]

I don't believe for a minute that it makes your hair worse. What possible evidence, other than anecdotal, do you have to support this? My assumption is that some people were simply too far along in the process of MPB to reap any benefits and thus blamed their continued loss on the drug. Or people were not using the right dosage and the outcome was the same as above. Just because RU isn't the miracle drug people might've hoped it to be doesn't mean that it's to blame for people losing their hair. They're losing their hair because, well shitty genetics in short.

This indeed. RU is the only experimental treatment that has made it's way up to become a valid treatment. As good that many people even like it more than finasteride. Thousands are using it. On a scientific level there is zero reasoning to believe that RU can make your hair worse. It will not work for everyone though, but so won't other treatments. The only waterproof preventative cure is castration. Simple as that, even castration won't reverse AGA though.

Also as you say it's anecdotal evidence, some people are convinced that finasteride makes their hair worse too. Some people believe that dutasteride eat's their hairline. Some people believe that fapping is the cause of AGA. Well everyone gets the point lol.

[FearTheLoss]

let's keep this thread on point please.

[sdsurfin]

This indeed. RU is the only experimental treatment that has made it's way up to become a valid treatment. As good that many people even like it more than finasteride. Thousands are using it. On a scientific level there is zero reasoning to believe that RU can make your hair worse. It will not work for everyone though, but so won't other treatments. The only waterproof preventative cure is castration. Simple as that, even castration won't reverse AGA though.

Also as you say it's anecdotal evidence, some people are convinced that finasteride makes their hair worse too. Some people believe that dutasteride eat's their hairline. Some people believe that fapping is the cause of AGA. Well everyone gets the point lol.

Maybe, maybe not. I have seen lots of threads about how RU has crazy ups and downs, and I think any receptor blocker has the capacity to upregulate that receptor and really make it more sensitive. Until I see research that tells me why this wouldn't happen, then Im not convinced. You could be right, but Ive yet to hear from one guy who says that RU has saved his hair in the long run, like many years. Im also skeptical of the fact that it was never approved, and Im thinking it was maybe due to the possibility that it doesn't do anyone any good. Word from the people who researched it, or positive reviews from anyone long term would ease my mind a lot.

But so far I see a lot of people who did great on it, only to shed massive amounts when they stopped or somewhere along their treatment.

[sdsurfin]

Here is the email I have sent to various chemical companies. I suggest you guys do the same if you want to help get our hands on this stuff:


Hello, I'm interested in the prostaglandin blockers OC000459 and setipiprant. Basically there has been current research that shows that this compound can completely and safely halt hair loss in men with alopecia, but there is no way to obtain it. The drug has been through many safety trials for asthma. Kythera pharmaceuticals is developing a similar drug (setipiprant) for hair loss, and from being a member of online forums, I know hundreds if not thousands of men who are looking for an affordable source of OC000459 or setipiprant. There is currently a company called anageninc in China that sells OC in a form that is dissolvable in ethanol (the normal form has problems dissolving for use as a topical), but they charge way too much money for the average consumer. The people who have used it have reported really great results (a total halt in hair loss) Is there any way to setup a way to make/purchase this compound from your company at a price that works for everybody? Please let me know either way. Thank you

[Swooping]

Maybe, maybe not. I have seen lots of threads about how RU has crazy ups and downs, and I think any receptor blocker has the capacity to upregulate that receptor and really make it more sensitive. Until I see research that tells me why this wouldn't happen, then Im not convinced. You could be right, but Ive yet to hear from one guy who says that RU has saved his hair in the long run, like many years. Im also skeptical of the fact that it was never approved, and Im thinking it was maybe due to the possibility that it doesn't do anyone any good. Word from the people who researched it, or positive reviews from anyone long term would ease my mind a lot.

But so far I see a lot of people who did great on it, only to shed massive amounts when they stopped or somewhere along their treatment.

What you think doesn't really matter. It isn't scientifically proven. Do you see that finasteride upregulates or makes the 5 alpha reductase 2 enzyme more sensitive over time? No it doesn't, because that would mean DHT levels would increase again and you would need to increase the dosage. And obviously people are going to shed when they stop RU, you need to use it continuously just as with finasteride.

You already project the PGD2 angle as it's going to be the best maintenance treatment which will be side effect free though. Based on what? On 3-4 guys on a forum who claim so? Some people didn't notice anything at all, I saw also some claims of OC bringing up insomnia and breathlessness, what about that?

Anyway it's a good thing you are proactive. Let's hope the PGD2 angle will indeed be "fruitful".

[KO1]

Swooping - is there any advantage, apart from side effects, to inhibit CRTH2 directly versus inhibiting DHT? Since PGD2 is downstream of the androgen pathway, shouldn't fin already be taking care of this?


What is interesting to me is that in the original Cots/Garza study, they looked closely at PGD2, they noted that mice that express PGD2 bald, but they never actually tried an inhibitor on one of those mice. However, Kythera is saying that pgd2 inhibitors did reverse miniaturization in in vitro follicles.

[Hairismylife]

No need to argue. Use both RU and OC. This should halt hairloss completely.

[Swooping]

Swooping - is there any advantage, apart from side effects, to inhibit CRTH2 directly versus inhibiting DHT? Since PGD2 is downstream of the androgen pathway, shouldn't fin already be taking care of this?


What is interesting to me is that in the original Cots/Garza study, they looked closely at PGD2, they noted that mice that express PGD2 bald, but they never actually tried an inhibitor on one of those mice. However, Kythera is saying that pgd2 inhibitors did reverse miniaturization in in vitro follicles.

Good point. Androgens are a prerequisite for AGA obviously. I don't think there is any advantage though as you mention because it lays downstream. If we castrate someone, that person is AGA free. Meaning that even if PGD2 would stay overexpressed in a castrated person it doesn't matter. Cause we see from evidence that AGA doesn't progress in a castrated person.

However in the hypothesis that PGD2 would stay overexpressed in a castrated person in the scalp, calibrating these levels could reverse miniaturization. This is obviously a hypothesis that is plausible. If you ask my opinion it is highly damn unlikely though. It's just too simple for me.

If you look at the model here above Garza argues that PTGDS the enzyme responsible for PGD2 synthase is directly hormone driven in the scalp. Therefore they think that the PGD2 angle is a big player and functions highly upstream of the cascade. I don't think so and would argue that it would lay more downstream.

However using compounds can also yield for cross-talk between pathways which can be interesting. It's complex. Garza for example states that PGE2 is known to be a procarcogenic signal and refers to literature. I read those studies and indeed in many tissue PGE2 can have impact on other pathways which I think for example are interesting. For example he refers to this one; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2759608/.

In this study we investigated the mechanisms by which PGE2 stimulates murine keratinocyte proliferation using in vitro and in vivo models. Our data suggest the mechanisms involve PGE2-induced phosphorylation of EGFR and activation of Ras-MAPKs, PI3-K/Akt and cAMP/PKA signaling pathways. Furthermore, our data revealed that PGE2 increased binding of CREB, NF-κB and AP-1 to the promoters of cyclin D1 and VEGF.

Hyperactivated AKT can for example promote cell profileration by downregulating P27 and upregulating cyclin d1 as you can read in the study. Upregation of cyclin d1 can yield to possibly other reactions like downregulation of P53. It is these players that can have way a bigger impact in my opinion. Using estrogen can upregulate cyclin d1 also for example and has impact on the MAPK pathways too etc.

Nonetheless a full cure in a drug form would be a miracle in my opinion, highly unlikely for a pretty long time time seeing the implications in AGA.

[Hairismylife]

Good point. Androgens are a prerequisite for AGA obviously. I don't think there is any advantage though as you mention because it lays downstream. If we castrate someone, that person is AGA free. Meaning that even if PGD2 would stay overexpressed in a castrated person it doesn't matter. Cause we see from evidence that AGA doesn't progress in a castrated person.

However in the hypothesis that PGD2 would stay overexpressed in a castrated person in the scalp, calibrating these levels could reverse miniaturization. This is obviously a hypothesis that is plausible. If you ask my opinion it is highly damn unlikely though. It's just too simple for me.

If you look at the model here above Garza argues that PTGDS the enzyme responsible for PGD2 synthase is directly hormone driven in the scalp. Therefore they think that the PGD2 angle is a big player and functions highly upstream of the cascade. I don't think so and would argue that it would lay more downstream.

However using compounds can also yield for cross-talk between pathways which can be interesting. It's complex. Garza for example states that PGE2 is known to be a procarcogenic signal and refers to literature. I read those studies and indeed in many tissue PGE2 can have impact on other pathways which I think for example are interesting. For example he refers to this one; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2759608/.



Hyperactivated AKT can for example promote cell profileration by downregulating P27 and upregulating cyclin d1 as you can read in the study. Upregation of cyclin d1 can yield to possibly other reactions like downregulation of P53. It is these players that can have way a bigger impact in my opinion. Using estrogen can upregulate cyclin d1 also for example and has impact on the MAPK pathways too etc.

Nonetheless a full cure in a drug form would be a miracle in my opinion, highly unlikely for quite some time seeing the implications in AGA.

I have this question also.
Basically blocking upstream or downstream makes not so much difference.
However I would use both RU and OC, I do think this would work great.
And can lower RU dose to a much safer concentration say2%.