piloxll:new israeli method combines wounding+ zi/cu ions to destroy dht in the scalp

[KJ1982]

I was wondering, given the nature of this device does that mean that it may be able to either bypass or move more quickly through the FDA/MHRA approval process(es)?

Forgive my ignorance regarding the science behind it all but as it's a device rather than a topical or oral medication doesn't that mean that it need not pass such tight regulation(s)?

[beetee]

It seems to me that many of the people who seemed pretty optimistic about treatments a few months ago are now feeling somewhat pessimistic. I wonder how many of the posts that are made in this forum are made up of time estimates, either saying that the solution is right around the corner or saying it's 20-30 years away.

In all honesty, I think that all estimates are probably about equally valid, because no one knows what's going on and what's going to happen. While we have a very small amount of information, most of it it is still theoretical in regards to what kind of effects certain drugs or techniques MIGHT have on MPB. We do not have enough information to make realistic estimates of how long certain products will take to get to market and more importantly whether or not they will be effective enough to ever be brought to market. I don't think the great majority of the people doing the research right now know if anything they're working on will ultimately be effective. It could be that MPB is something that they can't reverse; it could be that there is something fairly simple that could reverse it entirely. At this point, everything is pretty much theoretical, and while I'm sure that speculation serves an emotional purpose (and I'm not downplaying this), I don't think anyone should put all of their faith in any of the estimates originated by people not currently working for a company that's actively researching these products.

Also, in regards to whether or not people working for drug companies care about hair loss. My opinion is that what they care more about than anything is making money. They want to make their investments in relatively low risk/high reward scenarios. I think a lot of companies weren't interested in putting money into hair loss research as they didn't have any indications as to what pathways or techniques could possibly lead to effective treatments. The fact that there's been a greater understanding of the mechanisms and chemical pathways involved in hair loss in the last few years means that there are more actual avenues for people to investigate, which COULD lead to increased research, at least until the obvious possible treatments addressing those pathways have been exhausted. I think this is probably a better time for hair loss research than perhaps any time in the past, so there's some reason to be optimistic there, but of course we don't at all know what (if anything) will come of it.

[baldymcgee]

The issue of drug companies spending their research dollars is really complicated.

Sure, Novartis can charge $20 for a single Gleevec pill but they also have to swallow the costs of giving the drug cheaply to the poor and indigent (they don't have to do this, but every single drug company has procedures for giving truly "hard up" people their products at drastically reduced costs).

However, hairloss being cosmetic, they can charge whatever they'd like for the drug and never have to deal with ethical questions ("how can you charge so much for a life saving drug?!?!?!?")

A good/safe/reliable hairloss cure is practically a license to print money.

[luca10]

post from Vraf

Hi Guys,

Sorry or the delay with answers, I had to wait for Yoram answers.
Although Yoram gave answers to brunobald, he didn’t know it will be published and the restrictions about revealing the knowledge still exist.
You must understand guys that the Pilogics partnership did not want this story to be published till the product will be available for marketing.
They know that the word has already spread but they still want to keep most of the details in secret.
Therefore, I was asked, again, to be very restrict with the data and talk mostly on my personal experience.
Any issue, which will have the potential of revealing harmful data will receive no answer or be sent to Yoram for approval.

YOU ALL MUST TAKE MY ANSWERS IN LIMITS! I’M NOT PILOGICS REPRESENTATIVE NOR ANY OTHER FORMAL SPOKESMAN!
I was just given an approval to share some staff cause I want to give you hope and good filling as I, myself would have wanted to be treated like.

Please forgive my English, it’s not my mother language.
Please be patient with the speed of my posts since I’m making efforts to avoid English mistakes.

In the following, I will try, has much as I can, to tell you about my experience and some answers to your questions:

1. I’m 43 YO, new in the bald staff. I believe, comparing to the Norwood scale, that I’m 3 vortex.
Started using Rogaine 1.5 months before starting to use Piloxll.
I quitted Rogaine 5 days before starting to use Piloxll.
2. Before starting my trial, Yoram shaved 2 spots on my crown, marked them with under skin paint and pictured with a special microscopic camera. My hair was counted per stage (anagen etc.) and 4 days later I passed the same procedure. the trial started only after the second procedure.
3. I’m using the Piloxll 3 times a day, 5 minutes on the crown and 5 minutes on the front. The protocol is only 5 minutes on all scalp 3 times a week. But… the more proven to be better.
4. The device is very easy to use and can be used during lots of other activities like watching television.
5. There are no side effects at all! Hundreds of trail users reported no side effects.
6. The device is a very high-tech instrument. Since I’m in a trial, I have the latest prototype which has further functionalities like recording every treatment that I do and the feedbacks it receives from my scalp. This functionality will not be in market device. There are so many hidden technology in it so believe me, don’t try to replicate it, it’s a waste of time even trying to follow the patent will not help..
7. Although I take picture of my scalp every few days, I’m not allowed to share them with you, yet. Maybe I will receive approval in the future, it’s in discussion. I can tell you that I see more thickness and even fuzzes in the front side which didn’t grow hair for years.

For some question you asked:
1. Pilogics has nothing to do with Polica! Pilogics has an approved patent which its idea building blocks started many many years ago. In my opinion, they didn’t even know about them till they read about the comparison in the forums.
2. “How many phases of studies are there in Israel?” – I’m not allowed to share this information.
3. “Also, what phase study is the treatment in at this time?” - I’m not allowed to share this information.
4. “And how much longer until it completes testing so we can purchase it?” -The current tests has nothing to do with marketing. The product will be out in a year. Maximum.
5. “Also, is there a reason why he won't sell the treatment now from a country that will allow him to do so?” - No one said that he is not allowed to sell right now. Selling is not pending only on regulation.
6. “Why did they abandon Pillox 2, Pillox 3, and Pillox 4?” – They did not abandon, every product has a “Product developing evolution”.
7. “Is he just now starting Pillox 5 and if he is do we have to wait years before it's marketed and we can use it?” – In a year.

Sorry if I missed a question, you may keep posting questions and I promise to do my best to give you answers.

[luca10]

Vraf

1. are there any chemicals involved which of we should worry about? --- No chemicals

2. is there any ingredient in it which could prevent the device from hitting the market in some countries? ---No

3. when did the pilox project start? how many years of development? --- 5 years

4. Is there a picture of the device? -- Of course but obviously, can’t share it.

5. what is the scientific basis for this treatment? -- It was discussed so many times in this and other forums + written in the patent. Please read.

6. Is this capable of restoring to NW0? -- I believe it depends on one’s personal status and his react to the treatment. As for myself, from what I managed to understand, it has an high probability.

7. Is this capable of restoring temple areas and crown? --- Yes

8. When restoring do crown and temple areas take longer than others or is it all in one go at the same time? – Looks like temples take longer. But this goes for any other known treatment and for treatments that will come in the future.

9. Was it Yoram's request that the Bald truth remove those threads or competitors? -- No

10. Are you seeing results faster than you thought by that I mean are you really noting it weekly? -- Yes but as you all know, only a professional examination by microscopic camera would support these claims. This will be done after 2 month of use.

11. What was the reason behind Yorams radio silence on this whole thing? --- already explained.

12. LASER? --- NO!!!

13. you surely have read the patent of the apparatus: --- I did not. I tried but there were to many terms in English for which Google Translate couldn’t translate to Hebrew. This is the reason that I started the first thread, I wanted the professionals to read it and explain the way it works.

[Jasari]

First of OP, this piloxll is fake...


secondly, Hell...I don't believe there is any donor regeneration from Gho to be honest. Second of all, I'm never going to shave my donor below a 1-2 guard...third off, I want a Rahal hairline...he is the best in the industry and the hairline is the most important part..in the future as my loss progresses I will go for pilofocus, more than likely (hopefully Rahal offers too) as there is going to be some regen..and it's scarless...then if things get out of hand I will throw smp all around the head..I'm attacking this beast and not ever giving in...I have confident in future treatments..we will have something better soon...but I am going all out on transplants to enjoy these years while I'm young.

You pretty much read my mind - Enjoy life while you're young. If it takes a transplant to help you do that, then there is no point wasting your youth being miserable.

It's pretty much rolling the dice and hoping that future treatments come to fruition but I've seen enough to think we're getting close to a solid treatment.

[rdawg]

Interesting stuff but I have no way of telling if this is legitimate.

I hope its real, but with this kind of stuff there's alot of fake products and posters out there!!!

[Artista]

Hi all , I just read through this thread this morning.
Hey Crafter I wanted to respond to your response to one of FearTheLoss' comments..

"you're overly optimistic. Where did he say this? "although Artista said the regen pics were "breathtaking""? i've seen the one pic from Dr Wesley and looks nothing amazing - about 5 hairs"

The one pic that you had seen is not comparable to the phase test 'before and after' photos that are on Dr Wesley's PowerPoint Presentation shown only to a handful of people (Spencer and myself included) during the first quarter of 2013.
Dr Wesley's presentation given at the August San Fran' conference is not the same one.
What he has been able to do during those phase tests were 'breathtaking' indeed.
I wouldnt just say that. I believe that Spencer Kobren expressed the same and I would agree with Spencer AND Dr Wesley in also stating that, although those outcomes are very impressive, it was anecdotal evidence.
Time will tell how truly effective his new method will be. Im glad to be accepted as one of his upcoming phase test patients in early Spring, 2014.
So to clarify, Crafter the one pic you have seen (about 5 hairs) was not one of the 'breathtaking' pics..although it was also in the private 'PowerPoint'.
Actually ,that presentation was very in-depth compared to the San Fran presentation. I will be sharing my experiences from the phase testing once I get the OK to do so(of course).
Cheers all
Oh, I almost forgot,,until we get hard scientific proof of what Piloxll does or doesn't do, Id have to agree with Rdawg < hi man

[hellouser]

Hi all , I just read through this thread this morning.
Hey Crafter I wanted to respond to your response to one of FearTheLoss' comments..

"you're overly optimistic. Where did he say this? "although Artista said the regen pics were "breathtaking""? i've seen the one pic from Dr Wesley and looks nothing amazing - about 5 hairs"

The one pic that you had seen is not comparable to the phase test 'before and after' photos that are on Dr Wesley's PowerPoint Presentation shown only to a handful of people (Spencer and myself included) during the first quarter of 2013.
Dr Wesley's presentation given at the August San Fran' conference is not the same one.
What he has been able to do during those phase tests were 'breathtaking' indeed.
I wouldnt just say that. I believe that Spencer Kobren expressed the same and I would agree with Spencer AND Dr Wesley in also stating that, although those outcomes are very impressive, it was anecdotal evidence.
Time will tell how truly effective his new method will be. Im glad to be accepted as one of his upcoming phase test patients in early Spring, 2014.
So to clarify, Crafter the one pic you have seen (about 5 hairs) was not one of the 'breathtaking' pics..although it was also in the private 'PowerPoint'.
Actually ,that presentation was very in-depth compared to the San Fran presentation. I will be sharing my experiences from the phase testing once I get the OK to do so(of course).
Cheers all
Oh, I almost forgot,,until we get hard scientific proof of what Piloxll does or doesn't do, Id have to agree with Rdawg < hi man

5 regenerated hairs in a very small area that requires one of those tiny cameras is actually GREAT. Do this over a large area and we're talking thousands of new hairs.

[hairy]

I believe Dr. Nigam has moved to Israel and started this company.

[oppenheimer82]

why do people keep derailing this thread? **** OFF!

[cookies]

why do people keep derailing this thread? **** OFF!

Agreed, it's not like there are not enough threads on those other subjects.

Anyway, on the other forum vraf will no longer be answering questions regarding piloxll. Yoram will do it instead, but in a closed of part of a forum, unfortunately. I have no idea which one.

[Thinning@30]

It is really disappointing what happened at the other forum. I wanted more information about this stuff, and was interested in hearing what Vraf and the developers had to say. Yes, there are lots of scams and snake oils out there, but at the very least, a Q&A might have enabled us to evaluate some of the claims behind this. It wasn't even like they were selling anything yet. I hope the developers will engage the hair loss community in some way going forward.

[PaddyBateman]

Any chance Spencer will have looked into this, and will discuss on his next show?

[Atum]

Hoping this will work.