saw palmetto can stop, reverse fin side effects!!!

[PatientlyWaiting]

mhm not really. A lot of people stop growing at 16-18. How tall are you? Are you shorter than your parents?

I'm 5' 7", taller than my mother of course. And my dad is taller than me at 5' 10".

I just don't get why I see all of these little kids, who are so tiny at 13, then from 14-16 go in to NBA level growth spurts. Almost every kid in my neighborhood is like 5' 9" - 5' 10", only in their mid teens. The hell do they ate. I know genes have every thing to do with it, but damn.

[2020]

well I doubt fin can stunt your growth.... even hermaphrodites are of normal height so I don't think it matters.

Both your parents seem to be of average height so you turned out to be of average height as well... nothing abnormal here.

[PatientlyWaiting]

well I doubt fin can stunt your growth.... even hermaphrodites are of normal height so I don't think it matters.

Both your parents seem to be of average height so you turned out to be of average height as well... nothing abnormal here.

I was 5' 7" in 7th grade, when I was 14. I'm 23 and i'm still 5' 7". That does not seem okay to me. Looks like I got my growth spurt early, and didn't grow a god damn inch after that. It's frustrating to be bald at a young age, stop growing at a young age...and look like a teenager entering my mid 20s.

How tall are you? And when did you stop growing, height wise?

[gutted]

Same here the problem with FIN is mostly when you drop it, that's when you get really ****ed up.

But if you had 0 sides at all, then you should be good.

theres a perfectly good explanantion why this occurs you know its all homestasis.

on a side note, people who are on fin, can advance to nw7 BECAUSE they are on fin when had they addressed there imbalance by other means rather than constantly popping fin, there androgen levels would have natrually dropped over the course of age/time and if they were lucky probably would have been at nw2/3 but because their altered hormonal profile (caused by fin) means androgen levels/AR sensitivity are not dropping over the course of thier life but in fact rising, hence they will go more balder than what "destiny" was supposed to have in store for them!

[2020]

I was 5' 7" in 7th grade, when I was 14. I'm 23 and i'm still 5' 7". That does not seem okay to me. Looks like I got my growth spurt early, and didn't grow a god damn inch after that. It's frustrating to be bald at a young age, stop growing at a young age...and look like a teenager entering my mid 20s.
How tall are you? And when did you stop growing, height wise?

that happens a lot more often than you think...
I personally stopped growing at around 16 or so. My driver's license which I got at 16 says 6'0" but right now at 21 I'm 6'1" so I grew just an inch since....

[PatientlyWaiting]

You at least grew an inch. I didn't grow anything at all.

I have pictures of me and my younger friends when I was 13-14, where I towered over every one lmao. Those same guys are now taller than me. They're about 3-4 years younger than me now. Though to be fair, the friends who I grew up with who are my age, are all about the same height as me, give or take an inch. There's one rare case, who's 6'. But every one else is 5' 6-5' 8. While this new batch of kids are like relatives of Paul Bunyan or something. It has to be something that maybe the lunch in school started putting after us older guys left. Cause nowadays all these younglings are freaking tall as shit at age 15-16. I could play ball with the 14 year olds in my neighborhood and blend in with them, passing by you would think i'm only 3-4 years older than them.

[friezy]

huh?? Of course it does

if you believe the two work exactly the same then can you explain to me why
nobody experiences the same results with saw palmetto if any? and why people dont seem to get side effects from saw palmetto.
and dont say because fin is stronger because yes it is but no dosage of saw palmetto can give the same results as fin.

"Finasteride, sold only by prescription, blocks the action of 5-alpha-reductase, an enzyme that changes testosterone, the dominant male hormone, to dihydrotestosterone, also called DHT. Saw palmetto appears to decrease 5-alpha-reductase slightly and may have other hormonal effects. Saw palmetto also has inhibitory effects on male hormone receptors.

I believe mechanisms of action of these two are different and so is the impact.

[friezy]

SP side effects include loss of libido just like Finasteride.

Saw palmetto is proven to be a mild aphrodisiac.
i have experienced increased libido from it myself.

[gutted]

Saw palmetto is proven to be a mild aphrodisiac.
i have experienced increased libido from it myself.

this is probably because of the increased testosterone levels that are available.

[2020]

if you believe the two work exactly the same then can you explain to me why
nobody experiences the same results with saw palmetto if any? and why people dont seem to get side effects from saw palmetto.
and dont say because fin is stronger because yes it is but no dosage of saw palmetto can give the same results as fin.

"Finasteride, sold only by prescription, blocks the action of 5-alpha-reductase, an enzyme that changes testosterone, the dominant male hormone, to dihydrotestosterone, also called DHT. Saw palmetto appears to decrease 5-alpha-reductase slightly and may have other hormonal effects. Saw palmetto also has inhibitory effects on male hormone receptors.

I believe mechanisms of action of these two are different and so is the impact.

right but he said that the way SP works is not by doing anything with DHT and I pointed out that it's wrong.... yeah it's a mild 5ar inhibitor and it also blocks some of DHT at its receptors

[chrisis]

2020, the onus is on people prescribing these medicines to prove their safety. if the participants in their trials are all susceptible to higher Norwood levels of balding, then it's not a fair study, because it doesn't reflect how the drug is being used in the wider populace. It makes me laugh people cite a Japanese study - a completely indigenous population, how can that be applicable to Caucasian or black people?

I'm calling them out on this and until I see more comprehensive and unbiased studies.

You can scream the sky is green until then, but it's tiring.

[chrisis]

Furthermore, we don't know enough about the interactions of this drug on the male hormonal system. That being the case, any oversights such as the ones I've highlights are serious and should be investigated. Unfortunately, the drug companies don't really care, so long as they get past FDA, which they've done, and managed to suppress the extent of the side effects issue by revising labels to appease concerned parties and cover themselves legally. Eventually the camel's back will break, mark my words.

[gutted]

right but he said that the way SP works is not by doing anything with DHT and I pointed out that it's wrong.... yeah it's a mild 5ar inhibitor and it also blocks some of DHT at its receptors

yeah... saw palmetto has constituents in it that inhibits dht to an extent - its speculated to be beta sitosterol.

This is why i state, the brand/supplement (more precisisley, the beta sitosterol content of the specific supplment) determines whethere an individual will suffer sides with saw palmetto, hence why theres mixed reports from users of saw palmetoo of decreased libido, weaker erections etc yet others are fine.

Too much dht suppression is not neccassarily good for you, you need to find the balance, in fact this can be detrimental to your hair This also applies to fin.

[2020]

2020, the onus is on people prescribing these medicines to prove their safety. if the participants in their trials are all susceptible to higher Norwood levels of balding, then it's not a fair study, because it doesn't reflect how the drug is being used in the wider populace. It makes me laugh people cite a Japanese study - a completely indigenous population, how can that be applicable to Caucasian or black people?

WHAT DOES YOUR FOLLICLE AR SENSITIVITY GOT TO DO WITH YOUR SIDE EFFECTS!?!? I proved you wrong a long time ago. Why are you still arguing?

[chrisis]

You've proven nothing. Show me the studies I'm asking for, otherwise, shut up.