The scalp inflammation/itchy/burning/tingling thread

[mic28]

How are you going Ziggy and Dench?

[Ziggyz123]

Hey mic, I'm in the same spot pretty much. I think most of my shedding is from the cessation of minoxidil 6 months ago. I actually have a question for you.. Did you try oral minox yet? I'm really thinking of trying it to see if I can regrow some minox hair I lost. As for the scalp pain, I get random soreness once in a while but I'm living so that's a good thing. Besides that, how are you holding up?

[mic28]

Hey Ziggy,

I haven't started oral minoxidil yet as I've only been prescribed 100 tablets at the moment of 0.5mg and I don't want to run out prior to seeing my dermatologist again. I will start in a couple of weeks.

As far as shedding is concerned, I have good and bad days. I'm seeing hair fall and getting some itching but not as bad as a month ago. Perhaps I was just going through a horrendous shed but maybe I'm just being hopeful. What I don't understand though is that I diffused so quickly, surely those hairs which fall out should miniaturise rather than completely fall out never to regrow?

Still unsure what to do with regards my finasteride dose. Still trying the 1.25mg every other day. Also started using tricolimus for the past week. Doesn't seem to be doing much except for maybe making my scalp itchier but I don't believe a week is long enough to assess.

[Ziggyz123]

Yeah I hear you on the shedding aspect.. My hair got bad rather fast when the shedding started for me. I have a strong feeling the stopping minox is the cause for my shedding currently though. I was recently reading some threads at hair loss talk and a couple of guys went on DUT and had some itching, but they're regrowth was terrific regardless.

Some things that you could do would be to try and have the test done that tells you if you will respond to FIN, try dutasteride (I know it seems scary), and lastly you might just have a dry scalp that you think isn't dry. My derm gave me aveeno Nourish+dandruff control and it does kind of restore your hair. However, I think I have seb. Dermatitis now so it can only use it for like 2 days and then I switch to JJ baby shampoo.

[Ziggyz123]

I'm with you though man. I definitely am not responding to fin. It's almost like my body was trying to fight it and then when it came time for me to naturally shed seasonally, I had so much upregulation that it just wasted my hair. I actually did notice increased body hair growth to on my legs and my knuckles which was odd. Unfortunately I still haven't gotten blood work for any of this. Just had it done for anemia, thyroid, etc.. No hormone panel

[jamesst11]

Man, you are making me nervous Ziggy! I started over 3 months ago, and so far, haven't noticed too much. I do get a slight itch and a bit of tingling, but I don't remember if I had that before too. My libido is very slightly decreased, as in I can go a day or two without sex/masterbation and I don't get super horny, like I used too. Other than that, everything is hard to tell. I think I am shedding more on the sides of my head and all of them have a white bulb, but I am shedding less on the top? I feel less depressed than I used too. My skin looks amazing. When I play basketball or work out, I am more focused and aggressive.... I don't know, this stuff is kinda crazy. I am not 100% sure what aspects of these are in my head too.

[Dench57]

Hey guys,

So I went to see the dermatologist the other day. She basically thinks whatever I have can't be attributed to taking Propecia. It's not really surprising, everyone on hairloss forums have told me medical specialists will have no solution or explanation to this incredibly rare reaction. She said that people with androgenic alopecia do not suffer from burning/tingling/itchy sensations, that its nothing to do with MPB. I guess there's no scientific explanation as to what exactly causes "MPB itch", it's just a thing everybody on hairloss forums reports. She looked at my scalp and did admit there was significant miniaturization and thinning where the burning is the worst. I'm still certain that what I have is due to DHT and massively upregulated androgen receptors - I'm going to see an endocrinologist on Friday and will ask for a blood test to check my DHT. I don't even know if you can test for androgen receptor sensitivity but I will ask.

Her clinical impression was that I have atypical pain syndrome - same principle as burning scalp syndrome I imagine - "substance P" and various chemicals/neurotransmitters getting confused and sending pain signals to the brain. She prescribed me Amitriptyline to take 10mg daily, and gradually increasing my dose. This is a tricylic anti-depressant which will supposedly help with the pain and itchiness in my scalp. She also prescribed Betacap, a corticosteroid, to be applied twice daily to my scalp. She also said to stop using ketoconazole shampoo because it is not useful in treating MPB (everyone on here knows keto is mildly useful) and to start using T-Gel sensitive shampoo daily instead. I'll follow her instructions but I'm not hopeful.

I'm trying to keep an open mind but I'm almost certain neither of these things will work. I would honestly love it to be atypical pain syndrome, ANYTHING apart from what I think it is (massively accelerated MPB). The anti-depressant may subdue the pain somewhat but it will just be masking the underlying problem - the accelerated hairloss will continue even if I'm blocking out the pain. I can't even believe I'm having to take anti-depressants, I have no history of clinical depression and was the happiest guy in the world until this burning itch started. And to think all the side effects anti-depressants will come with, to combat the effects of some stupid hairloss drug.

I'll be seeing her again in 4 weeks to see if the treatment is working. She did mention a scalp biopsy then which I'm sure I'll have to do.

My hair is just awful now, can completely see my scalp above my right temple where the burning is worst, and both my temples are itchy and burning, and have receded massively since starting Propecia. I keep thinking of getting a hair transplant to fill in my temples, but there's not really much point when my MPB is this aggressive, the area behind my temples will just disappear within the next year or two as well.

[Dench57]

Also in the last few weeks I noticed the burning itch is really noticeable on my left temple now, as well as my right. It was actually manageable mentally when it was just the right side, I could kid myself that it was some sort of inflammation and not MPB, because it wasn't balanced. Now the itch is basically equal on both temples. So this thing is definitely getting worse, not better, after 6 months off Fin. Which really makes me give up hope I will ever be free from this. I can't even pretend that it's going to resolve itself when its actually getting worse.

This is literally the definition of torture. Natural MPB is bad enough but I can't imagine many worse things for someone to experience than self-inflicted, permanently accelerated MPB. The constant physical irritation and pain, and the mental side of knowing that it's hair being burnt away.

I would happily trade my NW2 with 24 hour burning itch for a NW3 with no MPB itch.

[Dench57]

I have been looking at PGD2/CTRH2 stuff like TM, OC, Indo/Chromo and Ramatroban. There's literally no evidence that any of this stuff works across any of the forums though, a few threads of people saying it helped with shedding, and people getting excited about the theory, but so few real world results. Just gonna be another topical Spiro/Fluridil isn't it.

[jamesst11]

Hey Dench, I am sorry to hear you're going through all this bull sh*t. I started fin about 3.5. months ago. I am getting this burning/itching, only in ONE specific spot in my left temple. Exactly where my damned hair transplants were placed. I am loosing what I think is a "normal" amount of hair still throughout my head, but starting to get concerned.
Anyway, can you provide for us some sort of timeline with your fin usage??? for example:

month 1 - slightly decreased libido, minor scalp itch
month 2 - shedding, scalp itch...

so and and so forth, so maybe we can help figure things out? It seems like you have a similar situation to Ziggy and I want to also beware of physical signs that may indicate something is off. also, let us know what your T panel says. Thanks!!

[Joranso]

I have been looking at PGD2/CTRH2 stuff like TM, OC, Indo/Chromo and Ramatroban. There's literally no evidence that any of this stuff works across any of the forums though, a few threads of people saying it helped with shedding, and people getting excited about the theory, but so few real world results. Just gonna be another topical Spiro/Fluridil isn't it.

it can be aggravating looking for a new solution

[Ziggyz123]

Yo guys! Dench man, I heard that those inhibit substance P so that's a good place to start. I read a lot of good about it blocking out the pain so I hope to god that helps you. I was wondering, do the hairs you shed look weird at all? I shed really odd hairs some times with almost like a build up covering the root.. Check these out that I saved.. Do you get this??

[Ziggyz123]

I just showered so my hands look freaking pruny my bad haha

[Dench57]

Hey Dench, I am sorry to hear you're going through all this bull sh*t. I started fin about 3.5. months ago. I am getting this burning/itching, only in ONE specific spot in my left temple. Exactly where my damned hair transplants were placed. I am loosing what I think is a "normal" amount of hair still throughout my head, but starting to get concerned.
Anyway, can you provide for us some sort of timeline with your fin usage??? for example:

month 1 - slightly decreased libido, minor scalp itch
month 2 - shedding, scalp itch...

so and and so forth, so maybe we can help figure things out? It seems like you have a similar situation to Ziggy and I want to also beware of physical signs that may indicate something is off. also, let us know what your T panel says. Thanks!!

Hi James,

When my itch first started, it was just above my right temple. It is still worse in that place, but now it has progressed to other areas along my hairline. I never have any itching or burning in sides, back or crown of my head (places where I'm pretty much immune to DHT I think - whole family has only frontal receding). So it's definitely MPB related, as much as I would love to be it was dermatitis, folliculitis, thyroid issue or any other hundred things it could be.

I think myself and Ziggy may be experiencing slightly different things, my itch started within 3 weeks of starting Fin along with the usual symptons of reflex-hyper (increased libido, increased sebum on hair and face, scalp, accelerated MPB). From what little we know of reflex-hyper, if it's gonna happen, it should happen within a month or so of taking the drug. But we don't know anything about it really, it's speculation but respected people like Dr. Lee/Proctor/Bryan Shelton believed it to be possible from Fin. I think Ziggy's thing started after like 9 months or something? And I think he was fine on Fin before that. I'm sure he can confirm. I've also never experienced increased shedding to speak of, always had about 5-10 hairs on my hands in the shower before, during and after Fin (touch wood, I really don't need shedding to add to this shit).

Thats interesting that you're experiencing the burning/itch where your transplanted hairs are, those are supposed to be immune to DHT right? I guess you'll know soon if they're in trouble, all my hairs miniaturized and became brittle and thin before falling out. Not sure if you mentioned before but I would advise going to see a dermatologist with your concerns, I put off seeing mine for a few months thinking it would resolve itself which was stupid.

My brief timeline
Month 1: Started on .5mg Propecia, noticed a burning itch above my right temple within 3 weeks
Month 2: Burning intensified, started noticing increased sebum production (hair would be oily within 24 hours of showering when usually it was 2-3 days) and increased sex drive (rock solid boners like I never had before)
Month 3: Dropped down to 0.25mg to taper off, stayed like this for 4 weeks before dropping Fin completely in February 2015

So now 6 months later, the itching burn is still worst above my right temple but is now all across my frontal hairline. If anything I would say it has gotten worse. Tried a variety of things that haven't helped at all, the only item I've used which helps even for 20 mins is probably Regenepure DR (Keto shampoo, natural ingredients, smells minty and seems to decrease sebum? maybe)

I've had a basic blood test done, everything came back normal, testosterone was fairly high, 29 nmol/l (normal range is 5-30 nmol/l) but certainly not high enough to explain any of this.

[Dench57]

Yo guys! Dench man, I heard that those inhibit substance P so that's a good place to start. I read a lot of good about it blocking out the pain so I hope to god that helps you. I was wondering, do the hairs you shed look weird at all? I shed really odd hairs some times with almost like a build up covering the root.. Check these out that I saved.. Do you get this??

Yo Zig,

Yeah I've heard of the substance P theory before (I bought that capsaicin shampoo and it did **** all, so I kind of ruled out "burning scalp syndrome" which is what I think my derm thinks I have). I'm sure these anti-depressants will help to mask the extreme burning/pain, but they won't stop the tingling itch along my hairline, which is just as bad (I know that sounds stupid, but it's just because I know that tingly itch is MPB itch and I'm losing hair). Like I said before, I want to find the ****ing root cause of whatever is happening here and stop it, not just mask it and let it continue to rape my hair. This is the 21st century and somebody or something must have some answers for this torture.

I've certainly never shed hairs with that stuff on the end, mine just have the tiny white bulb as usual. I'm not an expert but I thought that is either excess sebum or possibly an indicator of some other inflammation or fungus perhaps? But your dermatologists didn't tell you anything about that did they? Are you using keto shampoo? Sorry I'm sure you've told me before, my memory sucks

Anyway I'm seeing my endocrinologist on Friday. I've really got to do some more research into this MPB itch bullshit because it's not just as simple as DHT attacking hair follicles. There's so much other stuff way over my head that's going on (cytokines, prostoglandins, various "free radicals" and neuropeptides and blah blah) contributing to this micro-inflammation/auto-immune response that manifests itself as the MPB itch. If I can figure out exactly what it is, then maybe a medical professional can point me in the right direction of treatment. I wish Bryan Shelton was still around to explain this crap to me, surely one of the biochem/expert people on this forum must be able to explain it.