Skin quality/thickness and AGA. Are there any studies?

[Serverr]

I'm sure this has been brought up before, but are there any studies about the correlation between skin quality/thickness on the scalp and AGA? I would like to give them a read.

I'm just curious because all my friends who are not losing any hair have the same thickness and quality on their scalp as they have on the sides of the head, not as tight as mine. And I am also starting to see some minor quality changes to my vellus hairs after starting scalp exercises and using skin thickening products (not doing anything major though, and only been doing it for about 2 months). My hairloss is not very agressive, currently NW3-ish.

Thx.

[gainspotter]

Don't think any of that makes a difference. It's what's inside the body that makes us lose hair.

Just join the rest of us in boarding the bald train

[Serverr]

I've come to terms with losing my hair, it's fine. That was not my question though

[Wurlito]

There is a whole theory about that in fact (called the Detumescence Therapy). An article has been published in 2012, explaining that the thickness of the scalp is linked to hair loss, and that by massaging your skin daily (2x20 mins per day) for several months, you may be able to notice important regrowth (by improving blood flow around the follicles). There isn't much information on the results of the study, except some poorly taken photographs.

Here is the link to the article :

http://www.omicsonline.org/2155-9554/2155-9554-3-138.php

You will find more info on blogs and forums related to this method. I started doing it last week, I'll see where it takes me.
I guess that it replaces the effect of Minoxidil in some way as it thins the skin on the top of the head and increases blood flow. It is supposed to reduce the amount of DHT in this area as well.

[Serverr]

There is a whole theory about that in fact (called the Detumescence Therapy). An article has been published in 2012, explaining that the thickness of the scalp is linked to hair loss, and that by massaging your skin daily (2x20 mins per day) for several months, you may be able to notice important regrowth (by improving blood flow around the follicles). There isn't much information on the results of the study, except some poorly taken photographs.

Here is the link to the article :

http://www.omicsonline.org/2155-9554/2155-9554-3-138.php

You will find more info on blogs and forums related to this method. I started doing it last week, I'll see where it takes me.
I guess that it replaces the effect of Minoxidil in some way as it thins the skin on the top of the head and increases blood flow. It is supposed to reduce the amount of DHT in this area as well.

Thanks a lot man! I've heard of the massage routine and am doing my own version of it combined with scalp exercises. I would really like to know/experiment with different skin thickening products if there are any(?), not just making the scalp skin thicker but getting close to the same quality as I have on the sides of my head. As I said in the original post, my friends who are not losing any hair have closer to the same quality as they do on the sides on their scalps.

Also when I google people with a shaved head who have hair (Wentworth Miller among others), I find that the skin on their scalp looks different than people who have lost hair because of AGA. Maybe I'm delusional

[Wurlito]

Well, as explained in the article, for bald men, the skin on the top of the head is usually thicker than on the sides or on the back. I am 26 y.o with a diffuse NW 2-3, and I can feel it too, my skin is much harder on the top than on the sides. I only need 2 fingers to "squeeze" it if I do it on the side while I need both my hands and quite some strength to do it on the top.

Concerning the fact of using products to improve the effect, I got to say that I don't know the answer, I only rely on my fingers to relax my scalp.

[kirklandism]

I'm sure this has been brought up before, but are there any studies about the correlation between skin quality/thickness on the scalp and AGA? I would like to give them a read.

I'm just curious because all my friends who are not losing any hair have the same thickness and quality on their scalp as they have on the sides of the head, not as tight as mine. And I am also starting to see some minor quality changes to my vellus hairs after starting scalp exercises and using skin thickening products (not doing anything major though, and only been doing it for about 2 months). My hairloss is not very agressive, currently NW3-ish.

Thx.

I'll try and come up with the actual doctors who did the study but there was one that looked at cadavers with AGA. They found that that there was a depleted layer of fat under the balding scalp as opposed to the areas with hair.

[Serverr]

Cool! Yeah please report if you find something.

[youngin]

Yes there is a study where the remove bald vs non-bald skin and measure thickness and everything. Very detailed. Do not have it handy though. Also there are some good ones on perifollicular fibrosis that have detailed pictures of the balding skin showing strips of calcified skin in the full study.

[ThisSucksDude]

That "DT" massage therapy is pure bullshit.

Didn't the original article say there was full regrowth in 10 MONTHS?

People were doing it for longer than that and couldn't provide photos.

It was just a horseshit article from japan or korea.

I was doing it for a month or two and since no one was giving clear instructions and I was desperate as ****, all I did was end up denting a part of my soft tissue scalp from pressing so hard.

[Serverr]

That "DT" massage therapy is pure bullshit.

Didn't the original article say there was full regrowth in 10 MONTHS?

People were doing it for longer than that and couldn't provide photos.

It was just a horseshit article from japan or korea.

I was doing it for a month or two and since no one was giving clear instructions and I was desperate as ****, all I did was end up denting a part of my soft tissue scalp from pressing so hard.

I don't see any downsides to it though (not pressing as hard as you were I guess lol!). I'm not doing the 2x20 mins massage they are talking about, I'm doing a way less time consuming method I made up myself + scalp exercises (I know I know ). And I have halted my hairloss since I started, but as I said earlier it wasn't very aggressive to begin with and yes, I know hairloss isn't always consistent.

[Serverr]

Googled perifollicular fibrosis.. Even more convinced to keep the blood flowing to my scalp now >_>

[FeelsBad]

It has more to do with the layer of fat under the skin than the skin itself

[Serverr]

It has more to do with the layer of fat under the skin than the skin itself

Yeah, I've been reading more into that in the last week. I'm pretty convinced all the big companies battling this are taking the wrong approach.

Seems pretty obvious to me that the hair needs good growing grounds.

EDIT: I don't think more bloodflow to the scalp hurts though, that's where you get the nutrients from after all. (Isn't that what minoxdil does anyway?)

[Swooping]

In a healthy hair follicle cycle the micro environment of the hair follicle communicates with the macro-environment (surrounding tissue). This leads to a tremendous increase of vascularization and adipogenesis in anagen. In telogen there is barely any vascularization at all (almost non-existent) and there is a lack of adipose tissue. These changes lead to a thicker dermis in anagen as you can see on the picture.

Now in AGA you see that the morphology of the hair follicles changes dramatically too. Similar to telogen, but more extreme. Often it is accompanied by inflammation and in late AGA even fibrosis can set in (scar tissue, that can lead to destruction of the hair follicle similar to cicatrial alopecia).

Thus to me it sounds logically that in a bald area the skin is thinner and feels more firm. Although I don't think a study exists that measures the differences in skin thickness.