follicept - what's this?

[follicept]

Glad to hear from follicep here. It's good to hear more information - thanks for showing patience and empathy in responding to (understandable) scepticism on the forum. I'm looking forward to the human trials over the next few weeks. The science and professor behind the treatment are making me feel hopeful. Worst case scenario is it doesn't work and nobody loses any money.

Thanks! Our pleasure. Exactly right, it is very important to us to do things with integrity, and after all he is a doctor- do no harm.

[Swooping]

Haha. My IQ is actually quite high, and I've studied at two of the best universities in the country. You don't even know how to speak English, and your "facts" are no more proven than any predictions that I myself have made. I don't purport to know much, if anything, about hair, other than the things I can discern from reading scientific studies. I generally assume though that if top researchers are trying something, tren there might be something to it. Follicept does not bank on mpb for it's success, their technology was never about curing alopecia. They have no reason to post false results for little profit.

I come with legitimate facts which disprove this treatment simple as that. If you still think otherwise that is up to you. You can buy some magic dust for on your head for 1k, I don't care. Now stop talking to me, not going to spend my time on you.

Turns out I was mistaken in some of my explanation. From the science team:

Transdermal as we use the term just means getting it into the dermis to reach the dermal papilla of the hair follicle. It's not easy to get across the stratum corneum and the epidermal cellular layers, both of which are rate-limiting for drug delivery. I don't know if nano formulations or nano-rolling actually address the issue. And I certainly don't know of any FDA-approved indication for the use of IGF-1 injections to treat pattern baldness. Even if there were, you would need a pretty high serum level to overcome the effects of high testosterone. Presumably, normal IGF-1 levels are not sufficient or else we wouldn't be having this discussion. Our goal is to deliver IGF-1 to the DP (but not systemically) at levels that block testosterone pathway.

That's what I thought. As I explained microneedling disrupts the stratum corneum and the epidermal level, therefore molecular compounds up to 45kDa can penetrate. Injections obviously can inject the desired compound directly to where it needs to go. Nano-formulations also allows for high molecular compounds to surpass the skin through follicular penetration. It's on a different fashion but literally crawls "around" the space of the hair follicle all up to the bulb.

Caregen for example from Korea uses this technology (by staying under 100nm particle size); http://www.caregen.co.kr/rnd01.php. IGF-1 here; http://www.caregen.co.kr/growthfactors04.php. Thanks again though.

It's better illustrated with a picture btw for the nano delivery;

[nave13579]

Thanks! Our pleasure. Exactly right, it is very important to us to do things with integrity, and after all he is a doctor- do no harm.

Btw Follicept, I made a post this morning on the hairloss forum on reddit (www.reddit.com/r/tressless) to help get the word out. The post is now "stickied" meaning it will always be the top post for anyone who looks at the forum.

Just showing you that you have community support! Thanks again

[follicept]

Btw Follicept, I made a post this morning on the hairloss forum on reddit (www.reddit.com/r/tressless) to help get the word out. The post is now "stickied" meaning it will always be the top post for anyone who looks at the forum.

Just showing you that you have community support! Thanks again

Wow, awesome, thank you so much! I was just wondering about reddit about 10 minutes ago to see if anything had happened there. Haha. Really appreciate it.

[NeedHairASAP]

Thanks! Our pleasure. Exactly right, it is very important to us to do things with integrity, and after all he is a doctor- do no harm.

thanks for taking the time to come to this forum and post. I think it's a good investment of your time.

[sdsurfin]

Swioping all you do us discredit possibilities based on tangential data. Obviously none of us are sure that this will work, but even that Korean study you posted contradicts your own analysis. The treatment did in fact improve their hair in that study, and that study did not employ the tech that these guys use. I'm not certain of anything, except for the fact that you're just trying to show off and you're pretty bitter at the state of things. I guess we should all just take your word over that of a Harvard educated doctor though when it comes to possible treatments. We are all pretty pessimistic about hair loss, but to say that people like cotsarellis have no idea what they are doing is pretty ridiculous. None if these things are probably the cure, but they may make a big difference for many. What do you think about replicel? So you think that science is bullshit too? You should really get a job as an advisor to these companies, you might save them a lot if wasted time and money haha. What a sanctimonious clown.

[Swooping]

Swioping all you do us discredit possibilities based on tangential data. Obviously none of us are sure that this will work, but even that Korean study you posted contradicts your own analysis. The treatment did in fact improve their hair in that study, and that study did not employ the tech that these guys use. I'm not certain of anything, except for the fact that you're just trying to show off and you're pretty bitter at the state of things. I guess we should all just take your word over that of a Harvard educated doctor though when it comes to possible treatments. We are all pretty pessimistic about hair loss, but to say that people like cotsarellis have no idea what they are doing is pretty ridiculous. None if these things are probably the cure, but they may make a big difference for many. What do you think about replicel? So you think that science is bullshit too? You should really get a job as an advisor to these companies, you might save them a lot if wasted time and money haha. What a sanctimonious clown.

I never said that Cotsarelis doesn't know what he is doing. I said that no researchers who are just as educated as him never followed up his work or directed their directions in the PGD2 angle. And that is a cold hard fact. If you look across the studies they deflect from that angle.

There isn't any tangential data dumbass. Ask to any dermatology expert or someone who has an expertise in dermal delivery, if injections ain't suffice for IGF-1 delivery in the dermis. Go look up studies, if you don't think that microneedling disrupts the skin barrier and allows for penetration of higher kilodalton compounds. Go search up several studies which proves the follicular delivery of nano- or liposome formulations into the bulb. That korean multi million company also has several high skilled researchers and a R&D pumping in money too. Do I need to link you again? http://www.caregen.co.kr/growthfactors04.php

But wait I remember something, didn't you also say CB-03-01 had problems delivering to the dermis when this forum was in big fuzz about a "appropriate vehicle" for it? All based on some anecdotal bullshit. Guess what, it isn't, like I told and several others did because it is a low dalton compound and lipophilic.

Again I'll say it one more time to you. People have tried IGF-1 several times including other growth factors. They have injected them directly into the scalp. They have applied it in combination with microneedling. They have also used these nano formulations. Many people did.Not only IGF-1 but also compounds like FGF-2, FGF-7, KGF, VEGF, WNT's, NOGGIN. If it was a success you would be using it right now, but perhaps that is something you can't grasp baboon.

[Gerhard]

Both of you need to stop making personal remarks and calm down. This is good news even if it's a dud. It's good to see that someone has shown an interest in any way, shape, or form. Until results are posted, you might as well bite your tongues and wait.

[sdsurfin]

Baboon haha. Those facts are still all tangential and only possibly predictive at best. The fact that others didn't follow up on cotsarellis' research means absolutely nothing. And it's not even true. They were in talks with kythera from the outset, and on top of that were looking to commercialize and gain from their knowledge. You have no idea who might be out there studying the same thing, or what companies have thought about capitalizing in it. I was actually one of the people that said CB did not have issues due to the vehicle. I also have never claimed to know any result 10o percent as you do. I have only brought up possibilities, both negative and positive. All you do I shoot down ideas and people based on anecdotal and at best slightly linked information that you see online. I still trust established hair doctors over you as far as placing my hopes. And again , that Korean study you linked actually improved hair, so not sure what your point is.

[Swooping]

Baboon haha. Those facts are still all tangential and only possibly predictive at best. The fact that others didn't follow up on cotsarellis' research means absolutely nothing. And it's not even true. They were in talks with kythera from the outset, and on top of that were looking to commercialize and gain from their knowledge. You have no idea who might be out there studying the same thing, or what companies have thought about capitalizing in it. I was actually one of the people that said CB did not have issues due to the vehicle. I also have never claimed to know any result 10o percent as you do. I have only brought up possibilities, both negative and positive. All you do I shoot down ideas and people based on anecdotal and at best slightly linked information that you see online. I still trust established hair doctors over you as far as placing my hopes. And again , that Korean study you linked actually improved hair, so not sure what your point is.

Predictive at best? The best validation is in vivo experimenting by observation. At least good that we don't have scientists like you or we would not even be sitting with any treatment including finasteride & minoxidil, but rather some snake-oil. You literally know nothing, it's hilarious. My point is that this will be a sub-par treatment or not effective at all. Outperforming minoxidil? Haha!

IGF-1 is nothing "new" at all, has been used for ages, and dermal delivery to the hair follicle isn't a problem, has been tried by many people too including directly to the hair follicle, simple as that.

[sdsurfin]

http://www.haargroeispecialist.nl/resources/product-files/files/Effects-of-topical-application-of-growth-factors-followed-by-microneedle-therapy-in-women-with-female-pattern-hair-loss-A-pilot-study.pdf

that's the micro needling study with korean women. Using IGF improved the hair shafts. So not sure what you're harping on about. If micro needling causes improvement, follicepts method might work even better. And this study was on women, that might also have an impact. Yeah, this might not work, but who knows, not you swooping. Some bodybuilder injecting that stuff with a syringe into his scalp veins is not the same thing. And tbh, for ever account of no effect i found another from some dude saying it improved his hair. I doubt this is some great panacea or cure for mpb, but the best we can do is support these guys and see if it has any benefit. My hunch is that it might be better than rogaine, which might be enough to hold some of us over for a while. especially if its inexpensive.

[sdsurfin]

swooping why don't you link all these studies you speak of where IGF has been used to try to improve hair? All I can find ar anecdotal reports from bodybuilders, and who knows how they inject IGF or at what dose- bloodstream IGF has no correlation to improved hair, nor does follicept claim it does. You keep saying people have injected it into the follicle, but I can't find one example of this anywhere. The only one is the study with the korean women, which was actually successful to some degree.....

[Swooping]

Better than Rogaine? you don't even know 1 pathway on which Rogaine acts and goes saying " I think this will be better than rogaine". I don't care what you "think". Take Histogen for example, these guys are culturing human cells which are expressing several growth factors and proteins. Yet they can't outperform Rogaine. Replicel even in their 1st phase couldn't show better results than Rogaine. These DSC cells of Replicel also express several growth factors and I bet IGF-1 (don't know for sure) is one of them, alongside shitload others. And you think that IGF-1 is going to outperform Rogaine? You are twisted in your mind, or just dumb. You know literally nothing on the implications of AGA, yet talk like you know everything without providing any proof. That's a big difference.

FYI, several people at a other private forum have tried the exact formulation as in the study I just posted above. Have a search furthermore for "IGF-1 hair forum" on google. Oh btw you can buy the formulation here from that study; http://www.imediway.com/#!treatments/cee5. Buy it and show us your magnificent hair growth with documentation

Some bodybuilder injecting that stuff with a syringe into his scalp veins is not the same thing.

Injections are still one of the best delivery method of getting high kilodalton molecules in the dermis, Einstein.

If micro needling causes improvement, follicepts method might work even better.

Rofl, another shitty statement. How has micro needling even to do with applying IGF-1? You are really full of anecdotal shit.

[Gerhard]

Jesus f'ing Christ. I and the community as a whole appreciate both of your insights and comments on this product. However, until it is out on the market or more positive clinical tests reported (which apparently could be in the fall of 2015) we might as well just shut the **** up and wait for more information. They've made it clear that they're genuinely sympathetic to the plight of hair loss. Whether their drug works or not remains to be seen. For now, we may as well stop acting like high school girls and quit bickering.

[nave13579]

Jesus f'ing Christ. I and the community as a whole appreciate both of your insights and comments on this product. However, until it is out on the market or more positive clinical tests reported (which apparently could be in the fall of 2015) we might as well just shut the **** up and wait for more information. They've made it clear that they're genuinely sympathetic to the plight of hair loss. Whether their drug works or not remains to be seen. For now, we may as well stop acting like high school girls and quit bickering.

Preech