Sm04554

[hairgrowth]

[QUOTE=KO1;188604]They have not released the mechanism by which it works, it might be a GSK-3b modulator, in which case I expect it to be more potent than VPA or 6BIO. This is a Pfizer molecule which the firm found in their chemical library and have the rights to.

How do you know?

[macbeth81]

They have a patent using b-diketones, y-diketones, and y-hydroxyketones to activate WNT/beta-catenin signaling. It is the only patent I found mentioning the treatment of hair loss.

http://www.faqs.org/patents/app/20140005228

Someone posted a comment on an article stating it did not meet its efficacy goals. Obviously not proof, just the rumour mill. I don't see how they would see much efficacy after 28 days using the compound for only 2 weeks.

http://www.ipscell.com/2014/10/stem-cells-for-baldness-hope-versus-hype-for-hair/#comment-29509

[ryan82]

Many go dead after Phase I too *cough*Aderans,RU58841,neosh,etc*cough*

do you know why RU58841 dies in phase 1 ?

[sdsurfin]

They have a patent using b-diketones, y-diketones, and y-hydroxyketones to activate WNT/beta-catenin signaling. It is the only patent I found mentioning the treatment of hair loss.

http://www.faqs.org/patents/app/20140005228

Someone posted a comment on an article stating it did not meet its efficacy goals. Obviously not proof, just the rumour mill. I don't see how they would see much efficacy after 28 days using the compound for only 2 weeks.

http://www.ipscell.com/2014/10/stem-...#comment-29509

hmmm that sucks. if you read the trial data though they were not really testing in any real way for efficacy. was just a safety trial with questions asked to the patients. whoever posted that comment could have misunderstood. I think this actually sounds much more promising than CB. has big money behind it and tons of test locations for phase 2. good to see some research being applied, and i think in the near future a combo of something like this with an anti androgen could be really great. just goes to show these things can come out of the blue.

[KO1]

https://www.anzctr.org.au/Trial/Registration/TrialReview.aspx?id=364645

They applied the drug for 14 days, and measured hair growth on Day 28, 14 days after completion of treatment. Hard to see growth in 28 days IMHO.

[Tenma]

Also in phase I they only recruited higher Nws. Obviously not much will grow on their heads in only 28 days.

I find it hard to believe they would spend millions of dollars on a big ass phase II clinical trial (300 participants) if phase I werent what the company expected.

The data obtained was exciting enough for their investors/partners to push this forward.

[KO1]

Yep, this is the trial that matters....if it works, it will go to P3 presumably.

[Swooping]

hmmm that sucks. if you read the trial data though they were not really testing in any real way for efficacy. was just a safety trial with questions asked to the patients. whoever posted that comment could have misunderstood. I think this actually sounds much more promising than CB. has big money behind it and tons of test locations for phase 2. good to see some research being applied, and i think in the near future a combo of something like this with an anti androgen could be really great. just goes to show these things can come out of the blue.

Fully agree. Way more exciting than cb-03-01. And phase 1 is primary safety indeed.

[rdawg]

do you know why RU58841 dies in phase 1 ?

It died in phase II and it was for a very good reason.

Finasteride was a simple take one a day drug that was cheap, RU had a much more complex way of treatment, was more expensive and seemed only slightly more effective. Essentially it wasn't worth it to release.

[charlie76761]

Great news re http://www.clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/sh...dy/NCT02275351.

V interesting they are looking for results at 45 and 90 days only rather than 6 mths for CB... could have a more accelerated effect.


But does anyone know the actual compound as there is someone who is v interested but cant 100% confirm the structure ... he may live in China

apparently it's not here http://www.faqs.org/patents/app/20140005228

[Boldy]

It died in phase II and it was for a very good reason.

Finasteride was a simple take one a day drug that was cheap, RU had a much more complex way of treatment, was more expensive and seemed only slightly more effective. Essentially it wasn't worth it to release.

the investors behind RU maybe lost interest due to the competition and easiness of finasteride.. only 1 magic pil a day and that's it.

back on-topic, a good gsk3b inhibitor or wnt agonist should be in each regieme,

check this clinical trial with VPA:

(mice study) https://www.dropbox.com/s/je639j2ble...urine.pdf?dl=0



Topical valproic acid increases the hair count in male
patients with androgenetic alopecia: A randomized,
comparative, clinical feasibility study using phototrichogram
analysis

(VPA wnt inducer Human clinical trial) https://www.dropbox.com/s/klnqvyzqwn...0male.pdf?dl=0

Efficacy assessment
The representative clinical photographs and macrophotographs
are presented at baseline and after 24 weeks of treatment
(Fig. 2). The total hair count increased after 24 weeks of treatment
in the VPA group; the median hair counts were 181/cm2
(range, 125–241) at baseline and 192/cm2 (range, 153–271) at
24 weeks. However, the total hair count did not change in the
placebo group; the median hair counts were 194/cm2 (range,
155–244) at baseline and 197/cm2 (range, 132–253) at
24 weeks (Fig. 3a). The median change in total hair count from
the baseline was 23/cm2 (range, 17 to 39) in the VPA group
and 1/cm2 (range, 68 to 70) in the placebo group, and the
difference between groups was statistically significant
(P = 0.047; Fig. 3b)

[charlie76761]

Hi Boldy, interesting, do you know where supplies a proven GSK3B Inhib that works on Human MPB? Any reports on these forums of success plus compound and supplier

Our Chinese friend has sent me the attached that was produced in Jan but i'm not sure why it was developed and whether verified as working in Human MPB and if a ethan/PG vehicle would do the trick? Have you seen before?

Currently use neogenic with 20mg RU so wouldnt mind dropping in GSK3B... but only if the compound was directionally proven for MPB....

Thoughts?

Thanks

[Boldy]

The study i posted a post earlier proves that vpa works in humans, but less than minoxidil.

the treatments thus far are very limited due to damaged/aged cells. the key would be getting rid of these cells by superficial damage, . our best option now is to to induce apoptosis in the cells by superficial damage, and get them replaced. we have enough stemcells, wnt/gsk3b inhibitors can help to turn the stemcells into progenitor cells into specialized cells. (on paper again), but that is our best option for now. the new cells wills till be aga cells, with other words precautions should be taken to halt aga.
ru/fin/dut etc..


that picture you attached is 6-bio. it is used in almost all vitro studies because it is one the most powerful gsk3b inhibitors out there
we did a 6-bio groupbuy in January with 5-10 people but not sure if anyone gave it a fair try.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=gsk3+6+bio

https://www.dropbox.com/s/9rjdp5yn5xc4ksb/49%20Restoration%20of%20the%20intrinsic%20properties%20of%20human%20dermal%20papilla.pdf?dl=0

it is used to restore the dp inductive properties in Vitro without 3D culture..


it is never tried on humans before, but we know for example that it is 40.000 times stronger gsk3b inhibitor than Lithium that dr cots was experimenting with.


I have seen people trying Lithium, VPA/sodium valproate, 6-Bio, but havent really seen wohw results thus far and I expect the same with Sm04554, limited results on its own. it would be interesting combined with wounding though.

[hellouser]

The study i posted a post earlier proves that vpa works in humans, but less than minoxidil.

the treatments thus far are very limited due to damaged/aged cells. the key would be getting rid of these cells by superficial damage, . our best option now is to to induce apoptosis in the cells by superficial damage, and get them replaced. we have enough stemcells, wnt/gsk3b inhibitors can help to turn the stemcells into progenitor cells into specialized cells. (on paper again), but that is our best option for now. the new cells wills till be aga cells, with other words precautions should be taken to halt aga.
ru/fin/dut etc..


that picture you attached is 6-bio. it is used in almost all vitro studies because it is one the most powerful gsk3b inhibitors out there
we did a 6-bio groupbuy in January with 5-10 people but not sure if anyone gave it a fair try.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=gsk3+6+bio

https://www.dropbox.com/s/9rjdp5yn5xc4ksb/49%20Restoration%20of%20the%20intrinsic%20properties%20of%20human%20dermal%20papilla.pdf?dl=0

it is used to restore the dp inductive properties in Vitro without 3D culture..


it is never tried on humans before, but we know for example that it is 40.000 times stronger gsk3b inhibitor than Lithium that dr cots was experimenting with.


I have seen people trying Lithium, VPA/sodium valproate, 6-Bio, but havent really seen wohw results thus far and I expect the same with Sm04554, limited results on its own. it would be interesting combined with wounding though.

Isn't chlorine dioxide supposed to renew cells? Could this not potentially work in combination?

[KO1]

Precisely, wnt mimics are good enough to give us some growth, but what we need is to massively stimulate SCs to produce progenitor cells. Hence a wounding-topical combo, follica only used lithium, and vpa is better than lithium and still may not be enough. So a really potent promoter after wounding, on paper at least...