Dermarolling Community Trial

[Chromeo]

I have to disagree, it's not about needle length causing injury, it's about getting the minoxidil past the startum corneum (the skin's natural barrier) and the needles stimulating healthy blood flow, exfoliating and massaging increasing scalp health. This whole 'no pain, no gain' business is very last century!!

Wrong. Completely different theory.

[greatjob!]

I have to disagree, it's not about needle length causing injury, it's about getting the minoxidil past the startum corneum (the skin's natural barrier) and the needles stimulating healthy blood flow, exfoliating and massaging increasing scalp health. This whole 'no pain, no gain' business is very last century!!

The biggest problem with using needles 1mm or greater is that they cause excessive pain and bleeding that inhibits the user from effectively treating themselves, it's as simple as that. The other downside is that the longer the needle the quicker they become blunt, a 1.5mm needle will only have a 4-6 uses before it becomes too blunt, a 1mm needle 1 - 2 months use max.

In addition it has been shown that skin needling by itself stimulates hair regrowth in the temple and hairline areas, minoxidil only stimulates hair regrowth in the crown area.

I have been using a 0.75mm needle daily for over 2 years with minoxidil 5% and copper peptides. I am really happy and my roller lasts for 12 months.

So much wrong in one place

[cloud9]

Hi guys. I have been reading the posts about dermarolling . I have a dermaroller with the 1.50 mm needles so I may give this a try once a week .

Here is a tread from immortalhair that may help with rolling . http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t...ing-with-20-Hi guys
A guy their is using a scalp peel with a 20 % glycolic acid and getting great results . He applies the peel once every day and leaves it on over night . Shampoos it off then uses a scalp massager to take off the dry skin . His before and after pictures are amazing . Take a look

[Axel]

I have to disagree, it's not about needle length causing injury, it's about getting the minoxidil past the startum corneum (the skin's natural barrier) and the needles stimulating healthy blood flow, exfoliating and massaging increasing scalp health. This whole 'no pain, no gain' business is very last century!!

The biggest problem with using needles 1mm or greater is that they cause excessive pain and bleeding that inhibits the user from effectively treating themselves, it's as simple as that. The other downside is that the longer the needle the quicker they become blunt, a 1.5mm needle will only have a 4-6 uses before it becomes too blunt, a 1mm needle 1 - 2 months use max.

In addition it has been shown that skin needling by itself stimulates hair regrowth in the temple and hairline areas, minoxidil only stimulates hair regrowth in the crown area.

I have been using a 0.75mm needle daily for over 2 years with minoxidil 5% and copper peptides. I am really happy and my roller lasts for 12 months.

OMG what a noob... Dude start reading the threads from the first page or you risk looking like a retard...

[chimera]

The guy in those pics did not used glycolic acid, he used salicylic acid (the guy who started that thread is using glycolic acid, but he is not the one in that pic).

Great results (if they are real). Wonder what's the difference between glycolic acid and salicylic acid and which option is better...

[clandestine]

cloud9; that is very, very interesting. I've read through thr entirety of the tread.

The OP's results look good, though I wish there were a before (and of better quality).

http://i75.servimg.com/u/f75/17/41/27/64/before10.png

This result that another user posted, salicylic acid peel, shows tremendous growth if true.

[Bocaj]

Hi guys. I have been reading the posts about dermarolling . I have a dermaroller with the 1.50 mm needles so I may give this a try once a week .

Here is a tread from immortalhair that may help with rolling . http://immortalhair.forumandco.com/t...ing-with-20-Hi guys
A guy their is using a scalp peel with a 20 % glycolic acid and getting great results . He applies the peel once every day and leaves it on over night . Shampoos it off then uses a scalp massager to take off the dry skin . His before and after pictures are amazing . Take a look

Ha..some of us think those pictures are actually of IH himself. Notice he took his own pictures down from his website. As I recall..the site those pics are from also went into a # of things IH has said and/or uses. Or are they from yet another site???

[fred970]

This is IH's hair, I recognize it too.

Those website and forum are a complete scam and should be shut down.

[Bocaj]

And he's still plagiarizing. Anyone feel free to pm me(from anywhere) for the latest example. Or the latest example I've found..with just a quick search.

Now back to dermarolling.....

[fred970]

Can't we do something to report that website?

[chimera]

This is IH's hair, I recognize it too.

Those website and forum are a complete scam and should be shut down.

No idea if it works or not, but how would glycolic acid be a scam?...

It's not like the guy from that thread is selling it, as you can find it almost everywhere...

[Bocaj]

He's not talking about that part of the thread. It's the site that was linked to there..the guy behind it..and the pictures in that thread.

[clandestine]

Ok, so you feel the original poster is lying as well?

After a while without posting in the forum, now I have something interesting to share with you :-)

First of all, I'll show what motivated me to do this experiment (found in an acne forum):

''The pathogenesis of male-pattern-baldness (MPB) is the same as acne. The first step in acne is a condition called follicular-hyperkeratinization or hyperkeratosis. Simply put, this means excess skin production inside and around the hair-follicle. The next step is caused by excess sebum production, followed by P.Acnes infestation of the pilosebaceous-follicle, with subsequent inflammation. So to summarize, MPB, just like acne, is caused by four main factors: (1) follicular-hyperkeratinization, (2) excess sebum production, (3) P.Acnes, and (4) inflammation [1].

Free-IGF-1 (insulin-like-growth-factor-1) stimulates the proliferation of keratinocytes (skin cells below the scalp). As the keratinocytes mature, they migrate to the top of the scalp and become what is known as corneocytes. If all goes well, the corneocytes are supposed to be shed off the scalp in a process called apoptosis. The shedding of corneocytes or the apoptosis of corneocytes, is under the influence of IGFBP-3 (insulin-like-growth-factor-binding-protein-3) and endogenous retinoids. In men with male-pattern-baldness, they have excess free-IGF-1 and not enough IGFBP-3 [2]. The result of this is hyperkeratinization; too much skin production, and not enough skin exfoliation. This causes the hair-follicle to be blocked by excess skin. Free-IGF-1 is required for keratinocyte proliferation in humans [3] and too much IGF-1 results in hyperkeratosis [4].

So, in order to reverse hyperkeratosis, exfoliating the scalp is needed. Using glycolic-acid topically is suggested. Glycolic-acid is what's called an alpha-hydroxy-acid. Alpha-hydroxy-acids are shown to diminish corneocyte cohesion, induce exfoliation and reverse hyperkeratosis. This should promote regrowth.

My experience: for the last 3 weeks, I've been using a 20% glycolic-acid lotion on my scalp every other day. In between days of scalp peel, I massage the scalp with a cheap body massager (sample: http://shopping-digital.com.ar/wp-co...ador-TURBO.jpg) in order to remove the dead-skin-cell "build-up" from my scalp. The massager does the job properly: while massaging, you could see dead skin falling as snow!

The results: Iīm regrowing hair in areas where I thought it never would regrow again... Itīs really an interesting approach and I am eager to see better results with each successive peeling...

I was wondering to try a 30% concentration, although itīs better to stick with "donīt fix it if ainīt broke" Wink

A recent pic of my receding hairline:
http://i76.servimg.com/u/f76/18/53/74/41/captur10.jpg

As someone else mentioned, he couldn't be selling anything; he's using glycolic acid, which can be bought anywhere.

And is apparently seeing terminal hair growth below his temporal recession.

[Bocaj]

No, I never said anything about the original poster. Unless those are HIS pictures in that thread. I'm referring to the pictures that are shown in the thread..not any links to any if there are any...

Nor did I or anyone else that I can see say that the OP was selling anything.

[rogering]

So much wrong in one place

Interesting.......I am unaware of any scientific reason or evidence as to how injuring your scalp (or in this case your dermis by using long needles) can stimulate hair regrowth. The injury to the dermis caused by skin needling stimulates collagen and elastin production to infill indented scars and improve skin texture and tone. There is no proof or reasoning to suggest that injuring dermis can stimulate hair regrowth. Rather skin needling stimulates hair regrowth by improved circulation via massage and scalp health via the stimulation of healthy exfoliation.

In fact, as the bulb or base of the hair follicle (where hair growth occurs and blood vessels attach to the hair follicle) is located in the lower dermis above the blood vessels in our skin there is great potential for longer needles to damage the hair follicle thereby actually inhibiting hair regrowth.

It is for this reason that shorter needles, 0.75mm in length, are able to pierce the stratum corneum and the epidermal/dermal junction enabling a radical increase in the absorption of product to the hair follicle whilst ensuring that the base of the follicle is protected.

Skin needling stimulates hair regrowth by -

* radically increasing the absorption of product
* massaging the scalp increasing blood flow to the scalp and hair follicles
* gently exfoliating the scalp promoting scalp health

It is the beauty of the process, it's simplicity.