S-equol again

[thechamp]

Is there really any difference between natures sunshine s equol or foxelen s s equol ?

[thechamp]

I still think we are going to have to wait for natures made s equol because it doesn't look like natures sunshine is 100 percent s equol , and a user has already been on natures sunshine product for two months with no changes not looking good

[kmit028]

I've been taking about 36 mg / day (12mg every ~8 hours) of Nature's Sunshine Equolibrium for 2 months now. Not long enough for any changes. In retrospect, I do think a blood test would've been a good idea before and after starting it.

are you also on FIN or RU or DUT?

And are you getting any side effects (limp dick, etc...)?

[cthulhu2]

Not necessarily, it could be, but I think it's more likely something closer to 50% R-equol and 50% S-equol. That may or may not be terribly significant. R-equol binds dht as well, as far as I could tell. I am not sure if the two are metabolized the same, however, which may affect the dosage. I plan to look into that when I get a chance.

I've been taking about 36 mg / day (12mg every ~8 hours) of Nature's Sunshine Equolibrium for 2 months now. Not long enough for any changes. In retrospect, I do think a blood test would've been a good idea before and after starting it.

My sister recently had blood work done. It would have been over 200 if she didn't have insurance; and this was for 1 test. I think before and after pictures would be just as useful. Do you mind taking some clear before and after pictures for us? Two weeks certainly isn't enough to make any discernible difference so I think the before and after shots would be valuable.

[Adaku]

So your saying natures sunshine is not 100 percent s-equol

Not necessarily, it could be, but I think it's more likely something closer to 50% R-equol and 50% S-equol. That may or may not be terribly significant. R-equol binds dht as well, as far as I could tell. I am not sure if the two are metabolized the same, however, which may affect the dosage. I plan to look into that when I get a chance.

I've been taking about 36 mg / day (12mg every ~8 hours) of Nature's Sunshine Equolibrium for 2 months now. Not long enough for any changes. In retrospect, I do think a blood test would've been a good idea before and after starting it.

[thechamp]

The product page for Nature's Sunshine Equolibrium states that "equol is a naturally occurring flavonoid found in some plants, including beans, cabbage and lettuce. It is a powerful antioxidant. Nature’s Sunshine’s Equolibrium uses a nature-identical source of equol derived from non-GMO daidzein."

I'm guessing that this is probably a racemic mixture since they are non-specific about it:

http://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/2012/05/23/whats-a-racemic-mixture/

It appears that it is possible to synthesize an R/S equol mixture from daidzein:

http://www.mdpi.com/2072-6643/2/3/340/pdf

"Racemic (±)-equol can be synthesized from daidzein and formonetin, which
are readily available in sufficient quantities from plants or can be prepared by chemical synthesis."

You can produce pure s-equol using a certain bacteria (on daidzein, I believe):

"The pure S-equol enantiomer can be produced by microbiological methods"

They may be doing either, and they may be isolating the s-equol from the racemic equol. It's hard to say which, but I'm thinking it's a mix of R and S equol.

So your saying natures sunshine is not 100 percent s-equol

[Adaku]

Also, Otsuka Pharmaceuticals, the parent company of NaturesMade/Pharmavite, released an s-equol product in Japan back in April:

http://www.otsuka.co.jp/en/product/equelle/

It hasn't quite made it to the states, however.

[Adaku]

The product page for Nature's Sunshine Equolibrium states that "equol is a naturally occurring flavonoid found in some plants, including beans, cabbage and lettuce. It is a powerful antioxidant. Nature’s Sunshine’s Equolibrium uses a nature-identical source of equol derived from non-GMO daidzein."

I'm guessing that this is probably a racemic mixture since they are non-specific about it:

http://www.masterorganicchemistry.com/2012/05/23/whats-a-racemic-mixture/

It appears that it is possible to synthesize an R/S equol mixture from daidzein:

http://www.mdpi.com/2072-6643/2/3/340/pdf

"Racemic (±)-equol can be synthesized from daidzein and formonetin, which
are readily available in sufficient quantities from plants or can be prepared by chemical synthesis."

You can produce pure s-equol using a certain bacteria (on daidzein, I believe):

"The pure S-equol enantiomer can be produced by microbiological methods"

They may be doing either, and they may be isolating the s-equol from the racemic equol. It's hard to say which, but I'm thinking it's a mix of R and S equol.

[PinotQ]

Nothing really new in this link but I think it contains a good summary of the many unique possibilities of the equol molecule:

http://techtransfer.byu.edu/products/equol-for-treating-skin-hair-brain-and-prostate-health-and-obesityweight-control

Note the inventors are the same group that have been researching equol for over 15 years.

[PinotQ]

Any updates pinotq ? Your hair loss stable or you stopped shedding , I'm really interested In adding this to minoxdill any ideas how much?

Too early to make any assessments. I have never really noticed much shedding so I wouldn't see any change in that respect anyway. 10 weeks in on Monday at 48mg, 3 times per day. No idea on quantity if you are mixing with minoxidil. I did email Nature's Sunshine regarding the S vs R equol issue and got a quick reply stating that they would forward my question to the health science department.

[thechamp]

Any updates pinotq ? Your hair loss stable or you stopped shedding , I'm really interested In adding this to minoxdill any ideas how much?

[thechamp]

Natures made realise date not looking promising

Michael,

Currently S-equol supplements are only available through the Sampling Trial and a launch date has not been announced. If you like to get more information please visit our website at www.naturalequol.com.

[PinotQ]

I tried calling them, and they asked about my account password blah blah blah. Why do they make answering a simple question so difficult.

If I get some time today, I will try to call them since I do have an account.

[cthulhu2]

I tried calling them, and they asked about my account password blah blah blah. Why do they make answering a simple question so difficult.

[thechamp]

This is the email I got from natures made about release date

Thank you for your interest in S-equol. In conjunction with our parent company, Otsuka Pharmaceutical Co., Ltd., Pharmavite LLC is currently studying the supplement containing S-equol for the management of menopausal symptoms. More information about the supplement containing S-equol, including results of studies, can be found at http://www.naturalequol.com. Currently S-equol supplements are not available for purchase and are only available in the U.S. via the Sampling Trial for menopausal symptom relief. If you like to get more information please visit our website at www.naturalequol.com.

Best regards,


Evette Aidinian
Associate Brand Manager
Pharmavite LLC