Anyone who had eliminated side effects of finasteride with lower dose

[seattle30]

In the Dr. Traish paper in the JSM it says propecia is 50 times weaker at inhibiting 5a-R1 than 5a-R2

[seattle30]

propecia definitely messes with pathways

http://www.andrologyjournal.org/content/vol29/issue5/images/large/andr-29-05-524-f02.jpeg

[25 going on 65]

woow, using propecia and messing with these complex pathways is really not a good idea.

Depends on your priorities.

I would rather have 8 more years of good hair, and then sudden death or horrible chronic illness, than 80 more years as a bald guy. Literally.

[gutted]

That may be true in some cases but from what I have read that is not the truth. I know in my cases I have had t and dht tests done and they are perfectly normal and within range. My dht level was 56 ng/dl and the range at the lab was 27-75. My doctor put me on testim treatment even when my t numbers were not even on the low end of the range and this didn't really do anything to alleviate the persistent low libido and ed caused by propecia. The persistent sides are caused by something very complex, possibly something epigentic.

What is also interesting is that my 3 alpha diol levels were tested. 3 alpha diol is a neurosteroid and metabolite of testosterone. The test results were that my 3 alpha diol level was at 695 ng/dl, the range is 340-2200, so definitely at the low end of the range. I found this interesting becuase of how the testosterone metabolism to this neurosteroid works.

"Testosterone undergoes metabolism to neurosteroids via two distinct pathways. Aromatization of the A-ring converts testosterone into 17beta-estradiol. Reduction of testosterone by 5alpha-reductase generates 5alpha-dihydrotestosterone (DHT), which is then converted to 3alpha-androstanediol (3alpha-Diol), a powerful GABA(A) receptor-modulating neurosteroid with anticonvulsant properties."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2837610

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15489042

3 alpha hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase is the enzyme which converts dht to the neurosteroid 3 alpha diol. It is also responsible for the conversion to the neurosteroids allopregnanolone and THDOC. I did not have my 3 alpha diol numbers tested before I went on propecia so I don't know if you can really draw any conclusions from this but nonetheless it is pretty interesting.


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8440186

woow, using propecia and messing with these complex pathways is really not a good idea.

if 3 alpha hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase, converts dht to 3 alpha dio then it could be that dht is low in individuals suffering from sides, as not enough is being converted.

[seattle30]

Nice find fab, thanks for posting

[fab]

Very interesting seattle30. This is also interesting: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8883822

[seattle30]

in my opinion the sides from fin are 100% related to hormone levels- tesosterone and/or dht.
They both are low on individuals that are affected from sides.

This may be of some benefit -> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12659241

That may be true in some cases but from what I have read that is not the truth. I know in my cases I have had t and dht tests done and they are perfectly normal and within range. My dht level was 56 ng/dl and the range at the lab was 27-75. My doctor put me on testim treatment even when my t numbers were not even on the low end of the range and this didn't really do anything to alleviate the persistent low libido and ed caused by propecia. The persistent sides are caused by something very complex, possibly something epigentic.

What is also interesting is that my 3 alpha diol levels were tested. 3 alpha diol is a neurosteroid and metabolite of testosterone. The test results were that my 3 alpha diol level was at 695 ng/dl, the range is 340-2200, so definitely at the low end of the range. I found this interesting becuase of how the testosterone metabolism to this neurosteroid works.

"Testosterone undergoes metabolism to neurosteroids via two distinct pathways. Aromatization of the A-ring converts testosterone into 17beta-estradiol. Reduction of testosterone by 5alpha-reductase generates 5alpha-dihydrotestosterone (DHT), which is then converted to 3alpha-androstanediol (3alpha-Diol), a powerful GABA(A) receptor-modulating neurosteroid with anticonvulsant properties."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2837610

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15489042

3 alpha hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase is the enzyme which converts dht to the neurosteroid 3 alpha diol. It is also responsible for the conversion to the neurosteroids allopregnanolone and THDOC. I did not have my 3 alpha diol numbers tested before I went on propecia so I don't know if you can really draw any conclusions from this but nonetheless it is pretty interesting.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8440186

[25 going on 65]

0.1 mg seems to do virtually nothing for DHT inhibition when you look at blood tests.

I know I said this quite awhile back but I still feel the need to correct myself. When I wrote that I was thinking of .01 mg, because I was referencing an inhibition curve chart from memory.
.1 mg, which is 10x the dose, actually does seem to have a noticeable inhibition effect. Obviously not as strong as higher doses, but it's there.

Apologies for the misinformation.

[seattle30]

This is anecdotal but for whats its worth I went to half a pill after getting the sides from propecia shortly after and it didn't change anything. I still have the persistent sides almost four years later

[chrisis]

.
You suffer moderately , quit blaming everybody that doesn't.

Can you quote me blaming you or anybody?

[bob13]

Grow instead of telling somebody to ***off.

You suffer moderately , quit blaming everybody that doesn't.

I felt sorry from you but now I dont believe you cause you would have gotten help from a MD.

[chrisis]

The same could be said about you. At Least Charger backs it up.

You can trace my posts back from when I started at this forum. I had nothing negative to say about Propecia until I experienced sides, and even then I wasn't very critical until they persisted after months. All I've ever done is describe my experiences and advise other people accordingly. I totally get that you disagree with me doing that, but I'm going to continue anyway!

Also, just because you disagree with what I've said, doesn't mean I haven't backed myself up. Maybe it's time to start making some contributions yourself, instead of clinging to the coat tails of other people you agree with. Offering nothing but your own positive testimony on Propecia is pretty useless, and harassing those who have suffered side effects for the sake of it is pretty sick - as others have already pointed out.

In short, either offer something constructive to the discussion or stfu.

[tizzle]

my personal experience is that the low dht level is not the only reason for sideeffects. i reduced my dose to 0.6mg daily (from 1.25) mg daily and my sides disappeared very quickly. And even though placebo effect is extremely complex, i do believe that my side were caused by Fin. But thats just my experiece, i cant back that up with science

[gutted]

My free T was also low, this as well has something to do.

in my opinion the sides from fin are 100% related to hormone levels- tesosterone and/or dht.
They both are low on individuals that are affected from sides.

This may be of some benefit -> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12659241

[bob13]

The Charger, starting to think you must have a vested interest in defending Propecia. The amount of time you devote to interrogating people who've suffered from side effects is not normal. Let people have their say.

The same could be said about you. At Least Charger backs it up.