Is Dr. Gho's HST the real deal?

[Follicle Death Row]

What consequences will the "industry" suffer if they don't accede to our demands?

If they don't meet our demands then we'll gun down all of the Merck hierarchy.

In all seriousness though, in fairness the industry has come along way and many of the top docs will be open and honest out the effects of 5AR inhibitors. I think it's well established that there's a desire for a better topical treatment and hopefully one will come to market. I suppose I'm just unhappy with the pharmaceutical side of the industry. The thing is with a cosmetic issue like hairloss, we're not dealing with a health issue at all so any treatment in development is really only to make some good coin. Now of course all pharmaceutical companies are looking to develop profitable drugs for many different ailments but let's be honest it's better to actually invest in drugs that solve real health issues because there's more noble causes to pursue we're kind of stuck with a second rate drug for hairloss in finasteride that wasn't developed originally for combatting this problem. Of course if someone thought they had a really effective product they'd make huge money.

It's tough dealing with the choice of taking finasteride or not taking it. On one hand you keep your hair for longer but have the hormonal profile of a pseudohermaphrodite whereas on the other hand you lose your hair but have a healthy male hormonal profile. Sometimes when the choice isn't there people are happier. I think since I'm not happy to take finasteride I do expect more from the pharamceutical side of the industry so to speak. It's good to hear there's people happily taking finasteride and benefitting from it but there's plenty that expect an alternative.

[RichardDawkins]

Yeah i agree when it comes to FIn. Because its not stopping hair loss in genereal its slowing it down, and also there is a high chance for impotence as well.

And i can only speak for myself but if i would be impotent for the rest of my life i would wish for hair loss be my major problem you know. The truth is, hair loss can be reversed and further improvement you could also choose to take the surgical route with donor regrowth. But impotence on the other hand, well you stick with that for the effin rest of your life and this is hard.

Risk vs benefit is clearly not equal

[UK_]

Thats why I wont be touching Propecia - not worth it lol

[Follicle Death Row]

Yeah just look at the worst case scenarios. Forgo finasteride and you'll lose your hair. Take it and you might lose your hair, develop gyno and/or suffer some serious malfunction let's say in the trouser department. Not worth it imo.

Back to Gho's method; I knew Bernstein was looking at autocloning but it appears he's also investigating the partial longitudinal follicular unit extraction method that Gho has pioneered. That's what I'm taking from the article that says "transected follicular units are induced to generate new hair-producing follicles."

I had completely missed this until now.

http://www.bernsteinmedical.com/hairtransplantblog/hair-transplant-pioneer-studies-hair-cloning-hair-restoration-procedures-using-acell-extracellular-matrix/

Now this 'plucking' method that Cooley and Bernstein are investigating has the drawback of only being able to utilise single hairs. That's where Dr. Cole's proposed method may have a significant advantage. However to circumvent this problem Bernstein has proposed that 2 or 3 single hairs could be placed into the one lateral slit or sagital slit to create an artificial 2 or 3 hair FU. All very interesting. I wonder if an artificial 2 hair FU could spawn a third hair due to Acell. Perhaps if one of those plucked hairs was taken from a 2 or 3 hair FU is what I'm thinking but that could be wishful thinking too.

[RichardDawkins]

Hmmm Follicle is right i never thought this through

With Propecia you will lose your hair anyway and you got other problems as well so in the end everyone who is taking propecia well is just paying for i dont know nothing useful at all

[Follicle Death Row]

Dr. Bernstein seems pretty sure that hair cloning will be on the market within 10 years. That's huge coming from him. He was saying we've always been pushing back the date but now we're really actually moving towards the finishing line because the science is almost there. I can't wait for the Aderans phase 2 results. I'm thinking he must have been alluding to them. Ken Washenik has been at this thing for ages.

It actually looks like we might make some progress over the next couple of years.

Acell and Autocloning:
Dr. Cooley
Dr. Hitzig
Dr. Bernstein
Dr. Rassman


FUE donor regeneration with Acell:
Dr. Cole


Follicular Transection to increase number of Follicles:
Dr. Gho (supposedly)
Dr. Bernstein (investigating viability with Acell)


I think Dr. Cole's method may have the most immediate promise if in fact the 54% figure is legitimate. The worry about autocloning at the moment is whether the plucked hairs will become a hybrid taking on properties of both the donor site and the recipient site thus throwing the idea of donor dominance out the window. They could succumb to DHT and miniturise. Also artificial multi hair follicles will have to made so to speak.

If Aderans can crack it they will own the market. They or someone else will probably keep us waiting until towards the end of the decade.

[RichardDawkins]

My opinion

1) Acell and autocloning : Idea good but too inconsistent and not really sure if this is working at all (also i exclude Rassman for several reasons)

2) FUE donor regeneration : The best option but we have to realize that even without Acell donor regeneration can be possible via FUE (like the idea because its the fastest and efficient way but the overall regrowth rate has to be increased drastically 80% is minimum value here to get a NW7 to NW1 again) Cole is on a good way but he could regrowth even without Acell it happend before

3) Follicular Transection : Good idea and science is backing it up as well, but unfortunately Gho is the only one offering it till today which is why under his conditions its not viable. Feller and co should do this and it would be way better

To me personally i would prefer

FUE multiplication
HST (Gho)
Plucking

In that order, all three of them would solve our problems BUT the third option will take at least twice as much time as the above.

HST in my opinion is sticked with a lot of IFs etc because of Ghos rep and some discrepancies between his sayings, results and what HSI reps say. Also the price tag and the low graft sessions (with infinite donor there should be no restrictions in sessions etc so it seems to me like patient milking with those 9 months between and 500 or 700 Graft sessions)

FUE multiplication, sadly this could have been easily the standard since a few years because some docs already reported around 30% regrowth with FUE.

So one thing is sure, limited donor is not a problem any more right now, which is good. Also the term "cure" depends on everyones personal ideas.

1) a pill which ends it all : highly unlikeable

2) cellular solutions : probably in around 3 years

3) surgicial multiplication : already here and if it works good on others 1 to 2 years for an early standard

Anyway the cases with donor regeneration would increase if FUE would be the only standard because then docs had to put a variety in their techniques to separate them from others.

[Flowers]

My opinion

1) Acell and autocloning : Idea good but too inconsistent and not really sure if this is working at all (also i exclude Rassman for several reasons)

2) FUE donor regeneration : The best option but we have to realize that even without Acell donor regeneration can be possible via FUE (like the idea because its the fastest and efficient way but the overall regrowth rate has to be increased drastically 80% is minimum value here to get a NW7 to NW1 again) Cole is on a good way but he could regrowth even without Acell it happend before

3) Follicular Transection : Good idea and science is backing it up as well, but unfortunately Gho is the only one offering it till today which is why under his conditions its not viable. Feller and co should do this and it would be way better

To me personally i would prefer

FUE multiplication
HST (Gho)
Plucking

In that order, all three of them would solve our problems BUT the third option will take at least twice as much time as the above.

HST in my opinion is sticked with a lot of IFs etc because of Ghos rep and some discrepancies between his sayings, results and what HSI reps say. Also the price tag and the low graft sessions (with infinite donor there should be no restrictions in sessions etc so it seems to me like patient milking with those 9 months between and 500 or 700 Graft sessions)

FUE multiplication, sadly this could have been easily the standard since a few years because some docs already reported around 30% regrowth with FUE.

So one thing is sure, limited donor is not a problem any more right now, which is good. Also the term "cure" depends on everyones personal ideas.

1) a pill which ends it all : highly unlikeable

2) cellular solutions : probably in around 3 years

3) surgicial multiplication : already here and if it works good on others 1 to 2 years for an early standard

Anyway the cases with donor regeneration would increase if FUE would be the only standard because then docs had to put a variety in their techniques to separate them from others.

What do you mean limited donor is not a problem anymore? Cuz that's pretty much a cure to me

[RichardDawkins]

FUE with minimal depth and the right transection technique is a guaranteed donor regeneration

[Follicle Death Row]

Well before hair cloning arrives I hope we can see FUE becoming the method of choice. Dr. Cole's regeneration figures already mean more follicular units can be transplanted by FUE alone than FUT alone. Also has anyone seen Dr. Feriduni's photo of the slits for 90 FU/cm2? Insanely impressive work.

Technology is really beginning to snowball it seems.

[Flowers]

Just to clarify:

1. If what you're saying about no more limited donor then what can be done? How much restoration can a NW7,6, or 5 get?

2. Since this thread was about Dr. Gho and he has a bad reputation may I quickly ask about why Dr. Armani has such a bad rep? His photos are amazing but no one in the hair loss/transplant world will praise anything he's done. Does anyone know if he'll be getting involved in acell regeneration like Dr. Cole? (Cole is pretty much as good as Armani anyway)

[Follicle Death Row]

We're not at the point where donor is unlimited. Not yet. Dr. Cole is getting regrowth of 54 in every 100 follicles extracted using Acell in an initial study. So realistically we could be looking at donor expansion. Let's say in excess of 10,000 (up to 13,000) by FUE if this is a consistent thing. You could even do a decent restoration on some norwood 7s if this is the case.

As for that other guy. Well they don't talk about him much here. He's willing to give young guys with minimal loss negative norwood lego man hairlines for 3000 grafts. Down the road that's going to spell disaster unless donor expansion, hair multiplication or autocloning of some sorts comes along.

[Dutch_Dude]

Some people already have 10.000 grafts available...so those people would be able to have a little more than 15.000 grafts if this ACell thing works. I still stand by what I said a few weeks ago: as long as the hairline is restored, midscalp area and they transplant the crown with thin hairs, you can use toppik all over and it will be like a full head of hair, as long as you transplant enough hairs for toppik to attach itself to those hairs.

[RichardDawkins]

And what is the goddamn point in using toppic? Tell me what is the point. With 15.000 Grafts which is around one third of your average hair, i say you can get an pretty awesome result with a real high density OVERALL.

Also it depends on the size/mass of your head, a NW7 with 160 square cm to plaster will be more or less easier fixed then someone with more then 240 square cm to plaster.

You and your toppic, who gives, if i can get an very expanded donor area, shit i would prefer this over toppic, which is so fake as a rug.

In general, people have higher ressources then it is told them (unless you had strip scars, thos will of course limit your donor possiblilities).

Sorry Pal with an expanded/ unlimited donor, i would go for a REAL restoration and not some shitty Camouflage Bullcrap.

Even a NW7 can harvest around 5000 Grafts from his horseshoe, so this would probably get things done even with 80% regrowth rate. You can see really good NW6/NW5 transformations today, and those are only your average Joe techniques. So my mind begins to think

"If they can achieve pretty good results with a limited donor, what could they do with infinite or expanded donor?"

If some regrowth occurs at normal and average FUE session to around 30% or so, can this be totalled to 100%? The answer is a simple

"YES but we all know 100% of everything is not easy achievable" so i say a regrowth rate of 90 to 95% could be very realistic if the whole pack or surgeons would try to experiement a little with

1) minimal depth approaches
2) "good" transection
3) regenerative medicine (as a helper in the first place, its good for starters)
4) storage solutions above the average Ringer solution or NaCL solution
5) smaller extraction needles

After one year we would get more and more reports of "strange regrowth" you can quote me on that.

Cole got his average 54% only because he had at least 1,3 and 5 done (where i am not sure about number 5 because iam nor familiar with his instruments but the less white dot pigmentation even without Acell makes me think so)

Comparison : Some doc from the EU Keser, seems to hit the marker on point 2 and 5 with his around 30% regrowth rate

What Gho does, if we could take him seriously is 1,2,4 and 5 (point 3 i dont know for sure)

[DepressedByHairLoss]

Whoever said that we should expect more effective solutions from the hair loss industry is totally correct. I mean, Minoxidil and Propecia already generate millions of dollars yet they don't do a damn thing. Saw palmetto, green tea, emu oil, cayenne peppers, and these "all natural" treatments are just absolute horseshit. All we have are two pretty ineffective drug and hair transplant procedures which are far from effective. So many things can and do go wrong with hair transplants: 1) no ability to generate new hair, 2) permanent scarring, 3) shock loss, and 4) multiple procedures need to be performed to achieve anything close to a full head of hair. I wish doctors wouldn't focus all their attention on such ineffective procedures and work to develop more effective solutions. I mean, a chemical called Noggin has been proven to cause robust hair growth yet no one looks to develop a product using this chemical to work on humans. These so-called researchers can spend an entire career testing on mice and mice only, all the while generating tons of money for their lab yet never developing anything viable for humans. Mice don't need a cure for hair loss, humans do. And to me, these researchers who only test on mice yet never do anything to benefit humans are about as worthless as henshit on a pump-handle. It just boggles my mind how these researchers can win award after awards for testing on mice yet never doing anything to benefit humans. Some people say that no viable solution is available for hair loss because it is not a life-threatening disease, but that is inexcusable. People can get sex-changes, breast augmentation, and facial reconstruction, and none of these are life-threatening by any means. I believe hair loss causes more devastation than any of these aforementioned issues, yet there is still no effective solution to combat hair loss and regrow hair. It's just absolutely sickening and totally unacceptable.