The MOST important fact to remember!!!!

[DepressedByHairLoss]

And lastly, this is precisely the reason why we should be shooting for cellular hair regeneration as opposed to unlimited donor hair. Even if unlimited donor hair could be achieved, God knows how many hair transplants a person with significant hair loss would actually need to achieve anything close to a full head of hair. Surgical transplantation is just so limited and invasive (there just aren't enough hairs to redistribute from one part of the head to the other), whereas cellular regeneration (or just regeneration in general) could promise massively better results.

[ryan555]

Do you think it's unethical to do super dense packing and low hairlines in the front of the scalp based upon an assumption that the patient will be able to maintain their hair forever on meds? I see a lot of the really good docs placing low hairlines and high numbers of grafts up front (for example, 3500 in the front hairline alone) in patients who are taking propecia. But it seems that at some age, maybe even 60 or 70, the genetic pattern is going to take over or there will be some reason along the way that the patient may need to stop the meds. Will these patients end up with a super dense front half and a bald crown and midsection?

[ejj]

I think this is a great post , I also think its an extreme , the picture shows it as ` black and white ` ..its brutally honest and fair in my opinion .

The variable would be a patients characteristics and Drs skill , alternative pictures `could` show Dr Bisanga`s patient rep who has had complete restoration via fue only, using beard and scalp hair , this was a norwood 6 fully restored ! , Dr Umar has some full restorations also using beard and body hair also Dr Woods , so I think my earlier post is relevent, fue procedure to the ` egg shaped` area and see how things go

regards
ejj

[25 going on 65]

Do you think it's unethical to do super dense packing and low hairlines in the front of the scalp based upon an assumption that the patient will be able to maintain their hair forever on meds? I see a lot of the really good docs placing low hairlines and high numbers of grafts up front (for example, 3500 in the front hairline alone) in patients who are taking propecia. But it seems that at some age, maybe even 60 or 70, the genetic pattern is going to take over or there will be some reason along the way that the patient may need to stop the meds. Will these patients end up with a super dense front half and a bald crown and midsection?

It depends on a lot of factors (age, rate of loss, response to meds, available donor, etc.), but in most cases it strikes me as unethical.

The length of time an MPB sufferer can maintain his hair on medication varies a lot from person to person. Some people keep what they have for more than 10-12 years; some people start losing hair again only a few years into treatment.
If you use 3,500 or more grafts for the hairline on a guy in his 20's, what happens if finasteride loses effectiveness 24 months later? The patient still has decades of life ahead of him and only like 3 thousand grafts for his entire head...
Someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong about any of this, but this approach just seems like a disastrous method of hair restoration.

And I agree with FDR about Armani's marketing and ethics.

[Follicle Death Row]

3,500 in the hairline is of course ridiculous. However I can see a good argument for those with donor reserves of 10,000 by strip and FUE to go for up to 3,500 in the first 65cm2 or roughly frontal third. Assuming that number is available for maximum donor a norwood 6 can have the following:

3,500 in the first 65cm2 - about 54FU/cm2
3,000 in the next 65cm2 - about 46 FU/cm2
3,500 in the crown, 110cm2 - about 32 FU/cm2

I have heard of people with 11,000 available by all methods so they can reach just over 40 FU/cm2 even in the crown. Good results are still possible but if you don't have 9,000 available and are headed for norwood 6 you may not be satisfied.

Still there are some great successes. I really like this one. I believe the patient has used up 7,300ish of a donor rated at over 10,000. Plus as far as I'm aware he never availed of meds. I think the outcome is great.

http://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showthread.php?t=2326

[Tracy C]

...using beard and scalp hair , this was a norwood 6 fully restored !

No it wasn't. Beard hair and body hair have different characteristics than scalp hair. This was just a cover that has the "look" of full restoration - but it isn't truly a "full restoration". Personally, I feel beard and body hair should be left for extreme repair and truma cases only. Not as a general practice.

[ejj]

Isnt that the goal , to achieve the look of full restoration , sorry if you took what I said out of context , we were discussing transplants I may of wrongly assumed that everyone understood my comments ,therefore I will re phrase it .." beard and scalp grafts via fue , have achieved the ..` illusion ` of full restoration "

I have had 1000 beard grafts, grafted into my scars very little difference re characteristics, so much so im booked in for more repair work in May , I think beard hair will become more of a valuable donor source as the traditional scalp donor runs out , more and more Drs are trying to use it with various results , i guess some are just better at it than others

regards

ejj

[25 going on 65]

3,500 in the hairline is of course ridiculous. However I can see a good argument for those with donor reserves of 10,000 by strip and FUE to go for up to 3,500 in the first 65cm2 or roughly frontal third. Assuming that number is available for maximum donor a norwood 6 can have the following:

3,500 in the first 65cm2 - about 54FU/cm2
3,000 in the next 65cm2 - about 46 FU/cm2
3,500 in the crown, 110cm2 - about 32 FU/cm2

I have heard of people with 11,000 available by all methods so they can reach just over 40 FU/cm2 even in the crown. Good results are still possible but if you don't have 9,000 available and are headed for norwood 6 you may not be satisfied.

Still there are some great successes. I really like this one. I believe the patient has used up 7,300ish of a donor rated at over 10,000. Plus as far as I'm aware he never availed of meds. I think the outcome is great.

http://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showthread.php?t=2326

That's a lot of grafts. I wonder how common it is to have such a generous donor region.

[Follicle Death Row]

That's a lot of grafts. I wonder how common it is to have such a generous donor region.

I don't have a clue.

[Locke]

I do not like this thread.

A hair transplant will never provide 100% density. That is a fact and if it has not been made clear to you by your hair transplant surgeon, then you should not be having surgery with them.

Alvi Armani is a scam and I don't believe they practice in Canada anymore. They commit too many hairs to the frontal hairline.

Dr. Rahal's strategy (my surgeon) is to have increased density in the frontal hairline (60%ish) then decrease this density as you move back towards the crown. He also makes it clear that you will most likely have a bald spot at the crown at the end of all the surgeries because there just isn't enough hair.

I am completely fine with all of this. I had my HT done June 21st and I'm completely satisfied with the results (3,128 hairs in the frontal 1/3rd). I tried shaving my head and it looked horrible. Although my hair now doesn't look 100% like it used to, it is much better than it would look completely bald.

For all of you holding back on having a hair transplant done because you fear the results won't look realistic, sometimes you just need to have the courage and take the leap. The results may not be completely realistic but they're far better than doing nothing and moping about it for years.

[Still-Researching]

I
For all of you holding back on having a hair transplant done because you fear the results won't look realistic, sometimes you just need to have the courage and take the leap. The results may not be completely realistic but they're far better than doing nothing and moping about it for years.

I like this comment, however sure it does not work for everyone. You seem to have had realistic expectations and I am working on mine. I am 1 months into a 2500 FUE - and looking forward to see the outcome in 12 months.

Happy to hear you are happy - Rahal is on most people's top lists or should be.

[chrisis]

Still Researching, curious where you're from? Got any latest photos? I'm in Newcastle, UK and trying to decide on a transplant doc. Cheers

[Still-Researching]

Still Researching, curious where you're from? Got any latest photos? I'm in Newcastle, UK and trying to decide on a transplant doc. Cheers

Hi Chrisis,
I am from Scandinavia, you can see my story and pictures in another thread on this site: http://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showthread.php?t=7446
Will try to update it monthly...

Cheers,

[chrisis]

Thanks I'll check the thread

and good luck with your recovery! Maybe in a year's time I'll be where you are now

[25 going on 65]

Still Researching, curious where you're from? Got any latest photos? I'm in Newcastle, UK and trying to decide on a transplant doc. Cheers

This is kind of off-topic, but over the years I've read quite a few claims online that the UK is a bad place for hair restoration surgery, and that British citizens should travel off the island for their procedures...
Do you know if that holds any merit? I don't understand why this would be the case in such a modern country.

Even if it's generally true, it seems like there should be at least a handful of reputable UK surgeons?