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  1. #11
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    most people use both, an internal and external method to combat dht - fina internally and nizoral with 2% ketoconazole topically....

    those are the most effective ways to keep dht away from the scalp, although fina can have some serious sexual side effects and I'm worried about the recent reports that it has a huge half-life of 50 years...

    if things do go wrong it's more than simply stopping the fina, so i stopped over a year ago and haven't had any more hair loss, just using the Nizoral 2% to fight the dht and it seems to be working fine


    Quote Originally Posted by goldbondmafia View Post
    that makes perfect sense to me. when you say controlling DHT are you basically just refering to Fin/Propecia? To control DHT for me I just use Niz as i told you in my thread...hopefully that is good enough for now!

    BTW Tracy after reading your story Im so happy that your hair situatuin is under control for you now, you deserve it more than anyone.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by kanyon View Post
    It worked for me for about 6 and a half years. It has completely lost its effectiveness now.

    I don't disagree with Tracy. There could be other reasons why it stops working besides building a tolerance. I'd be lying if I didn't say that over the years I used it very inconsistently. Because my results were so incredible, I got so confident and blase about it, and I even went some months without using (when travelling for example) and would get back on it with no hairloss evident.

    Finally this caught up with me (or as I believe the stuff just stopped working for me) when I noticed severe hairloss again about 13 months ago. So to combat it, since October 2010 I've been committed and diligent over this past year and applied it twice a day everyday.

    So basically it's worthless to me now but I do still use it because I'm scared not too.

    I started Fin in February this year (I used Regaine by itself for all those years) and am hoping Fin will work for me until a better treatment becomes available (a few years I guess).

    I have been tempted to shave my head with the hope I could pull the look off but I doubt I could. I'd prefer to keep my dodgy combover.
    LOL So I found another exemplary case, when minoxidil mysteriously "stopped working". I would like to warn all potential users of minoxidil that this stuff is not for lazy and undisciplined people. And what is worse, when the consequences of the sloppy application eventually count up, they come to internet forums and spite their silly agenda that "minoxidil won't maintain hair" to all directions.

    "I even went some months without using it..." INSANITY!

    "when I noticed severe hairloss again about 13 months ago..." After some long trip, I suppose?

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tracy C View Post
    Here is what I think pobably happens... Please understand that I am not a doctor... As men get older, their hormone levels change just as it does in women. As the androgen levels increase, eventually they over power Minoxidil's effect. So in the case of those men who use Minoxidil but don't do anything to keep DHT under control, eventually Minoxidil alone is not enough to keep up the fight...

    Ideally, it is best for a male to do something to take control of DHT as well as start Minoxidil from the beginning. If however a man didn't do that, he should do so at the first sign that Minoxidil seems to have "lost its effectiveness".

    Does that make sense to anyone other than me?
    But here it was probably the laziness of this user that eventually overpowered minoxidil's effect. Further, levels of androgens decrease with age. Hence it would seem that after a certain age threshold, a user of anti-hairloss treatments shouldn't be afraid of hairloss anymore, but this may not be true. I think that DHT may cause hairloss via attacking the follicle by small "shoots" over a long period of time - which happens in old people. In this case, the hairloss proceeds at a slow pace, because it takes many hair cycles, until the follicle can't resist DHT anymore. Since minoxidil basically increases the follicle's resistance to DHT on the level of much older people, it means that if it lost its effect one day, it would in all likehood resembled the slow hairloss in old people, not a sudden "severe hairloss" like in this poster.

    Yes, combining fin and minox is always better that using either of the drugs alone. But your reasoning is not correct. The levels of DHT don't matter; minoxidil has a different mechanism of effect than 5-AR blockers, but it doesn't mean that it would be inferior. It only addresses the problem from a different angle than DHT suppression (probably via the balance between prostaglandins). Furthermore, its effect is dose-dependent and individually variable. At a certain dosage, it should work infinitely, similarly like 5-AR blockers. However, in contrast with 5-AR blockers, where the effect on DHT can easily be measured, we can't predict a long-term effect of minoxidil from any numbers. This is a big disadvantage of this drug, and I would recommend to all minoxidil users - irrespectively of how long they are on the drug - to add 5-AR blockers soon or later. And I am saying it as a very good responder, who has maintained his NW 1.5 hairline on minoxidil alone for 15,5 years.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by kanyon View Post
    When I was 20 I cried about it. People would comment that they could see my scalp. I thought it was over for me but Minox really is an amazing product for the duration it can help you.
    But your horrible discipline didn't betray that you would be especially worried about the possible consequences. Just for your information: Long-term trials from late 80's demonstrated that the average minoxidil user (on 3% minoxidil!) was a way above baseline even after 4-5 years. In fact, although the average haircounts tended to decline with time, they would probably touch the baseline after ca. 15 years.

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