FUT or wait for Histogen etc.?

[GeHairDo]

Thanks for your input guys. I appreciate it.

Actually it would a lot easier to make a decision if we didn't have any promising future procedures like the ones mentioned. Then I would probably just take the plunge and don't look back.

[RichardDawkins]

I agree, for me its almost to much of different approaches which in some stupid way seems all very plausible.

My favorite solution would be a total scarless FUE multiplication thing where the donor area completely regrows

[GeHairDo]

Yeah. All of the different approaches are kind of confusing. However, it is nice to have a gun full of bullets as some are probably going to miss the target. Hopefully at least on will hit the target directly. The question is when this is going to happen.

[Follicle Death Row]

It's the paradox of choice. I'm sure the gold standard will improve over the next decade. FUE with partial donor regrowth has to be the the bridge between what we have now and the eventual arrival HM. The problem as it stands now is this; even one suboptimal surgery where yield is poor and those heading towards advanced MPB are screwed. Simply not enough paint to cover an ever expanding canvas. We simply can't expect results like Nic Nitro or London Lad. These are the exceptions. It's still a serious risk.

[RichardDawkins]

i would absolutely go for a FUE when i can get a guaranteed 80% or more regrowth rate because this would mean infite donor or in laymen terms

"A NW7 guy could become a dense NW2 again. Thats why i actually wait for the other FUE docs to get regrowth rates.

An 80% regrowth rate at 4000 grafts would be amazing because as a NW7 you need around 7000 Grafts and with 80% regrowth you would EASILY expand that amount of donor hair after the second transplant already because after the first you would have 4000 transplanted and around 3200 regrowth ones.

And the best thing, no more of those strange medication things. With Coles 54% regrowth at 4000 grafts you would get around

4000
2000
1000
500
etc Grafts harvested which would be around 7500 grafts. And the best thing compared to lets say Gho is, you would see results after the first transplantation at a more reasonable price tag.

My problem with Gho is the price tag and the density of transplants and the session number. I think offering 1900 Grafts at that price tag is just ridiculous at best.

[Follicle Death Row]

I absolutely agree. FUE with donor regeneration is the future. It's a real phenomenon. Consistency and experience is the key. I actually did the number crunching on this and with the 54% donor regeneration figure we could harvest a norwood 6/7 multiple times. Assuming they have up to 20,000 FU in their horseshoe you could transplant 13,000 over a lifetime and wind up with only thinning out the donor by 30% (14,020 left in the horsehoe).

Let's hope the top FUE doctors can make this happen in the near future. If Cole or Feller could make this 54% a consistent, real in practice figure, it would usher in a new era. People would be going on a biannual basis for Dr. Feller's lunch time FUE. This is what I'm waiting for. Seems more realistic than Aderans hair cloning at this point in time because Dr. Cole seems to have proof of concept. I really hope it can be verified by his peers.

13,000 available by FUE! Could you imagine it. Unreal.

[RichardDawkins]

13.000 is around 26.000 hairs and therefore around barely one third of your all time hair which is good in comparison with whats in the donor left. And those numbers are only with around 50% regrowth rate.

I think we all agree that with around 80% we shouldnt even discuss anymore because this problem would be solved. And the best thing is with a smaller extraction tool is, that well it would be more consistent.

I mean come on Cole got as an average around 50% regrowth which is well "good" for a Curiosity test. If he can produce a solid 80% (i take 80% because i just assume we all go NW7 and want a dense (70 density) NW2 head with hair.

And this can be achieved with an 80% regrowth rate. Here i would say its higher likely that you will die before your donor is finally depleted (shocking but true)....ok this whole die thing was a serious downer.

And dont forget even this technique can advance to

1) less time consuming etc

And yes 13.000 is a lot of Grafts (you got around that amount on your crown area).

I hope that all the FUE docs can get this thing done and that they will test this donor regrowth thing with an robotic device, cause to me THIS would be the future we all know from sci fi movies

1) A robotic transplantation device which is capable of transplanting the hairs with a high density and donor regrowth in a shorter amount of time

[Follicle Death Row]

I really enjoy crunching the numbers and looking at the art of the hair restoration. Let's assume 54% regrowth or higher becomes a reality 3 or 4 years down the line.

I think realistically we could expect a 0.8mm punch tool if want to be able to extract the 2 and 3 FU groupings. Any smaller and we're going into the Gho realm of transection every time. But a 0.8mm diameter punch gives just over 0.5cm2 area to heal as compared to 0.64cm2 for 0.9mm and 0.79cm2 for 1mm punch. Got to go with the 0.8 and Acell for no hypopigmentation.


Assume pre-MPB density 90FU/cm2, Area to cover 275cm2 (Norwood 7ish)

1. Hairline
Area = 35cm2
Density = 70FU/cm2
Total FU = 2450

Ridiculously good density, predominantly ones, can be lower and broader


2. Extended Central Forelock to Midscalp
Area = 35cm2
Density = 60FU/cm2
Total FU = 2100

The area that prevents see through, critically important, 2s & 3s


3. Either side of Forelock to Midscalp
Area = 45cm2
Density = 45 FU/cm2
Total FU = 2025


4. Transition from Mid Scalp to Anterior Crown
Area = 60cm2
Density = 45 FU/cm2
Total FU = 2700


5. Crown
Area = 100cm2
Density = 35 FU/cm2
Total FU = 3500


Total FU = 12,775


Apologies for kind of making up names to areas on the scalp but hopefully you get the idea. This is what could be possible for even the most extreme case.

[Follicle Death Row]

It will happen eventually whether by FUE alone, strip alone or a combo. Nic Nitro is up near 10,500 with another couple of thousand left. London lad is at like 11,200 with another decent strip left. Neither have tapped into FUE yet so you could probably add another 1000.

[RichardDawkins]

I assume you crunch hose numbers for a Worse case scenario, right. Good numbers btw, its good to calculate from a worse case scenario here.

Yes the crown is the Damn factor. Here i would do the following with lets say an 80 regrowth rate, i would split it into two sessions to achieve a higher density.

In my first run i would fill up the crown area from south to the north in circle form. has the benfit that in the next run you wont need as much grafts as before and you can still get a 60 or more density.

But what i wouldnt do with infinite donor is filling something sparsly because of you put more density in it the next time, maybe there will be complications like to dense or anything else. If my donor would give it and the regrowth rate is high, i would combine 1 2 in one session