The Bottom Line

[DeuceWillis]

I thought I should post this because from the latest news in the research on hair loss and hair regeneration, it's clear that we won't have a cure for a while. The bottom line is-- MPB is a genetic trait, it's nothing more, nothing less. The hair follicles on top of our heads are on a genetically programmed biological clock. Male Pattern Baldness is far from rare and on into life, 80-90% of men deal with it. The biggest problem with baldness is that it strikes so young. I don't believe any of us would have issues with it if we were 90 years old. Lol... With that being said, I don't think this condition is cureable via the methods being researched. Being that it happens to the majority of the sex, at different times in life, I think it's too complex. I also love the idea, but believe that creating new follicles isn't the way. Not when we have them already, they just need fixing. What needs to be done is finding the genetic deference between a functioning hair and one affected by androgenetic alopecia, find the mechanism that acts as the biological clock on our follicles, and either turn it back or extinguish it all together. Until then there will be no full blown cure. Disagree if you will, just my 2 cents.

[Pate]

We need to wait until somebody has done a proper stem cell multiplication and re-injection trial with cells which actually remain inductive. Until that's done, we can't rule out the current focus.

That has been the dream for over ten years now, because in theory, it should work. Unfortunately the discovery that 2D multiplied cells lose nearly all their inductive potential threw a spanner in the works and set us back many years.

Sending Desmond to the conference was a great idea, because it shed some light on that and showed that they're actually making progress behind the scenes on that front.

[158nikka]

ive noticed that as the years pass, the more and more younger the balding generation gets. I mean, of course there are a few exceptions, but come on man, balding at the age of 19 or any age under 30 years of age, is not normal and not the way that life is meant to be lived. Something just isnt right, and I feel we have/know the reason and the proper treatment, its just at the tip of of tongue and cant get it out just yet.

[sdsurfin]

ive noticed that as the years pass, the more and more younger the balding generation gets. I mean, of course there are a few exceptions, but come on man, balding at the age of 19 or any age under 30 years of age, is not normal and not the way that life is meant to be lived. Something just isnt right, and I feel we have/know the reason and the proper treatment, its just at the tip of of tongue and cant get it out just yet.

I think that stress and pollution must play a very large role. Our bodies and our hormones are exposed to chemicals that they were not exposed to in the past, and our rhythms are all out of wack. That being said, my granddad was balding in his early twenties, so people might not be getting balder earlier, there might just be more people around, and thus you see more bald people.

[rdawg]

I think this is the kind of field where you have to just step back and not constantly worry about it everyday reading forum posts and such.

it's a slow field with news maybe once every one-two months. It's not the kind of thing that will just be cured one day, this industry takes years to make progress, so when we get bad news one month I feel like everyone assumes it's doom and gloom, but there's always other companies working on it at the same time and stuff happening behind the scenes that we dont know about.

either way I feel like this place stops people from living their lives to the fullest, losing ones hair is not fun, but obsessing over it is worse(im guilty of this at certain points during the year usually, im up and down with this place)!

so personally I'm gonna go live life and travel europe for the next month or two. Maybe in a year or two ill get a transplant if I dont see things progress, or maybe as I get older I wont care as much, frankly I care much less now then I did two years ago, but its obviously still tough to deal with.

Slowly im coming to terms with it, but I'd recommend to you all, and myself included, that we shouldnt hang around here everyday, check in every once in a while for sure, but live your life, get out of here! This place does nothing but cause further depression minus the few signs of small hope within a few years(cb, bim etc.)

[hellouser]

Hooray for mediocre progress for a baldness cure!!

[Scientalk56]

We need to wait until somebody has done a proper stem

That's the problem.. the waiting game... there's nothing to wait for... its not even 10 years away... its decades away... There's no better treatment going to be out...

THE END...

[walrus]

ive noticed that as the years pass, the more and more younger the balding generation gets. I mean, of course there are a few exceptions, but come on man, balding at the age of 19 or any age under 30 years of age, is not normal and not the way that life is meant to be lived. Something just isnt right, and I feel we have/know the reason and the proper treatment, its just at the tip of of tongue and cant get it out just yet.

Unless you have some hard data, I'm afraid that this is most likely a case of observational selection bias (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selection_bias). Like when you buy a new car and start to see the same car everywhere.

[nameless]

People need to face it that options are very limited.

In one post a MAN will gripe that nothing is available. In the next post the MAN will gripe about some clinic/doctor for making experimental treatments before the treatment is ready for prime-time. The point is that grown men are sounding like a bunch of girls who don't know what they want.

You all have 2 choices and that is all. You can either conclude and work toward getting some doctor (most likely Dr. Nigam) to start using the adipose stem cell therapy (AAPE) so that you can get your hair back now or you can just stay bald until the cell-based therapies are ready for prime-time.

Those are your only 2 choices, except if injecting fat cells themselves will treat hair loss as well as the extract from fat cells will, which is unknown at this time. I can think of reasons why the fat cells themselves may not work even though the extract from fat cells does work. Besides, we already know that the extract (AAPE) does work, but we don't know if the fat cells themselves work. Perhaps science will soon prove that the fat cells themselves will work, and this is being tested even now, but if the fat cells themselves don't work then as I have already said you have two choices:

1. Get a doctor (probably Nigam) to do AAPE treatment

2. Accept that you are going to be bald for at least a decade.

And if you select choice number 2 then you should man-up and accept the ramifications of your choice...accept that you will be bald for 10 years and stop complaining about it since it was your choice.

[Haircure]

In one post a MAN will gripe that nothing is available. In the next post the MAN will gripe about some clinic/doctor for making experimental treatments before the treatment is ready for prime-time. The point is that grown men are sounding like a bunch of girls who don't know what they want.

You all have 2 choices and that is all. You can either conclude and work toward getting some doctor (most likely Dr. Nigam) to start using the adipose stem cell therapy (AAPE) so that you can get your hair back now or you can just stay bald until the cell-based therapies are ready for prime-time.

Those are your only 2 choices, except if injecting fat cells themselves will treat hair loss as well as the extract from fat cells will, which is unknown at this time. I can think of reasons why the fat cells themselves may not work even though the extract from fat cells does work. Besides, we already know that the extract (AAPE) does work, but we don't know if the fat cells themselves work. Perhaps science will soon prove that the fat cells themselves will work, and this is being tested even now, but if the fat cells themselves don't work then as I have already said you have two choices:

1. Get a doctor (probably Nigam) to do AAPE treatment

2. Accept that you are going to be bald for at least a decade.

And if you select choice number 2 then you should man-up and accept the ramifications of your choice...accept that you will be bald for 10 years and stop complaining about it since it was your choice.

Wow what a ludicrous post. So let me get this straight, you're telling us that we have only 2 choices and of them involves going to criminal and repeat scamming "doctor" to get an experimental treatment that no one really has much experience with or has even tried, and which may end up costing much more than a transplant as it requires multiple sessions. Yea good luck pal, instead of telling us to go have a treatment with a criminal why don't you stop whining and do it yourself? I would really like to know what sort of education level you have, because you simply seem to ignore that fact that there are way too many variables that aren't accounted for in this ridiculous plan of yours, the main one being your choice of "doctor". I think the fact that you are still even gullible enough to even ask about Nigam speaks volumes about the desperation and utter foolishness of your post.

[Thinning@30]

Quote Originally Posted by 158nikka View Post
ive noticed that as the years pass, the more and more younger the balding generation gets. I mean, of course there are a few exceptions, but come on man, balding at the age of 19 or any age under 30 years of age, is not normal and not the way that life is meant to be lived. Something just isnt right, and I feel we have/know the reason and the proper treatment, its just at the tip of of tongue and cant get it out just yet.

Unless you have some hard data, I'm afraid that this is most likely a case of observational selection bias (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selection_bias). Like when you buy a new car and start to see the same car everywhere.

Before I became conscious of my own hair loss, I never really paid attention to who was losing their hair. To me, people were either bald (chrome domes with horseshoe-shaped hairlines around the ears and back) or not. Occasionally I would meet someone who I thought looked older than their age because of thinning, receding hair, but I didn't consciously make the connection that the hair loss was what was making them look old. Once I noticed my own hair loss, I started noticing everyone else's. Now I can't meet someone without quietly assessing their norwood level.

[nameless]

Wow what a ludicrous post. So let me get this straight, you're telling us that we have only 2 choices and of them involves going to criminal and repeat scamming "doctor" to get an experimental treatment that no one really has much experience with or has even tried, and which may end up costing much more than a transplant as it requires multiple sessions. Yea good luck pal, instead of telling us to go have a treatment with a criminal why don't you stop whining and do it yourself? I would really like to know what sort of education level you have, because you simply seem to ignore that fact that there are way too many variables that aren't accounted for in this ridiculous plan of yours, the main one being your choice of "doctor". I think the fact that you are still even gullible enough to even ask about Nigam speaks volumes about the desperation and utter foolishness of your post.

2. I notice you didn't mention any other doctor who would perform the treatment so you really you don't have an alternative doctor to the doctor I'm recommending. And this of course means that you are choosing to stay bald so you should man-up and stop complaining about hair loss since you are choosing to remain bald.

3. You say nobody's tried this treatment but that's bs because there are 2 separate studies using this exact same treatment and in both studies the treatment worked. Hence, your claim that it's unknown if the treatment works is known bs.

4. I have 4 years of college and a 125 IQ which is way above average.

5. I am trying to do it. I'm trying to talk Dr. Nigam to do it but it's illegal in India so he seems to be reluctant. I fully understand that so I'm trying to talk him into giving it a go in The Bahamas where I think it would be legal. He isn't responding to this suggestion when I put it to him. I think that the reason is that he's been quite psychologically beat up by all the girlish and senseless attacks against him. I think that pressure from a lot of us might persuade him to try it but I'm not sure. I'm ready and willing to go FIRST.

6. Since you are unwilling to go along with my plan the only alternative is to pray that injecting fat cells is just as effective as the fat cell extract (AAPE) is and if it turns out that isn't as effective as AAPE then your choice is to stay bald for about 10 + years until science brings a breakthrough treatment to market. All I'm asking you to do is accept that, that is your choice and stop your constant griping about hair loss since you have chosen to stay bald for the next 0 years.

7. When I complain about hair loss it'[s reasonable because I'm willing to do something about it, but when you continuously gripe about hair loss it's weak because you're making the choice to be bald longer than you have. You're complaining about the decisions that you yourself have made. It's weak.

[sdsurfin]

In one post a MAN will gripe that nothing is available. In the next post the MAN will gripe about some clinic/doctor for making experimental treatments before the treatment is ready for prime-time. The point is that grown men are sounding like a bunch of girls who don't know what they want.

You all have 2 choices and that is all. You can either conclude and work toward getting some doctor (most likely Dr. Nigam) to start using the adipose stem cell therapy (AAPE) so that you can get your hair back now or you can just stay bald until the cell-based therapies are ready for prime-time.

Those are your only 2 choices, except if injecting fat cells themselves will treat hair loss as well as the extract from fat cells will, which is unknown at this time. I can think of reasons why the fat cells themselves may not work even though the extract from fat cells does work. Besides, we already know that the extract (AAPE) does work, but we don't know if the fat cells themselves work. Perhaps science will soon prove that the fat cells themselves will work, and this is being tested even now, but if the fat cells themselves don't work then as I have already said you have two choices:

1. Get a doctor (probably Nigam) to do AAPE treatment

2. Accept that you are going to be bald for at least a decade.

And if you select choice number 2 then you should man-up and accept the ramifications of your choice...accept that you will be bald for 10 years and stop complaining about it since it was your choice.

you're not very intelligent. Please stop trying to think about this topic and get some schooling or something.

[nameless]

you're not very intelligent. Please stop trying to think about this topic and get some schooling or something.

Right sdsurfin!

At minimum some of my points are valid.

You guys do come here and gripe because doctors aren't giving you treatment fast enough then in the next breath you badmouth the doctors who do attempt to get experimental treatments to you early. You really do sound like a bunch of girls who don't know what you want.

Secondly, I may be wrong about AAPE but I think that there is sufficient evidence to support my posit that it has real potential as a reasonably satisfying treatment. There is no evidence that it won't work. The only real scientific evidence indicates that it will work, and you have not posted one shred of evidence to the contrary. And then you call me unintelligent. I consider the source.

I suggest that we try to press Dr. Nigam (or another doctor that you can help me press to try this) and as long as everything is on the up-and-up I will go FIRST.

You don't come up with another doctor. You don't prove that the treatment doesn't work, You don't present a shred of evidence that the treatment won't work.

The only evidence about the treatment is that it DOES work.

There is also supporting evidence other than the actual treatment that it might work. For example, right here in this forum Dr. Gardner said Jahoda will use fat cells in their experiments. Keep in mind that AAPE is the extract from fat cells so Jahoda believes fat cells (and by extension, the fat cells extract AAPE) are key to treat hair loss, not to mention the Yale scientists who also believe the same thing.

You say I'm unintelligent but it's really the other way around.

All you want to do is go on hair websites and gripe like a girl about hair loss, get mad at researchers for not giving you access to treatment early, get mad at researchers who do offer treatment early, and ignore potential real cures for your hair loss.

[nameless]

Wow what a ludicrous post. So let me get this straight, you're telling us that we have only 2 choices and of them involves going to criminal and repeat scamming "doctor" to get an experimental treatment that no one really has much experience with or has even tried, and which may end up costing much more than a transplant as it requires multiple sessions. Yea good luck pal, instead of telling us to go have a treatment with a criminal why don't you stop whining and do it yourself? I would really like to know what sort of education level you have, because you simply seem to ignore that fact that there are way too many variables that aren't accounted for in this ridiculous plan of yours, the main one being your choice of "doctor". I think the fact that you are still even gullible enough to even ask about Nigam speaks volumes about the desperation and utter foolishness of your post.

So then you're suggesting that a hair transplant is your ideal alternative treatment. Ok then just do it and be done with it and stop griping about hair loss. Since you suggest that a hair transplant is equal to or better than AAPE they why not man-up, get the hair transplant, and stop griping about hair loss all the time?

Let me take a guess: you're not a candidate for full recovery of your hair via hair transplantation, or perhaps you don't like the unnatural the look of a hair transplant since a hair transplant involves man-made hair lines and stuff like that, or you wouldn't be satisfied with the thickness of a hair transplant, or you're concerned that down the road even some of the transplanted hairs might miniaturize. If any of these issues, or any issues like these, are the reason why you don't get a hair transplant then that means you don't really think that hair transplants are a good idea even though you suggested hair transplants are a viable option. And if you don't really believe hair transplants are a viable option even though you suggested they are then that's more of that girlish "I don't know what I want" kind of talk.

Listen if a hair transplant will give you a full head of hair then just get a hair transplant and quit griping about hair loss since you have a solution. Or else if a hair transplant won't work for you then stop suggesting that hair transplants are the solution since you don't really think they are.

And if hair transplant is not a good option for you then that means that like I already said you have no option for 10+ years other than AAPE so either try to get AAPE or accept that you will be bald 10+ years and stop griping about it since you are choosing to be bald rather than look into AAPE.