Side effect "sunken eyes"?!

[real96]

Hello guys,

i'm new here and i wonder if someone of you ever heard of the possible finasteride side effect "sunken eyes"?! I noticed some people in a german forum talking about this side effect, which is described as dark circles under the eyes caused by a fat atrophy under the eyes.
Due to the fact I can't find any information about it in the web except in that german forum and the side effect doesn't appear in any study, i really guess that this should not be taken seriously.
Would you guys agree, or did anybody here ever notice some side effects like this?

Thanks for your help

[youngandearly]

It may very well cause hollowing of the eyes, although there have been no studies to show that. Now that you mention it, I noticed hollowing of my eyes around a year ago and I started fin 1.25mg about 16 months ago. It also happens naturally as we age so who knows (although I'm only 20 now). What treatments are you currently on? How is your hair situation?

[real96]

I'm 20 years old and my situation unfortunately isn't the best. I'm going bald at the temples, i can hide it so far, but i think it wont last very long that people will notice.
I'm absolutely willing to do something against my hair loss, but I'm pretty unsure about what to do.
Fin or not? And if taking Fin, 1 mg a day or lower doses?
I wonder about the most actual studies, do they prove that taking fin is pretty safe? And is Fin still number 1 when it comes to hair loss treatments?
I got many questions and would be happy if you could bring me up to date.

[youngandearly]

Now Finasteride is a type 2 5alpha-reductase inhibitor with a short half life (4-6 hours). It is worth noting that the halflife of the 5ar enzyme is much longer than the half life of the drug. All of the studies on fin show that it is generally safe with a very low chance of side effects. It is available in 1 mg (propecia) for hair and 5 mg (proscar) tablets for prostate with the 5mg also available as a generic due to the patent running out.

There is also a dual 5ar inhibitor called Dutasteride that has a much longer half life (4+ weeks) and inhibits both type 1 and 2 5ar. It is available as a .5mg liquid gel capsule (avodart) which cannot be split into smaller doses. It generally has the same side effects but at higher incidences and they would theoretically last longer because of the long half life.

It is worth noting that type 2 5ar is found mostly in the skin and prostate. Type 1 5ar is found in many body tissues including the brain. So dut may have side effects that fin does not.

The side effects you should consider are as follows, loss of libido, inability to acheive erection, thinning of beard or body hair, testicular ache, gynecomastia (breast growth), and possibly a more feminine body fat distribution. Some people also claim that it can cause "brain fog" ie difficulty thinking. The sexual side effects mostly go away after stopping treatment, the fat distribution/breast development does not. The incidence of all side effects is generally low and way over-hyped but could be devastating if you are one of the unlucky few.

I have not experience any of these side effects except for the ball ache during the first week only and maybe puffy nipples (I may have had them to begin with). My libido hasn't changed apreciably and no problems with erections. Can't really say about body or facial hair, because I shave both but there doesn't seem to be any change. Definitely no brain fog or anything like that.

Bottom line, Dut is stronger but i recommend starting with Fin due to lower incidence of side effects and having something stronger to fall back on if fin does not work for you or loses effectivness. The fact that fin is available as a generic and you can split the 5 mg dose into quarters to save even more money is just a bonus, not to mention the shorter half life if you have to stop. You should discuss the risks and benefits with a doctor, considering you will have to see a doctor for a for a script anyways.

Where are you on the norwood scale and how long have you noticed the loss? what is your family history of hair loss?

[real96]

Thanks for your reply, lots of useful information. I'd say im about 2.5 on the norwood scale. Unfortunately my father was balding really early, so I guess my hair loss is kind of aggressive.
I think I'm gonna start taking Fin and if side effects appear, i will have to think about alternative treatments. I'm just worried I will focus too much on possible side effects.
Hopefully there are even better treatments with less side effects available in the near future.
And maybe there will be "the cure" within the next 6-10 years.

[youngandearly]

I myself am 2.5-3 and have maintained or greatly slowed it down with 1/4 of a generic proscar per day and nizoral every second day. No regrowth or thickening but no further loss that I can tell. I too am hoping to maintain until something better comes along. Thats really what we are all hoping for, but I'm not holding my breath like some guys are. I can't use minox because I have low blood pressure so my doc wouldn't prescribe it for me. It might be worth looking into, but i have no personal experience with it. People seem to have the greatest effect from using all of the "big 3" simultaneously.

[25 going on 65]

Yes I have seen enough anecdotes about fat loss in the face from fin/dut to think it is real for a very small unlucky % of men. Glad I did not know about this before I started since it might have scared me away....thought I only needed to worry about gyno
I guess if it happened you could get fillers or fat transfers?

[youngandearly]

Yep, fillers are temporary and fat transfers are a more permanent solution. I look at it this way, fat transfers are cheaper than hair transplants and you have basicly no limitations of donor materials.

[real96]

And if you get Gyno(I think the chances are very low) you can still have a surgery too, so maybe I shouldn't be too worried and just start with Fin.

[Jcm800]

Gyno reduction costs a fortune tho?

[youngandearly]

I think gyno surgery is about 5k, maybe a little more.

[akai]

Now Finasteride is a type 2 5alpha-reductase inhibitor with a short half life (4-6 hours). It is worth noting that the halflife of the 5ar enzyme is much longer than the half life of the drug. All of the studies on fin show that it is generally safe with a very low chance of side effects. It is available in 1 mg (propecia) for hair and 5 mg (proscar) tablets for prostate with the 5mg also available as a generic due to the patent running out.

There is also a dual 5ar inhibitor called Dutasteride that has a much longer half life (4+ weeks) and inhibits both type 1 and 2 5ar. It is available as a .5mg liquid gel capsule (avodart) which cannot be split into smaller doses. It generally has the same side effects but at higher incidences and they would theoretically last longer because of the long half life.

It is worth noting that type 2 5ar is found mostly in the skin and prostate. Type 1 5ar is found in many body tissues including the brain. So dut may have side effects that fin does not.

The side effects you should consider are as follows, loss of libido, inability to acheive erection, thinning of beard or body hair, testicular ache, gynecomastia (breast growth), and possibly a more feminine body fat distribution. Some people also claim that it can cause "brain fog" ie difficulty thinking. The sexual side effects mostly go away after stopping treatment, the fat distribution/breast development does not. The incidence of all side effects is generally low and way over-hyped but could be devastating if you are one of the unlucky few.

I have not experience any of these side effects except for the ball ache during the first week only and maybe puffy nipples (I may have had them to begin with). My libido hasn't changed apreciably and no problems with erections. Can't really say about body or facial hair, because I shave both but there doesn't seem to be any change. Definitely no brain fog or anything like that.

Bottom line, Dut is stronger but i recommend starting with Fin due to lower incidence of side effects and having something stronger to fall back on if fin does not work for you or loses effectivness. The fact that fin is available as a generic and you can split the 5 mg dose into quarters to save even more money is just a bonus, not to mention the shorter half life if you have to stop. You should discuss the risks and benefits with a doctor, considering you will have to see a doctor for a for a script anyways.

Where are you on the norwood scale and how long have you noticed the loss? what is your family history of hair loss?

So it can make you store fat easier on your body yet somehow simultaneously cause fat loss on your face? lol, how is that possible?