Bottom Line as we head into Summer '14

[NeedHairASAP]

Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedHairASAP
I never said it was the cure. It is the next best thing. Isotephersis WORKS. It's a fact. Zinc blocks DHT and is good for hair. It's a fact. It's only logical that using zinc with the best delivery system available today (far better than oral delivery) would offer good results.

Look at vrafs latest side by side.. and thats only 5 months! fin takes 12-18 months for the final conclusion. look at the other results too!

I'm not just guessing. The background science is there...

The jury is still out. I wouldn't hold my breath-- but I would check in periodoically

[deuce]

Japan's regulation for stem cell therapy has been significantly deregulated. Should a method to create follicle come to fruition now, any new biotech deciding to run clinical trials in Japan will find themselves being able to release a treatment rather quickly therefor rendering the 10 year timeline moot.

I hope your right man. I probably should not have said 10 years, but I am frustrated. I hope we all see something quick.

[thechamp]

Surely there is some science to pilox zinc blasting dht ?

[nameless]

Japan's regulation for stem cell therapy has been significantly deregulated. Should a method to create follicle come to fruition now, any new biotech deciding to run clinical trials in Japan will find themselves being able to release a treatment rather quickly therefor rendering the 10 year timeline moot.

* Hellouse I agree with you and I would like to add something. Dr. Gardner made 3 posts that I think are highly relevant to what you just said. Those 3 posts are below under my text to you.

* The thing is that Dr. Gardner is saying that they probably do not need to preserve 100% inductivity during cell culture because some of that inducitivity is the result of interaction between the follicle and the environment that the follicle in in - such as the skin.

* It's my understanding that Dr. Gardner is saying that they have now achieved 40% preservation of inductivity. For all we know this is sufficient for what we want to do. For all we know the rest of the inductivity equation is the result of communication between the follicle's environment (skin) and the cells. In other words if I'm correct and science is at 40% inductivity preservation within the cells then they may already be there and all that is necessary now is to add the necessary environmental (skin) component, which is likely found in the adipose stem cells.

* Last year I think Jahoda said they achieved 22% preservation of inductivity and if they are now up to 40% then that is a market advancement and it may be sufficient. Keep in mind that Jahoda grew some weak hairs when he achieved 22% preservation of hair inductivity in the cells so if they have now reached 40% then that is about double what they achived last year.

* So now what we need to do is figure out how they got it to 40%???? One thing is that Dr. Gardner said that the "LENDL GROUP" is doing the most "ambitious" efforts in this area. So who are the LENDL GROUP?????? It seems to me that, that could be what we need to find out because right now they may be the most advanced in this area right now. Who are they? What do they have? And how do they do what they do? How do they achieve 40% preservation of inductivity???????

* Keep in mind that Jahoda's team is working on a combination model that includes the correct cells with 40% inductivity PLUS adipose stem cells as well. Dr. Garnder said that they are working on a combo model RIGHT NOW. If they can come up with a model so can others. The thing is that what Dr. Gardner told us reveals something very important to us - it tells us what direction the great Jahoda team is taking. They're taking the direction of getting the correct cells cultured in 3d preserving 40%+ inductivity coupled with adipose stem cell activity. So this is what we need to do.

Anyway, who is the Lendl Group and here below are the relevant 3 posts I promised:

Post 1

That paper is describing a technique of growing micro-follicles in the lab, in the same way as that described by the Lauster group. They do not demonstrate complete restoration of in vivo DP character. But I don’t think 100% restoration is required in culture, it won’t hurt but a lot of the character of the DP in vivo is generated by its interactions with surrounding tissue. All we and the other groups are attempting to do is restore enough character to the DP cells to kick start this interaction with a high efficiency.

Post 2

No one has presented, or published work demonstrating full retention of inductivity or gene expression. As I said above “But I don’t think 100% restoration is required in culture, it won’t hurt but a lot of the character of the DP in vivo is generated by its interactions with surrounding tissue. All we and the other groups are attempting to do is restore enough character to the DP cells to kick start this interaction with a high efficiency.”

The addition of growth factors is not desirable for clinical practice. Producing these factors to a clinical standard is very difficult and expensive, it is better to try and induce the cells to make these factors themselves.

I’m not sure what you mean about the sheath cells, do you mean are they important for hair follicle orientation?

The interaction of any constructs with the surrounding tissues is key yes, as I’ve mentioned previously implanting these constructs into skin which has underlying problems will not “cure” baldness. Co-therapies limiting the degradation of any new follicles would be required.

Multi-cell models including adipocytes (fat cells) and melanocytes (cells that provide colouration) are in the works, but I can’t talk about those at the moment

Post 3

Yes there are several genes that are known to be important, LEF1, beta-catenin, various other members of the Wnt signalling pathway. Dr Higgins in her paper identified several thousand genes that demonstrate changed expression (but only a small number of these will actually be relevant for the purposes of inductivity).

Knock down of gene expression in a freshly isolated DP is not really possible, the cells are quite difficult to manipulate genetically in ideal scenarios (2D culture, rapidly proliferating), when they are bunched up as a DP or a DP sphere I don't think it would be possible. However, several groups including ourselves are trying it the other way around, attempting to restore these genes to DP and other non-DP cells. See the Lendl group for the most ambitious attempts.

[nameless]

Surely there is some science to pilox zinc blasting dht ?

If zinc blasting alone would cure hair loss then dutasteride would cure all of our hair loss.

[hellouser]

I hope your right man. I probably should not have said 10 years, but I am frustrated. I hope we all see something quick.

If the science is there, theres not going to be much of a reason for biotechs to prolong trials if the laws allow them to release a treatment quicker... investors won't be happy with that, lol.

On one hand, I hate fat overpaid CEOs, but on the other hand I love the fact that MONEY is much more of an incentive for a cure than sympathy.

[stayhopeful]

Hell brings up a great point. If anything, we can find solace in the fact that each morning we have something incredibly powerful on our side: greed. These researchers and biotech companies are just like every other human, they want to live very comfortably and make their mark somehow. And they want it sooner rather than later. Each day, these natural capitalistic incentives will drive them to push a cure to market. Not sympathy, not empathy. The question is if this drive is strong enough to overcome the enormous challenge of the task. I bet Albert Einstein could have done it if he had enough interest in the subject matter

Anyway, it's depressing we're still having these kinds of theoretical conversations instead of talking bout a tangible route forward in the near future.

[hellouser]

Anyway, it's depressing we're still having these kinds of theoretical conversations instead of talking bout a tangible route forward in the near future.

We should just crowdfund ourselves. Pick up some biology textbooks, learn about cell culturing, find the solution ourselves, open a clinic in India and give a gigantic middle finger F*** YOU to everyone else who's taken forever to do anything about it.

The longer you live, the more you'll realize that nobody gives a shit about you expect you yourself.

[deuce]

The longer you live, the more you'll realize that nobody gives a shit about you expect you yourself.[/QUOTE]

So true. Definitely the older I get the more I realize this. Only people that may look out for you is family or friends that truly care for you. Wish I was family or friends with the CEO or head scientist at Cosmo.

[Hair Bear]

The truth is the quicker you act the better and there is no better time like today to act, do not hesitate and continue to lose ground as I have by wasting time and money on fantasy products that are all hype and no substance, they are all rubbish, at the end of the day all we have is minox and fin you either do one or both but don't kid yourself with other products, if they worked we would all know about it by now.
I was upset about my hair loss a few years ago now I am beyond that and am frustrated at my ignorance for not acting correctly sooner.
I could have at the very least known that I did all that I could have at the time and also had a chance to maintain some of my hair or even managed to regrow some.