Gaz when are you going for your next procedure?

[Arashi]

Correct me if I am wrong but Gaz has about 50 HST grafts per cm square, which translates
to roughly 25-30 FUT grafts, normal density is about 85 fu per square cm so the rest of his head(back and sides) has 85 fu per cm2.

Looking at those numbers I can tell you that its way too thin to look ok under normal daylight, it can look like hairtransplant or someone who is thinning

Not sure what you mean with "normal density is about 85 fu per square cm", cause that's definitely not normal, average is 70 fu/cm2.

And again, yes of course it's thin but it's a huge improvement over the initial situation. If your point is that HST is not a cure, of course, everybody (except Ironman) would agree there.

[ss1980]

this is what bldngblog says:
'Well, if an average Caucasian male has 200 hairs per square centimeter, and 50% of this density can be perceived as normal density, you can say 100 hairs per square centimeter can achieve the fullness. But it really all depends on your hair color, skin color, hair length, hair texture, hair style, etc"

Otherwise if original density is only 70 FUs per cms (presumably that is what gc has) then he should have appearance of full head of hair by now as he received about 50% density but what he got now doesnt look like that. He needs much more hair to be able to grow it out.

[Arashi]

this is what bldngblog says:
'Well, if an average Caucasian male has 200 hairs per square centimeter, and 50% of this density can be perceived as normal density, you can say 100 hairs per square centimeter can achieve the fullness. But it really all depends on your hair color, skin color, hair length, hair texture, hair style, etc"

200 hairs would indeed be 80. I always thought it was 70 and was just googling. Here they did a small test on 50 persons, ranging from 65 to 85 (average would be 75 on normal distribution, but test size population was small of course). On other pages they indeed say 80. I found this page interesting though, which might explain it:

" Most patients have their highest density in the back of the scalp. Hair density in the back of the scalp typically ranges from 60-100 follicular units per square centimeter. It is quite common to find a lower hair density in the side regions of the scalp. Density in this area usually ranges from 50-80 follicular units per square centimeter and occasionally it is so low that a donor harvest may not be possible"

http://www.chicagohairinstitute.com/...rip-harvesting

So that 80 that some sites are talking about might be the back of the head and the sides of the head might be lower, so that might explain why other sites claim lower than 80 as average. Maybe it's safe to take 75 into account then as an average.

What pretty much everybody DOES agree on is that 50 fu/cm2 is needed for a natural looking result, so that's what Gaz should stay above (so 125 hairs/cm2). And again, personally It hink he's just hit that and is now at or slightly below. But I might be wrong. Hoping gaz will measure it for us, would be interesting !

[Arashi]

So, I previously used 70 in my calculations. If 75 is really the average for the whole donor region, then people might actually even go MORE often to HASCI and it would still look natural WITHOUT regrowth. In that case they can offer 25 FU/cm2, so on 200 cm that would be 5000 regular grafts, so that would be 5000 * 2.5/1.3 = 9616 HST graft so if you'd do 1600 HST per time, the average person could then could go 6x to HASCI for 1600 HST grafts each time and the donor would still look untouched and natural, WITHOUT any regrowth at all !!

*EDIT* missed the link in my previous post: http://www.clinicajimenezacosta.com/...blicacion1.pdf

[Arashi]

Also wanted to add: in that last study you will see there's a huge difference per race. In a study in spain, the range was 124-200 hair/cm2, in caucasion populations 160-280 per cm2, african people: 160 hair/cm2 on average, caucasion 200 hair/cm2 on average. So if we look at caucasion only, the average caucasion could even go 7.2 times to HASCI for 1600 HST each time and without regeneration, donor would look still untouched.

[ss1980]

Yes but hasci will say no after 3 or 4 sessions

6 x 1600(approx 10 000 grafts) would be ok coverage with no scarring or moth eaten look, but no way it can work in practice, if gc has another 5 000 grafts he will end up with more hair on top of head than on sides and back.


Since both clown nigamz and gho flopped it is time to focus on dr wesley, he seems honest and transparent.

Btw is nigam still around, last thing i heard was that cops were lookin for him.. what a legend

[Arashi]

Yes but hasci will say no after 3 or 4 sessions

Hehe, no that's not exactly how it works. They said they will evaluate per client if they can continue after 3 sessions. Obviously if you have an average donor, they will let you come back for 7 sessions, cause without regrowth, that's about the limit you have.

[gc83uk]

What pretty much everybody DOES agree on is that 50 fu/cm2 is needed for a natural looking result, so that's what Gaz should stay above (so 125 hairs/cm2). And again, personally It hink he's just hit that and is now at or slightly below. But I might be wrong. Hoping gaz will measure it for us, would be interesting !

Just measured circumference of my head and its about 55cm/56cm, thought I had a smallish head, but that is pretty much average size according to google, maybe slightly below average depending on which site i read lol. I digress....
The area from ear to ear (in particular the area which hasci extract from)
is 27cm.

The depth from uppermost (back of head) where they extracted from down to the linear scar I have is approx 5cm, and around near the sides/ears, its about 3cm which have been extracted from.

All very approximate, so not sure what that would equate to in cm2 area for donor, I would estimate it at 10cm x 3cm (sides) + 17cm x 5cm (back) = 115cm

edit: Lets change that 5cm to 6cm, better to be conservative, difficult to be accuate though because of the taper shape as it curves round to the sides.

So call it about 132cm, that is going down to the 2nd scar + on the quadrants between the back and sides I've gone below the scar by another cm. Cant remember how much lower than the scar that they actually extracted from, without going through all my pics.

[Arashi]

Hey Gaz,

What I meant was measuring the density, by cutting out a square cm like you did before.

Anyway what you did, measuring the donor size is interesting too. I always talk about 200 cm2, but it really depends on how you measure it. I just measured mine again. You talk about 'ear to ear', if you take that as borders of the donor, then you indeed will get (way) less than 200 cm2. I took the whole area, extending beyond the ears to the hairline. I do realize that it seems most clinics do not use that area beyond the ears, I wonder why that is though, maybe because that area is more difficult to extract from ? Also it seems density is naturally lower on the sides than on the back (as also noted in that thesis that I linked to in my earlier post in this thread)

If you google, then you will find that an average caucasian has about 100.000 hairs on his scalp. Like noted before, average density for a caucasian is about 200 hairs/cm2, so that would be 500 cm2 in total of hair on an average scalp. In such case 300 cm2 recipient and 200 cm2 donor would seem like a fair estimate (3:2 ratio), but again, it does matter of course if you go beyond the ears or not ... And I also think that 6 cm on the back is really on the low end, I think it's more like 7-7.5, but that also depends on how 'deep' and 'high' you go of course ...

[Arashi]

But maybe that explains why HASCI wants to evaluate after 3 times, while in my calculations an average caucasian could go 7 times to HASCI and his donor would still look untouched WITHOUT regrowth. In that case you would need to take from that extended area beyond the ears too. Maybe HASCI is a bit more conservative to select the donor area. But still, even if you are a conservative and come up with approx 130-140 cm2 as donor size (like you did), then that would still mean an average caucasian could go 5x to HASCI and donor would look untouched, WITHOUT any regrowth at all.