from those photos anyone would be able to tell something weird was going on.
Originally Posted by fred970
If he shaved his head with a razor or got the closest shave - electric shaver then he may be alright.
If you know you won't feel like a freak getting SMP done then go for it.
I think the main thing holding me back is that I would most likely feel like a freak if I had this done.
Just imagine a friend of yours, a colleague, getting this done what would your reaction be.......I keep thinking that I'd think WHY?!? would he do that. So everyone else will think the same of you if you had it done.
Actually, if you call HIS they will not tell you the color will not change. They will tell you that it is prone to fading over time in which small touch ups may be needed. It is a clever way of not answering the question.
... apparently the ink won't change colour according to HIS.
What you need to understand is that there is no perfect solution. Permanent SMP eventually changes color, no two ways about it. The only way, currently, to avoid this is to use a temporary solution like the one we offer. If we felt confident that a permanent solution would not turn blue or green or disperse into a dot ten times the size of it's original size then we'd offer it. These are some of the reasons why I used to be the most vocal SMP critic.
The additional benefit to SMP is the fact that is disappears with time. One is not stuck with the same design they originally received. Case in point is the individual I posted in this thread. He's barely over the age of 20 so he's not stuck with the youthful hairline we gave him. As he ages he can have the hairline gradually moved upward or modified any other way as long as it is reasonable. Lasers are not required to remove it, just time. With permanent SMP not only are lasers required they are not always effective. We have one local client that had permanent SMP and he's been through four laser sessions to have it removed and so far there are still a lot of giant dots on his scalp. We have another client that had to fly half way across the country five times to have it done properly. It's 98% gone but the time and expense to remove it properly and safely was a huge hassle and expense.
I would normally agree with you 100%. However, I wish I could show you all this patient full face as it looks so much better when the whole face is put into context. I can't get into too much detail but this client is not Caucasian and is very young. He is a professional model, and I don't mean that he does a few golf shirt shots for the local free newspaper. Last week he was in Mexico shooting a spread for a popular magazine and the week before he was in London modeling on a catwalk. If this looked unnatural in ANY way we would know about it and our client simply would not be working. It's as simple as that. We cannot apply our typical thinking of what a Caucasian hairline should look like on this client.
No offense but sorry this does not look right. If this patient came to me and asked me to give him this hairline with SMP I would tell him sorry but I'm not going to do that........why.............because I would just not be able to do it with a good conscience.
The truth of the matter is that I was kind of irritated with the client because he's lazy (it's a running joke between us). We told him he should keep his head buzzed to a zero guard for the best appearance but he didn't do this before he came in for his follow up visit. I should have just buzzed his head again right then and there because it looks far better at such a length. I've actually started doing this on some of clients since and I'll do it for this client once he returns and I get more photos.
the sides, back and some areas of the top look great.
Well the work itself is very good and the pictures as always excellent.
Hey, thanks for the great updates Jotronic! I've been following this thread closely and am considering a procedure for temporary SMP this year or next.
I'm young, diffuse thinning, want to get this done, shave my head, stop worrying about this **** since meds don't seem to suit me. My main questions/concerns are:
-Since I still have a decent head of hair, how does applying temporary SMP fit in with that?
-It seems like it should enhance the effect, but does the SMP damage the existing follicles at all or hinder new growth?
- Can I keep applying medications (topical minox, maybe some experimental topicals as well) over the SMP so that I can perhaps maintain my hair while having SMP to improve the shaved look at the thinned out areas?
- As the SMP fades, will it start looking odd 1.5 years in or so?
-Any known toxicity issues? And in your opinion, if I keep it shaved to a zero guard, will people be able to tell given that I do still have hair all over my head?
I know there is no perfect solution, if there was I would have had it done, and would not still be researching after 2 years and being bald for 12 years.
Originally Posted by Jotronic
I am currently trying to find out as much as I can about SMP before going ahead with anything.
As far as I am aware HIS have not had anyone experience any colour changes who have had the treatment done with them. They say their inks are designed not to discolour, taken from their website: "The pigments we use have been developed to not to fade or discolour over the long term".
But I believe you are right in that they cannot be sure of this as they have only been in business for a short time. They will not categorically say the treatment won't discolour because they have no evidence over an extended period of time that this will or will not happen. They do not want hundreds of lawsuits falling into their hands in 10, 20, 30 years time. Based on HIS's history, a patient should not experience any discolouration after around 10 years.......beyond that....is the risk you take. Another thing I would take into consideration is a proper cure could be out within 10 years so the SMP could be covered with hair. Yes, I know we have know idea when a cure could appear. It is just something you may be possibly be able to fall back on if SMP started having issues into it's 10th, 15th, 20th year. It is as I say a risk.
I understand patients who have had permanent SMP with other clinics have had their treatment turn blue, this is the same old story with hair transplants - you need to do your research and go to a reputable clinic.
If you or anyone has heard of any issues with HIS clients SMP turning blue then please let me know. As far as I know they are fairly reputable in terms of the treatment remaining the same colour.
I would also consider Temporary SMP, but to keep topping up every 2 years for £2000+ is not very appealing. An idea for me would be to see what SMP looked like before getting a permanent treatment or seeing as we may be close to a cure in the coming years.....see where we are at after 2 years, re-evaluate, and if no cure is out, get temporary SMP for another 2 years, again re-access the situation and if nothing promising is on the horizon in terms of a care then consider permanent SMP.....this will also benefit me in that I will also have an extra 4 years to re-evaluate how permanent SMP is holding up and if any dis-colouration has happend to any HIS clients in that time.
I am interested in your statement: "Permanent SMP eventually changes color, no two ways about it."
.....Could you expand on this......how do you know 100% it will change colour? Do you have some sort of scientific proof of this?
Actually I have just been on the Milena Lardi beauty medical website....
I thought temporary SMP lasted 2 years, it seems I am wrong.......turns out it lasts 6 to 18 months on one part of the page I have linked below or 6 to 12 months according to another statement:
Taken from their website:
"HOW LONG DOES THE TREATMENT LAST?
The treatment of Micropigmentation holds in good condition for approximately 6 to 18 months , depending on the type of skin, the technique adopted, the zone treated and the pigment used."
"Length of the effect: Pigments are gradually assimilated by the body in a period lasting from 6 to 12 months."
Have I just got confused or do these statements contradict each other?
I thought £2,000 for 2 years was pricey, but £2,000 for something that could last only 6 months, this is for the very wealthy by the looks of things. This just isn't financially viable and would be too much hassle to fly to Italy 1 to 2 times a year. The only positive I can see in getting this done is to get an idea of how SMP looks before deciding to go for a permanent procedure.
I have a question for you Jotronic, Just out of curiosity how many grafts would you hypothetically be able to harvest from this guy ? I think i am going towards the same pattern but with a smaller head (donor area also looking the same), and a viable option would be "the less is more" aproach (fue) combined with smp (buzz cut look), if i some day in the future wanted to do something about my hairloss.
Thx in advance :-)
You're right; it's not at all viable and is in no way a solution.
Originally Posted by sausage
Hey Joe how is that website coming along? I'd like to see some blonde guy results
what I am baffled by is the fact that smp procedures ignore what hair transplants have been on to forever- the hairline is not a straight cut line. all of these smp results look really unnatural to me, they look painted on because the frontal line is so defined. follicles on a full head of hair, when shaved down, have a feathered appearance at the front. Even hair transplants are kind of faulty in this respect, they usually put a wavy line down, but no subtle feathering of density at the front. my own hairline has a jag in the center, and many people have a small widows peak. the only time i see such defined hairlines is on people with very short black curly hair that style it with a razor. I would consider SMP in the future but only if the folks doing it can start looking at what full heads of hair actually look like when shaved down. thanks for the photos. Also I agree with the poster that said that this guys hair looks bad when it's at that length, he needs to shave it down. looks patchy still.
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