50 grafts patch test in Vitro Hair Doubling as requested by GC @Dr. Nigam's

[Arashi]

IM is Gho shill, arashi used to be fair and balanced poster then he changed for worse

constructive criticism is welcome but gho fanboys are getting paranoid these days

Are you on any medication ?

[Arashi]

By the way, I'm thinking, if you can get some random guy from the Netherlands to come to your clinic for the test, have him fly back within 1-2 days after the test, I can meet up with this guy, check his scalp and verify everything is good. THAT should be solid proof then, and that's what we all want, right ?

[drnigams]

Didi, on 25th april the guy who is coming is from east asia and also a forum member, he agreed to document his case,he has done 2 to 3 transplants in the past.
The guy who enrolled today is a dutch, he is also a forum member,( not a random guy) he will confirm his dates ,he will come in may 2013.And fully aware of our conversations and ready to document.
Plus there are 6 more forum guys for next two months with confirmed bookings ,one from usa and one from canada, they are also forum members.
Most of them ready to document.How can i guarantee the quality of pics taken by them at their homes.

I can't put tattoo on them ,luckily nsn had a birth mark.
And it's already proven 90% regen around birth mark in his case, who is an independent member.


There is another forum

IM is Gho shill, arashi used to be fair and balanced poster then he changed for worse

constructive criticism is welcome but gho fanboys are getting paranoid these days


dr nigam

you gonna have some dutch man on 25th of april? what is he getting, test or full procedure? can you get him to post on this forum

[didi]

thats what we need, we gotta find that man.
if arashi says its all good ..it means dr nigam is legit

you gonna switch sides if its real?

[gc83uk]

Dr Nigam,

The reason why Arashi is finding the 15 graft test difficult to take as solid evidence is this:

Imagine those 15 extractions in the donor area are ALL transections.

Now imagine how EASY it would be to extract 15/30 hair grafts from ALL OVER the head on the same day 0. And then implant those 15/30 grafts from around the head into the recipient.

Later you show us video back combing the long hair, yes this is great, but nobody could ever see or be able to find 15 extractions in those long hairs.

Do you understand now?

I know it seems crazy that anybody would do this, probably Arashi and almost certainly myself don't really believe you would go to these lengths, however I need to be 100% sure, not 99.9% sure. This is the difference between a Yes and a No.

Even Didi your biggest fan is not convinced, surely this tells you everything you need to know!

Personally my other reason for being so doubtful is because 15 grafts for documentation is such a small number. Theoretically you can take your time with these 15 grafts in a pain staking way, however when your doing sessions of 2000 and your being less careful because each graft is not being scrutinised and analysed by the word, it's then I wonder how many will regrow in the donor and the success of the grafts in the recipient.

These are my reasons.

I honestly hope you can convince us all with larger documented procedures, which I'm sure you will in the coming weeks. Until then I don't believe there is anything to talk about on this.

[Arashi]

you gonna switch sides if its real?

How many times do I have to explain to you this is not a game. There are no 'sides'. If Dr Nigams can proof he has a therapy that's better than Gho's, I'm going to salute him for that and will speak only good of him. Why wouldn't I ? I really don't understand your point of view, like it's a game between Gho Vs nigam and there has to be a winner and loser or something.

[Arashi]

Dr Nigam,

The reason why Arashi is finding the 15 graft test difficult to take as solid evidence is this:

Imagine those 15 extractions in the donor area are ALL transections.

Now imagine how EASY it would be to extract 15/30 hair grafts from ALL OVER the head on the same day 0. And then implant those 15/30 grafts from around the head into the recipient.

Later you show us video back combing the long hair, yes this is great, but nobody could ever see or be able to find 15 extractions in those long hairs.

Do you understand now?

I know it seems crazy that anybody would do this, probably Arashi and almost certainly myself don't really believe you would go to these lengths, however I need to be 100% sure, not 99.9% sure. This is the difference between a Yes and a No.

Even Didi your biggest fan is not convinced, surely this tells you everything you need to know!

Personally my other reason for being so doubtful is because 15 grafts for documentation is such a small number. Theoretically you can take your time with these 15 grafts in a pain staking way, however when you doing sessions of 2000 and your being less careful because each grafts is not being scrutinised and analysed by the word, it's then I wonder how many will regrow in the donor and the success of the grafts in the recipient.

These are my reasons.

I honestly hope you can convince us all with larger documented procedures, which I'm sure you will in the coming weeks. Until then I don't believe there is anything to talk about on this.

Thanks for summing that up, GC, these are exactly my thoughts. And very good point regarding Didi.

[drnigams]

GC , you are right regarding human error when a surgeon does large procedure.
Will you similarly agree with that if i shave this guy(of course i hope i will be able to convince him)than you can clearly rule out the possibility of extraction from any other site ,since his case is only 7 days old ,any other mark of extraction will be visible.
Of course next week i am into next step forward with the next documentation with more improved version.

Dr Nigam,

The reason why Arashi is finding the 15 graft test difficult to take as solid evidence is this:

Imagine those 15 extractions in the donor area are ALL transections.

Now imagine how EASY it would be to extract 15/30 hair grafts from ALL OVER the head on the same day 0. And then implant those 15/30 grafts from around the head into the recipient.

Later you show us video back combing the long hair, yes this is great, but nobody could ever see or be able to find 15 extractions in those long hairs.

Do you understand now?

I know it seems crazy that anybody would do this, probably Arashi and almost certainly myself don't really believe you would go to these lengths, however I need to be 100% sure, not 99.9% sure. This is the difference between a Yes and a No.

Even Didi your biggest fan is not convinced, surely this tells you everything you need to know!

Personally my other reason for being so doubtful is because 15 grafts for documentation is such a small number. Theoretically you can take your time with these 15 grafts in a pain staking way, however when your doing sessions of 2000 and your being less careful because each graft is not being scrutinised and analysed by the word, it's then I wonder how many will regrow in the donor and the success of the grafts in the recipient.

These are my reasons.

I honestly hope you can convince us all with larger documented procedures, which I'm sure you will in the coming weeks. Until then I don't believe there is anything to talk about on this.

[Arashi]

GC , you are right regarding human error when a surgeon does large procedure.
Will you similarly agree with that if i shave this guy(of course i hope i will be able to convince him)than you can clearly rule out the possibility of extraction from any other site ,since his case is only 7 days old ,any other mark of extraction will be visible.
Of course next week i am into next step forward with the next documentation with more improved version.

Shaving would already be a lot better proof. But I think it would be a truely solid case if you have your Dutch patient fly back within 1-2 days of extraction and let me meet up with him in the Netherlands the day after that. That would really be a solid case, far beyond shooting a video.

[drnigams]

Arashi,
He will be doing doubling of 1000 grafts plus take HM and dp injections.
How will you analyse.
I am not sure any member would like to disclose his personal identity,he has been advised by me to keep his hair long so that he can cover up his shaved donor, he does not even want anyone to know he got any ht done.
How will you analyse such a case.
I have an office at hague(netherland), would you accept any of my staff who keeps travelling hague to mumbai every month,with your grace he may get a free procedure.

Shaving would already be a lot better proof. But I think it would be a truely solid case if you have your Dutch patient fly back within 1-2 days of extraction and let me meet up with him in the Netherlands the day after that. That would really be a solid case, far beyond shooting a video.

[gc83uk]

GC , you are right regarding human error when a surgeon does large procedure.
Will you similarly agree with that if i shave this guy(of course i hope i will be able to convince him)than you can clearly rule out the possibility of extraction from any other site ,since his case is only 7 days old ,any other mark of extraction will be visible.
Of course next week i am into next step forward with the next documentation with more improved version.

I think you should leave your poor staff guys hair alone

I don't think he would be happy for you shaving all his hair.

After 7 days most of my extraction sites had completely cleared up, so I think this would be a waste of time anyway.

Honestly Dr Nigam I think the best way forward is to start a fresh on a new patient, preferably somebody who already shaves their head or someone who will need to shave their head for the Doubling procedure.

I admire your efforts in listening to the forum members, I've never known anything like this in my life.

[Arashi]

Arashi,
He will be doing doubling of 1000 grafts plus take HM and dp injections.
How will you analyse.
I am not sure any member would like to disclose his personal identity,he has been advised by me to keep his hair long so that he can cover up his shaved donor, he does not even want anyone to know he got any ht done.
How will you analyse such a case.
I have an office at hague(netherland), would you accept any of my staff who keeps travelling hague to mumbai every month,with your grace he may get a free procedure.

I misunderstood, I thought you were doing a 50 graft test here.

If you're going to perform 1000 grafts doubling, then I don't even need to meet up with him. All we need are good highres pre-op photo's of the donor area you're going to take the grafts from and post-op photo's of the same. And then same for recipient.

However, if you're willing to have your staff member travel from Mumbai to The Hague, then yes, this would be PERFECT. However to make this a solid case, you'd have to agree to certain things. Like that he flies back within 2 days of extraction (so I wouldn't have any problems detecting other extraction points) and we'd need to do a little skype meeting on the day of extraction, so I could see his recipient is still untouched at that time. Not very difficult to arrange I think and yes, that would be SOLID proof.

[Arashi]

After 7 days most of my extraction sites had completely cleared up, so I think this would be a waste of time anyway.

Yes, that's why time is of essence and he'd need to get on the plane to the Netherlands the day after the test.

[gc83uk]

I should also add that if you can persuade NSN to do an AFTER picture of those 468 grafts then I think this will be extremely valuable.

I understand we do not have a pre-extraction photo of that area, but at least we will be able to see how many of those 468 sites have regrown.

I know he is busy and it's his prerogative to get on with his life or not want to share with the community, if this is the case, then you just need to get a new patient like NSN, give him a free week holiday in a nice resort in India where he can relax. On the 1st day he has his procedure, On the 7th day ask him to come back into the office and take a good after photo. Don't worry, you really don't need a tattoo. You just need to map the hair grafts, the same way JJJrS / IM did.

I know you have doubts about me being able to find those 468 sites, but it's really not that difficult, even 6 months later it would still be easy.

[Arashi]

So yeah, there are options to show SOLID proof here. Would be very interesting to see if Dr Nigams is going to take them