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  1. #1
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    Default Where is the threshold for the shock loss of minoxidil-dependent hair?

    I would like to find an answer to this question, hoping that someone has already unvoluntarily "mapped" this problem.

    Two years ago I began experimenting with 15% minoxidil in order to regrow some hair in my temples. Maybe the biggest mistake of my life! Before this fatal decision, I had lived comfortably on 2-5% minoxidil for 14 years with an unchanged Norwood 1.5 hairline.

    The application of 15% minoxidil ED regrew only few hairs, and caused a telogen effluvium. Being terrified by this, after 6 months I lowered my dose to 10% EOD, and I noticed no hair loss after this switch. After additional 7 months (in February 2012), I realized that 10% minoxidil does nothing, and stopped using it. I thought that a return to 5% minoxidil would constitute no problem. What a mistake! Mere 4 months later (in June 2012), my hair was virtually annihilated everywhere, where I had applied the stuff. And after 8 months, it is clear that it won't regrow back. Apparently, it was a loss of hair that had become dependent on 10% minoxidil in the meantime.

    This loss terrified me so much that in April 2012, I began to mix my 5% Kirkland minoxidil with high-strength minoxidil to achieve a 6% concentration. In June 2012, I added finasteride and experienced quite a nice regrowth during the first 2-3 months. However, in November 2012 it stopped and I started to experience very aggressive shedding in my temples. Being again scared, I increased the minoxidil dosage to 6.2-6.3%. The shedding hasn't stopped even after 4 months and it is very depressing. Nevertheless, I must hope that it is a shed induced by finasteride, because it is unlikely that both finasteride and minoxidil would stop working at the same time. But to feel at least a bit safer, two weeks ago I added dutasteride, 0.5 mg every four days.

    The problem is that the high-strength minoxidils are pretty unstable, they often arrive crystallized and the percentage of minoxidil in the mixture may thus fluctuate. I estimate that it may vary at least between 5.9-6.3%. (I tested them in a laboratory.) It is a big burden for me. I do hope that such fluctuations are not enough to cause a new shock loss, but since this high percentage is useless anyway, I would like to return back to 5% minoxidil. But I don't know, if it is possible without a noticeable hair loss. Maybe the difference is so small that I wouldn't notice anything, even if I switched directly from 6.3% to 5%. The fact that I noticed nothing after the switch from 15% ED to 10% EOD suggests that lowering the dosage by one-third doesn't reach the critical threshold for a shock loss. But maybe the hairs were not enough dependent on the 15% strength yet. I don't know. Therefore, I am asking the visitors of this forum. I know that a plenty of guys experienced problems after switching from 15% or 10% to 5%, but where is actually the point, when the problems start?

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by WarLord View Post
    I would like to find an answer to this question, hoping that someone has already unvoluntarily "mapped" this problem.

    Two years ago I began experimenting with 15% minoxidil in order to regrow some hair in my temples. Maybe the biggest mistake of my life! Before this fatal decision, I had lived comfortably on 2-5% minoxidil for 14 years with an unchanged Norwood 1.5 hairline.

    The application of 15% minoxidil ED regrew only few hairs, and caused a telogen effluvium. Being terrified by this, after 6 months I lowered my dose to 10% EOD, and I noticed no hair loss after this switch. After additional 7 months (in February 2012), I realized that 10% minoxidil does nothing, and stopped using it. I thought that a return to 5% minoxidil would constitute no problem. What a mistake! Mere 4 months later (in June 2012), my hair was virtually annihilated everywhere, where I had applied the stuff. And after 8 months, it is clear that it won't regrow back. Apparently, it was a loss of hair that had become dependent on 10% minoxidil in the meantime.

    This loss terrified me so much that in April 2012, I began to mix my 5% Kirkland minoxidil with high-strength minoxidil to achieve a 6% concentration. In June 2012, I added finasteride and experienced quite a nice regrowth during the first 2-3 months. However, in November 2012 it stopped and I started to experience very aggressive shedding in my temples. Being again scared, I increased the minoxidil dosage to 6.2-6.3%. The shedding hasn't stopped even after 4 months and it is very depressing. Nevertheless, I must hope that it is a shed induced by finasteride, because it is unlikely that both finasteride and minoxidil would stop working at the same time. But to feel at least a bit safer, two weeks ago I added dutasteride, 0.5 mg every four days.

    The problem is that the high-strength minoxidils are pretty unstable, they often arrive crystallized and the percentage of minoxidil in the mixture may thus fluctuate. I estimate that it may vary at least between 5.9-6.3%. (I tested them in a laboratory.) It is a big burden for me. I do hope that such fluctuations are not enough to cause a new shock loss, but since this high percentage is useless anyway, I would like to return back to 5% minoxidil. But I don't know, if it is possible without a noticeable hair loss. Maybe the difference is so small that I wouldn't notice anything, even if I switched directly from 6.3% to 5%. The fact that I noticed nothing after the switch from 15% ED to 10% EOD suggests that lowering the dosage by one-third doesn't reach the critical threshold for a shock loss. But maybe the hairs were not enough dependent on the 15% strength yet. I don't know. Therefore, I am asking the visitors of this forum. I know that a plenty of guys experienced problems after switching from 15% or 10% to 5%, but where is actually the point, when the problems start?
    172 views and no people with the experience of shedding after minoxidil? It's hard to believe.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by WarLord View Post
    172 views and no people with the experience of shedding after minoxidil? It's hard to believe.
    Frankly, I think most people open the thread, see how much you wrote, and decide they'd rather not invest their time. I'm not sure that there's a quantifiable threshold for what you're asking; I'm really not sure how you would test that, or that researchers would find it an objective worth their energy.

  4. #4
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    Ditto BigThinker's comment. You made a really long, convoluted post that culminated in a pretty unclear question. I understand the tendency to use the forum like a journal, but when you're soliciting input, concision and clarity is a virtue.

    Re-reading the post, I'm still having a bit of trouble determining exactly what you're asking.

  5. #5
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    That being said, it's hard to believe that switching from 6.xx% to 5% would cause much difference; it's such a minute variation. I think that, given your experience with minoxidil, you simply need to pick one strength and stick with it for the long haul. Given that 5% is the easiest to obtain and comes ready to apply with no mixing, I'd think that would be the easiest and most sustainable route.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by win200 View Post
    That being said, it's hard to believe that switching from 6.xx% to 5% would cause much difference; it's such a minute variation. I think that, given your experience with minoxidil, you simply need to pick one strength and stick with it for the long haul. Given that 5% is the easiest to obtain and comes ready to apply with no mixing, I'd think that would be the easiest and most sustainable route.
    I also think that I need to pick one strength; the 5% strength. Reliance on companies that produce 10-15 % minoxidils is risky, because they emerge and disappear quite quickly. But my question is, if the switch from 6.3% to 5% would lead to a shock loss of hair. Alternatively, how long should I taper the dosages? Has anybody an experience of this sort?

    You know, saying that the difference between 6% and 5% is "minute" must be supported by some evidence. I also thought that the difference between 10% EOD and 5% ED was "minute". But it was a disaster.

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