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  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by hellouser View Post
    In regards to Propecia, I completely agree that it is the best solution to fighting hairloss... at least best proven. RU has shown some fantastic results (look into IrishPride's journey, its better than any examples of Propecia). CB is supposedly 2X as strong as Fin so it could be even better though still not proven.

    I would be more concerned about him developing permanent erectile dysfunction with Propecia. That terrifies me and for that reason alone I would never run the risk of using it.

    In regards to Gho; logic tells me if there hasnt been a solid case disproving his science (because there hasnt been, neither legitimate nor legal) it is more likely than not a legitimate claim. More people are are coming out of Gho's clinics happy and claiming it works than the contrary and this has been going on for YEARS. Its pretty bizarre how people are STILL skeptical.

    In regards to Bosley: seriously though.... $200 million to drop and NOT have a working formula? That would be plain stupid for any investor. Their photographs in Phase II proved a working formula, the most important trial of all. Phase III will only determine which route they take as they have many options and that will chose the best one in the end. I dont want to say Aderans is 100% guaranteed, but all signs point to it. Now, as for how well it works... thats yet to be determined.
    Some valid point you've got. Even still, I really think the risk of PERMANENT side effects for a grown man taking propecia are just so low. I mean think about that for a minute, how could it still be causing the effects 6 months after cessation of the drug? We know it stops DHT inhibitance once you go off because the possitive benefits for the hair stop. So once you get your DHT back, what long term damage could you have really done? I know anything sexual scares the shit out of us, but the risks of PERMANENT bad effects (not sexual, just bad effects in general) are worse via surgery than Propecia, and that goes for tradition HT as well as Dr. Gho's procedure. There are risks of scarring, poor yield, lack of donor regrowth, poor aesthetic results, etc.

    I agree with you that the absense of unhappy Gho patients online is very positive, he's been around years and done 1,000s of these, but that still doesn't mean that all his claims are valid. We know he's conservative and doesn't seem to be screwing people up...but then again you can approach from an opposite angle and say that he has virtually no documentation of making big visual transformations i.e. wow results online. Clinics like Rahal and H&W are limited by finite donor supply and have dozens of literally mind blowing results, and Gho claims to greatly expand the donor supply and you can't even find 2-3 pics of big transformations anywhere online? I want to believe as badly as anyone that he can do what he says he can do, and the story will play out, but until he has some documentation of great finished results, versus just the science and the donor regrowth, I have to remain cautiously optimisit but still far from convinced. And for that reason I think it's reckless to tell somebody "you've got no alternative, you need to immediately book with Dr. Gho!"

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gandolf View Post
    Some valid point you've got. Even still, I really think the risk of PERMANENT side effects for a grown man taking propecia are just so low. I mean think about that for a minute, how could it still be causing the effects 6 months after cessation of the drug? We know it stops DHT inhibitance once you go off because the possitive benefits for the hair stop. So once you get your DHT back, what long term damage could you have really done? I know anything sexual scares the shit out of us, but the risks of PERMANENT bad effects (not sexual, just bad effects in general) are worse via surgery than Propecia, and that goes for tradition HT as well as Dr. Gho's procedure. There are risks of scarring, poor yield, lack of donor regrowth, poor aesthetic results, etc.

    I agree with you that the absense of unhappy Gho patients online is very positive, he's been around years and done 1,000s of these, but that still doesn't mean that all his claims are valid. We know he's conservative and doesn't seem to be screwing people up...but then again you can approach from an opposite angle and say that he has virtually no documentation of making big visual transformations i.e. wow results online. Clinics like Rahal and H&W are limited by finite donor supply and have dozens of literally mind blowing results, and Gho claims to greatly expand the donor supply and you can't even find 2-3 pics of big transformations anywhere online? I want to believe as badly as anyone that he can do what he says he can do, and the story will play out, but until he has some documentation of great finished results, versus just the science and the donor regrowth, I have to remain cautiously optimisit but still far from convinced. And for that reason I think it's reckless to tell somebody "you've got no alternative, you need to immediately book with Dr. Gho!"
    You're both right and both wrong.

    I had side effects from propecia. I think it sucks and wouldnt touch it. I feel lucky that everything is back in working order. It doesnt matter if the drug is out of your system - some people freak out and get obsessed and then the damage is done. Permanently. If you think you can't get an erection and worry about it too much you probably wont' get one.

    Unfortunately I had an FUT procedure done and I'm pretty desperate. I feel terrible that I have scars. Such dumb vanity. If I could go back I would.

    In hindsight I wish I'd at least spent my money on Gho. Its not like my FUT's provided good results. So that being the case why not see Gho.

    At the very least it works as FUE does without scaring. For that reason alone its better then FUT and normal FUE.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiwi View Post
    At the very least it works as FUE does without scaring. For that reason alone its better then FUT and normal FUE.
    For donor regeneration alone its better than FUT and normal FUE. Just saying I'm not sure I've seen more evidence for scarlessness than I've seen for donor regeneration. Then again, observing scars require a higher image quality.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiwi View Post
    You're both right and both wrong.

    I had side effects from propecia. I think it sucks and wouldnt touch it. I feel lucky that everything is back in working order. It doesnt matter if the drug is out of your system - some people freak out and get obsessed and then the damage is done. Permanently. If you think you can't get an erection and worry about it too much you probably wont' get one.
    I'm not sure how this makes me right AND wrong, your case pretty much illustrates what I said that surgery in a much, MUCH riskier option in the long run because whereas the side effects of surgery can be lifelong and potentially unrepairable, there exists no real evidence of Propecia causing permanent effects. Yes, you have people who are going to freak out and obsess over side effects and effect their libido due to their own anxiety about a physical problem that doesn't exist...but that is a different issue entirely and in my opinion can't really be pinned on Propecia itself. You had bad results from both surgical and medical and luckily, you were able to reverse the bad results from the medical treatments. Reversing the damage from your surgery will not be as easy and maybe not possible, but breakthroughs are occurring and I wish you well and hope that you eventually do get the results you're after.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gandolf View Post
    there exists no real evidence of Propecia causing permanent effects.
    What kind of evidence you need when the company itself admits the possibility of permanent side effects!!

    Below is a quick look at the side effects from propecia site:

    "In clinical studies for PROPECIA, a small number of men experienced certain sexual side effects, such as less desire for sex, difficulty in achieving an erection, or a decrease in the amount of semen. Each of these side effects occurred in less than 2% of men and went away in men who stopped taking PROPECIA because of them."

    The above part is OK, since it mentions that sides wll go away once you quit the drug, but then comes the next paragraph:

    "In general use, the following have been reported: breast tenderness and enlargement (tell your doctor about any changes in your breasts such as lumps, pain, or nipple discharge); depression; decrease in sex drive that continued after stopping the medication; allergic reactions including rash, itching, hives, and swelling of the lips and face; problems with ejaculation that continued after stopping medication; testicular pain; difficulty in achieving an erection that continued after stopping the medication; male infertility and/or poor quality of semen; and, in rare cases, male breast cancer. Tell your doctor if you have any side effect that bothers you or that does not go away."

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by aim4hair View Post
    What kind of evidence you need when the company itself admits the possibility of permanent side effects!!

    Below is a quick look at the side effects from propecia site:

    "In clinical studies for PROPECIA, a small number of men experienced certain sexual side effects, such as less desire for sex, difficulty in achieving an erection, or a decrease in the amount of semen. Each of these side effects occurred in less than 2% of men and went away in men who stopped taking PROPECIA because of them."

    The above part is OK, since it mentions that sides wll go away once you quit the drug, but then comes the next paragraph:

    "In general use, the following have been reported: breast tenderness and enlargement (tell your doctor about any changes in your breasts such as lumps, pain, or nipple discharge); depression; decrease in sex drive that continued after stopping the medication; allergic reactions including rash, itching, hives, and swelling of the lips and face; problems with ejaculation that continued after stopping medication; testicular pain; difficulty in achieving an erection that continued after stopping the medication; male infertility and/or poor quality of semen; and, in rare cases, male breast cancer. Tell your doctor if you have any side effect that bothers you or that does not go away."
    It says to tell your Dr. if you experience it, that's different from saying there's a probability you will experience it. I'm not opposed to those who say Propecia is too risky, I just think it's insane when those same people are saying have surgery. Surgery, without a shadow of a doubt, poses a significantly greater risk of long term problems than Propecia.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gandolf View Post
    It says to tell your Dr. if you experience it, that's different from saying there's a probability you will experience it. I'm not opposed to those who say Propecia is too risky, I just think it's insane when those same people are saying have surgery. Surgery, without a shadow of a doubt, poses a significantly greater risk of long term problems than Propecia.
    What kinda greater risk of long term problems would a scarless surgery poses ?

  8. #18
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    Do not goto Gho.

    Get plucking from Jerry Cooley. I'm serious brother - ironman and hellouser work for Gho.

    G3skock is just photos from Ghos secretary - it's all photoshopped

    Sad but true

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by aim4hair View Post
    What kinda greater risk of long term problems would a scarless surgery poses ?
    He is talking about this problem...

    ...in case if he will suffer from permanent shockloss or DUPA or senescent AGA after having his hair transplants by Rahal and/or Hasson&Wrong.
    Especially above/behind his ears - everybody will see his stretching long strip scar and he will be unable to hide this "dirty secret". That is his problem.

    [photo removed at user's request. Please not repost other's member's photos without their permission]

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by aim4hair View Post
    What kinda greater risk of long term problems would a scarless surgery poses ?
    1)Individual scars might be too small to be noticed on the head when looking at it but there is still scar tissue created (Gho admits this himself in one of the Spencer Kobren interviews).
    2)Poor aesthetic results
    3)Poor yields
    4)Poor donor regeneration

    I am not saying that numbers 1, 2, and 3 are going to happen...but they are certainly a theoretical risk of going under the knife.

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