Finasteride didn't work for you? So, did DUT?

[tedwuji]

Yeah im on fin been on it for around 6 months.

Ok for me i saw things happen right around 8 months.

What you must understand, and most guys really dont.... the drug first has to lower your DHT and do it long enough to alter the actual follicles (restoring them to health by limiting DHT accumulation) and this alone takes MONTHS. Then after that hair needs to grow and hair grows pretty slow. So really, ypu will be best served by waiting AT LEAST 9 months and preferably the full 12 before making any value judgememt whatsoever. And this advice really isnt my own its Mercks and its just the way it is.

Again: give it time, if it doesnt work talk to a doctor about dutasteride if you want a stronger AA class drug.

[jamesst11]

The drug induces changes at the cellular level of the follicle, o.k.. therefor, you would expect the hair to enter telogen and shed about 3 months after initiation of the DHT reduction. That is why people get a shed 3-6 months in. After that, I don't see any reason why you should still be shedding massive amounts of hair. It makes no sense to me. At 6 months hair shedding should be DONE, especially if on minoxidil. If you are losing crazy amounts of hair at 9,10,11 months and observing minimal regrowth and, instead miniaturization, the drug is f*cking you. Get off. That being said, I am starting to lean more towards the theory that if Finasteride makes you lose MORE hair, and rapidly, then DUT will do the same if not worst. If you simply maintain on fin, or have a little lose, I think DUT has a better chance of being more succesful. This is why I think I need off of all of these.

[tedwuji]

The drug induces changes at the cellular level of the follicle, o.k.. therefor, you would expect the hair to enter telogen and shed about 3 months after initiation of the DHT reduction. That is why people get a shed 3-6 months in. After that, I don't see any reason why you should still be shedding massive amounts of hair. It makes no sense to me. At 6 months hair shedding should be DONE, especially if on minoxidil. If you are losing crazy amounts of hair at 9,10,11 months and observing minimal regrowth and, instead miniaturization, the drug is f*cking you. Get off. That being said, I am starting to lean more towards the theory that if Finasteride makes you lose MORE hair, and rapidly, then DUT will do the same if not worst. If you simply maintain on fin, or have a little lose, I think DUT has a better chance of being more succesful. This is why I think I need off of all of these.

But james, hairloss is caused by DHT.
These drugs inhibit DHT.

How are they causing more loss?
Do you have a theory?

I am not making an argument.
I am asking a question.

[jamesst11]

But james, hairloss is caused by DHT.
These drugs inhibit DHT.

How are they causing more loss?
Do you have a theory?

I am not making an argument.
I am asking a question.

that's a good question and no one seems to have a definite answer. One thing we know very well - it definitely does happen and it happened to me, as confirmed by my dermatologist. He was even pretty surprised, but says it does happen to people. I would imagine excessive hair loss by fin occurs through a feedback mechanism, as is pretty well documented with several medications. The exact OPPOSITE of what the medicine is supposed to do occurs, because the body becomes efficient in counter acting it. In this scenario, I know fin didn't increase DHT because of blood tests. It did increase T, but now enough I believe to have these effects. The only reasonable scenario I can come to is a drastic increase in DHT receptors... which, given all the scalp sensations and inflammation, is probably what is happening. Despite the low DHT in the serum, the scalp DHT is not tested and still might be high and in the presence of abnormally high receptors, is reaking havoc.

[mic28]

Or this could simply be TE James?

[jamesst11]

Good question. The short answer is, who really knows? The extent of research that's been done on finasteride, a drug taken by MILLIONS, is nothing short of disappointing. Could it be TE? Absolutely. Look up some of the things that can cause TE and you will see that several of them cause far less physiological trauma than altering your hormones. Then google "Propecia caused telogen effluvium" and you will get plenty of hits. let me now reinforce the fact that I am not fear mongering here. I still think finasteride is an awesome medication, because it has helped so many people. We are trying to figure out our "rare" and horrible situation.

Like I said. My experience on fin is so strikingly similar to my two experiences with TE that it's impossible to dismiss. Also remember that my derm said it is charactaristic of TE. The question for me is - if you get TE from finasteride upon initial usage, will it continue if you continue to use it?? I have not found an answer to this. For all we know, it may not. and AFTER the TE concludes, fin might start showing drastic benefits. I am just too damn frustrated and depressed to find out. RU and minox it is.

[mic28]

I know what's you mean James. I tried to take up finasteride again a few weeks back and within a few days the 'TE' started to come on very heavy again. I wasn't willing to continue in the hope that it might improve. One thing that leads me to believe it is TE is the fact that the hairs that are diffuse lost don't seem to be regrowing and miniaturised. They just seem to be gone. Surely if this was MPB, it would take a lot longer to notice the diffuse hair and it would go through a number of cycles, rather than just a load of hair falling out in a matter of months.

[jamesst11]

I know what's you mean James. I tried to take up finasteride again a few weeks back and within a few days the 'TE' started to come on very heavy again. I wasn't willing to continue in the hope that it might improve. One thing that leads me to believe it is TE is the fact that the hairs that are diffuse lost don't seem to be regrowing and miniaturised. They just seem to be gone. Surely if this was MPB, it would take a lot longer to notice the diffuse hair and it would go through a number of cycles, rather than just a load of hair falling out in a matter of months.

well, TE doesn't happen that quick - no type of shedding does, this is a misconception. it takes 3-4 months after starting. I am a big believer in reading symptoms. If any treatment I am using causes my scalp to feel inflammed (itchy, tingly, burning, creeping crawling).. then it is indeed just NOT working. Of course you have to rule out any other factors that may be causing this first. I had the same regiment for like 3 years before fin. The ONLY time I felt these feelings was with severe TE, after a hair transplant. I then felt them exactly the same on fin. I am taking a break to see if they go away. Been off of it for 3 days, and yes, the feeling has gone away. hopefully it stays this way.

[BaldingHelpMe]

James, how is dut doing for you? Are you taking both fin and dut? Or have you gone to dut only route now?

[jamesst11]

James, how is dut doing for you? Are you taking both fin and dut? Or have you gone to dut only route now?

I quit all that sh*t cold turkey. I am just on RU and 15% minox now with dermarolling. I give a big F*CK YOU to finasteride, and I am assuming DUT would just do the same if not worst.

[Blushark]

I was on fin for 8 months and shedding did not decrease so I switched to dut .5. I have been on dut for over a year and have seen no improvement, just slight maintain with more thinning at back of head and higher hairline at temples.

[mic28]

James,

How is RU working for you now? Any updates?

[jamesst11]

James,

How is RU working for you now? Any updates?

it's only been about a week and a half, so physiologically, it would be unreasonable to already expect a decrease in shedding... I WILL say that the dandruff I had while on fin is gone. I don't know why fin caused that, but every single other factor, aside from adding finasteride, in my life has been a constant. The oily hair line is definitely reduced. The scalp inflammation (tingling, itchiness, burning, etc...) is also noticeably reduced. While on fin, I LITERALLY lost about 30-35% density all over the scalp in a short period of time, and my hair is almost completely see through... in that regard, I am NOT expecting miracles, but will obviously welcome them. My expectations have become very low after being repeatedly F*CKED for the last two years... If I can STOP the scalp sensations and simply maintain my damn hair I will be happy. I know I need to post some pics. I have taken "baseline" photos (in quotes because baseline for me was after almost 11 months of RAPID hair loss) and will post them this week. How are you doing with RU Mic?

[BiqqieSmalls]

Seti is working for me

[jamesst11]

One other side effect of fin I neglected to mention were crazy sleep erections... I have literally never had these since I was 17-18 years old. I would never wake up with an erection, or have one in the night. While on fin and even now, still a week or so after quitting, I think I have an erection every second of sleeping. Also, I have not been a "quick finisher" when sleeping with women, once again since 18-20 years old, I noticed that I can finish that a lot quicker too...Also, weight gain.. now that I am off, I hope these damn things change. Every single thing I got from that drug is lame as f*cking hell.