Looks like another drug potentially approaches approval, Bim just finished it's data collection and will be(im assuming) releasing it's final results in January according to this trial information:
Now i've heard mixed things with this drug, i've seen people use the weaker solution with fairly decent results, however Allergan may not release it if it's not much better than minoxidil, but personally I would love another option!
So anyone have more info on this stuff or hear anything related to the trial?
11-04-2014 12:55 PM
Gjm127
wth? exclusion criteria doesn't state FIN users? That can change the results drastically...
What are the expectations for BIM? A better Minox? Not as good as FIN I guess...?
11-04-2014 01:11 PM
rdawg
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gjm127
wth? exclusion criteria doesn't state FIN users? That can change the results drastically...
What are the expectations for BIM? A better Minox? Not as good as FIN I guess...?
It's a growth stimulator, it's supposed to be used in conjunction with fin like Minox is!
yes it's expected to be a better minoxidil, but that may not be enough for investors to want a phase III, have to wait for results.
11-04-2014 04:14 PM
FearTheLoss
We can already get BIM, it's just expensive. I'm not very excited about this, unless they somehow tripled their results and success rate by upping the dosage.
I don't see this making it to the market.
Personally, I think the major advancements in the next 5 years will be:
CB
better success rate with furthered knowledge of PRP
Dr. Wesley's pilofocus offering increase size of donor area, higher yield and maybe 20% regeneration.
I think replace will be another Aderans unfortunately. As their responder rate was pathetic at a mere 60%.
11-04-2014 05:08 PM
Bald Russian
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdawg
Looks like another drug potentially approaches approval, Bim just finished it's data collection and will be(im assuming) releasing it's final results in January according to this trial information
*YAWN* Is that Bim really good? I can buy it right now in drug store for a low price.
11-04-2014 10:36 PM
rdawg
Quote:
Originally Posted by FearTheLoss
We can already get BIM, it's just expensive. I'm not very excited about this, unless they somehow tripled their results and success rate by upping the dosage.
I don't see this making it to the market.
Personally, I think the major advancements in the next 5 years will be:
CB
better success rate with furthered knowledge of PRP
Dr. Wesley's pilofocus offering increase size of donor area, higher yield and maybe 20% regeneration.
I think replace will be another Aderans unfortunately. As their responder rate was pathetic at a mere 60%.
That is at a 0.03% dosage though and people even had results with that low of a dose, these trials are testing out 1-10% dosage.
after phase IIa, they said they got decent results but not good enough at the dose they tried so they raised the dose, that's why itll be interesting to see the results
11-04-2014 10:37 PM
rdawg
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bald Russian
*YAWN* Is that Bim really good? I can buy it right now in drug store for a low price.
The version for Eyelashes? that dosage is like 1/10th of the dosage in this trial for hairloss. 0.03% vs. up to 10% in the trial
best case scenario though it's a super minoxidil
11-05-2014 02:43 AM
beetee
This could work great, not at all, or somewhere in the middle. No one of these boards has any idea which it is. However, Allergan is very likely about to not be a company (or at least a standalone company) in the next two months, as it will either be taken over by Valeant or Actavis. Valeant has said they will totally decimate their research budget and use that money to pay for the acquisition and as profit to help pay their other debts. Actavis says they will leave it untouched. If you have any interest in this product, you really need to know that what happens in regards to who owns Allergan will most likely have a major impact on the future of this product going forward.
11-05-2014 05:46 AM
Gjm127
Quote:
Originally Posted by beetee
This could work great, not at all, or somewhere in the middle. No one of these boards has any idea which it is. However, Allergan is very likely about to not be a company (or at least a standalone company) in the next two months, as it will either be taken over by Valeant or Actavis. Valeant has said they will totally decimate their research budget and use that money to pay for the acquisition and as profit to help pay their other debts. Actavis says they will leave it untouched. If you have any interest in this product, you really need to know that what happens in regards to who owns Allergan will most likely have a major impact on the future of this product going forward.
very interesting comments.. From what you said it shouldn't affect these trials as clinical trials aren't really considered as "research" are they...?
11-05-2014 07:05 AM
beetee
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gjm127
very interesting comments.. From what you said it shouldn't affect these trials as clinical trials aren't really considered as "research" are they...?
Sorry, should have said research and development , and yes, this would definitely affect clinical trials and the entire drug development process. Valeant canceled nearly all the ongoing clinical trials at another drug company they took over. One would assume that if they came in and saw an obvious cure staring them in the face they would continue forward with it, but they are already leveraging themselves like crazy to try to make this deal happen and are going to be in desperate need of cash (and hence cost cutting) as soon as the transaction is completed. Search google news for articles on valeant's business model. They are not a real drug company, they are stock gamers that constantly buy new companies and sell off as many parts as they can to give the appearance that they're making money even though they're actually losing money all the time. This will all catch up with them eventually. I just really hope they don't stymie or kill research into bimatoprost for hair and that it goes down with them.
11-05-2014 10:29 AM
kobefan234
i had bought like three of these bottles from india. i never had enough of it though . hopefully a higher concentration will be more efficacious for scalp hair.
This could work great, not at all, or somewhere in the middle. No one of these boards has any idea which it is. However, Allergan is very likely about to not be a company (or at least a standalone company) in the next two months, as it will either be taken over by Valeant or Actavis. Valeant has said they will totally decimate their research budget and use that money to pay for the acquisition and as profit to help pay their other debts. Actavis says they will leave it untouched. If you have any interest in this product, you really need to know that what happens in regards to who owns Allergan will most likely have a major impact on the future of this product going forward.
I'll only be mad if the results end up being really good, or better than minoxidil but they still feel it's not good enough to release, because then it would be like taking an option away from us.
Would love to replace Minoxidil, stuff is near useless, it came out in the damn 80's! I've seen 0.03% BIM being used by some people and getting better results than with rogaine.
11-05-2014 02:42 PM
chrisrules
I'm definitely interested in this compound. Could be a really good complement to RU and help reverse follicle miniaturization. I want to learn more about its side effects and if topical application to the scalp would affect the eyes in anyway.
11-05-2014 02:50 PM
Notcoolanymore
Another option sounds great. How much is it going to cost? I really don't want to play top dollar for minoxidil 2.0
11-05-2014 05:19 PM
deuce
Quote:
Originally Posted by Notcoolanymore
Another option sounds great. How much is it going to cost? I really don't want to play top dollar for minoxidil 2.0
The CEO of Allergan said he will not release it unless it is far superior to minoxidil.
11-05-2014 07:37 PM
FearTheLoss
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdawg
I'll only be mad if the results end up being really good, or better than minoxidil but they still feel it's not good enough to release, because then it would be like taking an option away from us.
Would love to replace Minoxidil, stuff is near useless, it came out in the damn 80's! I've seen 0.03% BIM being used by some people and getting better results than with rogaine.
You can use it now at like 5% for $70 a month.
11-05-2014 11:41 PM
rdawg
Quote:
Originally Posted by FearTheLoss
You can use it now at like 5% for $70 a month.
Has anyone actually done this yet though and get results?I havent heard many people use it yet.
I've seen people track results with 0.03% and use that for about 5-6 months and get solid thickening, so I'd imagine 5% would definitely be a little better.
11-06-2014 05:55 AM
Gjm127
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdawg
Has anyone actually done this yet though and get results?I havent heard many people use it yet.
I've seen people track results with 0.03% and use that for about 5-6 months and get solid thickening, so I'd imagine 5% would definitely be a little better.
to me it looks like it's a harmless growth stimulant... I make the parralel like this:
CB for acne is to CB for hairloss
what
BIM for eyelashes (0.03%) is to BIM for hairloss (5%)
Since the one for eyelashes has no sides, I doubt the 5% could for hairloss if it's spread out across the whole scalp
11-06-2014 12:45 PM
beetee
There's definitely reason to think it could work. When they announced the results of the first trial, they said it had resulted in growth but not enough. Still, some growth is some growth, and carried with it the possibility of greater growth if it could be targeted more efficiently. There were two studies conducted as well with promising results. One I can't find now (will check the files) that was small scale but found that there was regrowth with the possibility of the creation of new hair follicles (so not just thickening existing), and that was in the original formulation. This is in itself not determinative but is certainly interesting. Another study in the FASEB journal (search bimatoprost and the journal name in google scholar) found regrowth in mice (big deal, I know) and extracted human hair follicles. It is interesting. Allergan now seems to be interested in trying to sell to Actavis which would be very good for the future of this product. Hopefully the could win a bidding war with the scumbags Valeant.
11-06-2014 01:17 PM
Pelopeleon
Sounds good. But, there were risks of changes in iris pigmentation, right?
11-06-2014 08:44 PM
rdawg
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelopeleon
Sounds good. But, there were risks of changes in iris pigmentation, right?
I think that was more associated with the eyelash version of the drug as it could easily get into your eyes when youre putting it there!
11-07-2014 06:26 AM
beetee
I personally am not too worried about eye pigmentation. I think a lot of people in the earlier stages of HL want everything to be exactly how it would have been if they 'd never lost any hair. Wait till you get further down the line. If you still care about HL, you'd sacrifice maintaining your current hue of eye pigmentation without a thought . But like rdawg says, shouldn't be too much of an issue anyway.
11-10-2014 01:27 PM
beetee
Anyone with doubts about what kind of company valeant is and what could happen if they succeed in taking over allergan, check the first posting in the "CB probably isn't that great" thread.
11-11-2014 02:04 AM
gladiator
Hey,
I have been in contact with a company in Australia who have radio adds for hair and skin treatment s , I called them on the way home .
The owner speaks to you directly for ages about hairloss and future treatments .
Anyway he makes bimatrapost @ 1.5 Mls .
He said he has a compounding pharmacy who make it into a lotion .
He knows his shit !
You get a perscription and he takes care of the rest !
He said the treatment is getting mega results !
I'd give it a go but it's $1800 for 6 months .
Then after 1 year you are done and can kick back with a pdg2 shampoo and a stimulator !
Sounds easy .
I'm not selling anything but if anyone is interested I can post a link !
11-11-2014 03:19 AM
joel203
Quote:
Originally Posted by gladiator
Hey,
I have been in contact with a company in Australia who have radio adds for hair and skin treatment s , I called them on the way home .
The owner speaks to you directly for ages about hairloss and future treatments .
Anyway he makes bimatrapost @ 1.5 Mls .
He said he has a compounding pharmacy who make it into a lotion .
He knows his shit !
You get a perscription and he takes care of the rest !
He said the treatment is getting mega results !
I'd give it a go but it's $1800 for 6 months .
Then after 1 year you are done and can kick back with a pdg2 shampoo and a stimulator !
Sounds easy .
I'm not selling anything but if anyone is interested I can post a link !
Shut up
11-14-2014 07:49 PM
lilpauly
i think they are goingto have a anoter clincal study using a stronget strength!
This is old news and in it they framed the results in a certain way. What Allergan found is that when they used the original formulation that has the same concentration that is used for eyelash growth that it regrew some hair but not enough for them to go forward with further investigations. So they did what they had always planned on doing: increasing the concentration and changing the formulation to try to get better absorption through the thick skin on the scalp to get the active ingredients to the follicles. This is basically what they planned on doing all along.
That being said, they may still not get sufficient results. But the results of that trial that is being written about is not proof or even good evidence that it won't work. The results of the upcoming trial will be much more informative.
11-17-2014 08:45 AM
beetee
Excellent news! Actavis has taken over allergan and valeant has said they will not try to compete. At the least, this should mean that we'll eventually know what the results of the clinical trials were.
This is pure speculation, but actavis spent a ton of money for allergan, 66 billion. That's 13 billion more than valeant's highest offer. Actsvis had stated that they will not cut any research and development and there's probably not much money to be gained by synergies between the two company's product lines. So they're hoping to make money the good old fashioned way: by introducing new products that will generate big sales. Granted Botox has many under exploited applications, but it's fair to assume that actavis believes allergan has some big moneymakers in the pipeline. Here's hoping it's bimatiprost for hair!
11-17-2014 11:06 AM
Kudu
Great! Thanks for posting
11-17-2014 12:50 PM
rdawg
That's very good news, the results of a higher solution will be very interesting!
first growth stimulant to get close to release since minoxidil!!
11-17-2014 01:50 PM
ChemicalBrother
excellent news indeed - thanks for the research beetee
Care to layout the next steps and timeframe for where we go from here ?
11-17-2014 09:58 PM
It's2014ComeOnAlready
66 billion is a LOT of money, let's hope that figure means they are banking on some impressive results from bimatoprost.
11-17-2014 10:37 PM
It's2014ComeOnAlready
Btw - does anybody know if there's any evidence out there that shows bimatoprost could be more effective with something like dermaroliing?
11-18-2014 07:50 AM
beetee
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChemicalBrother
excellent news indeed - thanks for the research beetee
Care to layout the next steps and timeframe for where we go from here ?
No problem at all, glad to see some people were interested. I was following the process of the takeover attempt a little too closely since it started last march and while there were definitely times when things did not look good, one of the best possible outcomes has occurred and I am very happy about that.
The current clinical trial is set to be completed January 2015, as indicated on their listing on clinicaltrials.gov. Allergan typically releases the results of their clinical trials within several months of their completion, and hopefully that will continue to be the case under their new owners. When allergan announced the results of the last clinical trial for this product in May 2013 they actually described the current ongoing trial as the first of two that they had planned. It's good that they are (or were) committed to fully investigating this drug's potential, and hopefully we'll hear something one way or the other about the current trial results early in the new year. As far as the second trial, i imagine it could be abandoned if the results of the current one are very good or very bad, or it may go ahead regardless.
I believe this is all there is to know at this point . While the future is still uncertain, this is a legitimate possibility and a very well established and professional company, so there's definitely reason to keep following this, if not to feel slightly hopeful.
11-18-2014 08:39 AM
Pelopeleon
So, Do you think we will be able to buy bimatoprost x% from Asia markets in 2015?
