Are we at another 5 year standstill ?

[Arashi]

Has a lot to do with playing with people's emotions with hair loss; show a touching story about a hair loss sufferer and how they got 'results' and people will buy into it... not because they're convinced it works but because they're desperate and WANT to believe.

These con artists need be put in JAIL.

+1

[hellouser]

Agreed on that, topical fin will have the same sides.

And about all that other stuff: Of one thing I am 100% sure. And that's that until there's a cure, we will see more and more snake-oil therapies, like PRP, lasers, Acell, Pilox and what's more. And that's cause people LOVE to make money selling useless crap and there are tons of people who LOVE to buy useless crap for their hair (and skin).

Has a lot to do with playing with people's emotions with hair loss; show a touching story about a hair loss sufferer and how they got 'results' and people will buy into it... not because they're convinced it works but because they're desperate and WANT to believe.

These con artists need be put in JAIL.

[Arashi]

Don't even talk about topical finasteride, that's even hilarious. The pharmacokinetic profile of finasteride isn't suitable for topical application without systematic side effects.

Agreed on that, topical fin will have the same sides.

And about all that other stuff: Of one thing I am 100% sure. And that's that until there's a cure, we will see more and more snake-oil therapies, like PRP, lasers, Acell, Pilox and what's more. And that's cause people LOVE to make money selling useless crap and there are tons of people who LOVE to buy useless crap for their hair (and skin).

[Arashi]

About CB, haven't recently been following it, but just looked it up, on page 16 of this document they indeed state they're into phase II for hairloss ! http://www.cosmopharmaceuticals.com/...ationfinal.pdf ! That's the first good news in a LOOOONG time !

[Arashi]

1. Actually, I've seen a lot of good results on nw5's...donor area isn't exactly too small when you can go out of the safe zone do to the fact it's scarless.

It depends on what you define as a good result. An averge donor can sacrifice 10.000 hairs, natural density is 125 hairs/cm, so you can fill up a 8x10 cm area if you want a natural looking result. That's not even enough for a NW3. Yeah sure they can give a NW5 an illusion of some density but go stand in the sun, have your hair wet or whatever and it will look ridiculously thin.

2.It's not the cream, I'm not talking about the acne version..I'm talking about the alopecia version, it's 6 months into phase II...things will change when this phase is over and we find out the vehicle they are using.

This I must have missed. You're saying they're into a Phase II for hairloss ?

3.not true, you just need to go to the right doctor..granted it doesn't work for everyone, check out Dr. Greco's advances in his prp formula

They were never be able to scientifically prove PRP works. That equals snake-oil in my opinion.

4.more and more well respected doctors are getting lasers in their practice, they may work..but I'm waiting to see more results.

Same as point 3.

5.Hasson and Wong prescribes it to their patients that suffered sides from oral fin, and none of them have reported sides with the topical..email them and ask, as I have.

How big was their trail ? Only a few percent of Fin users get problems anyway.

6.We saw phase 1 (safety trial) results at what, 6 months? you think they'd get a major investor to fast track the treatment if they hadn't improved?
Spencer at one point said Replicel is gonna do it all for us, and I have a feeling he's seen things we haven't. I have faith in David Hall and where the company is headed with this big time investor.

I work as a stock trader myself, I see literally tons of biotech fail, mostly in phase II. If you add up the money people invested in those companies you could probably buy a car for everyone on this earth with it. So willingness to invest doesnt say anything at all unfortunately. Replicel's results were the weakest of all Aderans, Replicel and Histogen. So I'm not getting my hopes up on this one.

7.That's because people weren't doing it right. If you are bleeding, you are damaging the follicle and causing more harm. You can't just half ass it or go at it without using the proper protocol and expect to see results.

I agree that some did it wrong and also agree that you shouldnt get to the bleeding point. But I also saw tons of guys doing it correctly and almost none reported success.

8.Science continues to develop at a rapid pace, if you are going to be so pessimistic, then why do you even come to the forum??? why not come back in 30 years than?

You misread my words. I'm not saying we are 30 years away from a cure. I'm saying we could as easily be 3 weeks away from a breakthrough as 30 years.

9.You're delusional. Dr. Cole is one of the most respected doctors in the game.

Well that's interesting then, that one of the most 'respected doctors' has a guy like '35yearsafter' here represent him. Did you read what he's saying about Acell ?? This guy doesnt make any sense at all. They're even claiming now that they can regenerate a follicle and have it grow hair long enough to pierce the skin in 1 months. That's 100% verifiable BS. Furthermore they refuse to show proof of their nonsene claims. That puts them at par with Nigam and Gho.

[Swooping]

Hello everybody, my little contribution.



Low Level Laser Therapy lacks exactness and accuracy to me. How can a laser hat filled with some diodes direct laser directly into the follicles? I think you should have 1 diode = 1 follicle, and yet you would have to prove the efficacy. That's the same inaccuracy I find when looking at "classic" before/after photos. They are imprecise, no hair/mm2 count values , no hair length, no hair growth speed.
You should take a photo of ONE follicle before the treatment, and then the same one AFTER.
If it is even possible, though.

LLLT is another joke come on. The consensus on why this works is because photons transmit through the skin layer and then are absorbed in the mitochrondia and at the cell membrane. This converts to chemical energy in the cell called adenosine trisphophate. So shortly it just increases the mitochrondial ATP production, which in turn increases cell proliferation.

But come on really lasers? They might be MINOR beneficial at most. Secondly if this would work so good we would be seeing this all over in the medicinal field for wound healing for example. I have yet to see that lol. This abstract points it out nicely; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23924031. The BIAS is indeed highly in this one (marketing, money hmmm .)

[Swooping]

Don't know what to think of BIM. This might be our only hope ...

I'll tell you what to think of BIM. Totally forget about it. Many people have tried this and even hyper-dosed it. Yes it works for eyelashes. I have a feeling that is because PGD2 somewhat regulates FGF5. Check Cotsarelis his original study about this. And I made this assumption (wild guess though, but you get what i'm telling you) because A.M Christiano came up with this study last week; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24989505.

About CB-03-01, nothing special except it "theoretically" doesn't have side effects. We have way stronger anti-androgens currently available and they won't grow your hair back either. Period.

Before we'll be culturing perfect hair follicles in vitro, we'll have perfectly functional working organs like the heart cultured. Just THINK about that.

All advice I can give for young guys is that prevention is the best thing to do. Cb-03-01 will be a good drug for those guys. HOWEVER, regrowing hair is very very hard. Your only hope is to attack this polygenic extremely complicated inheritance by hyper attacking it from different angles if you want regrowth. Yes you might regrow some then, if you take minox, dut, ru, tret, beta, bima, psi, dermarolling, growth factors and lastly castrate yourself and pump some estrogen in you. Question is; Who the hell wants that?

Don't even talk about topical finasteride, that's even hilarious. The pharmacokinetic profile of finasteride isn't suitable for topical application without systematic side effects.

[moore]

Hello everybody, my little contribution.

4.more and more well respected doctors are getting lasers in their practice, they may work..but I'm waiting to see more results.

Low Level Laser Therapy lacks exactness and accuracy to me. How can a laser hat filled with some diodes direct laser directly into the follicles? I think you should have 1 diode = 1 follicle, and yet you would have to prove the efficacy. That's the same inaccuracy I find when looking at "classic" before/after photos. They are imprecise, no hair/mm2 count values , no hair length, no hair growth speed.
You should take a photo of ONE follicle before the treatment, and then the same one AFTER.
If it is even possible, though.

a cure will never be here. the cure you are considering here involves creating follicles and transplanting them while many people dont want a surgery, . a cure will be something that will stop hair loss once it kicks in or something that will make your body regenerate hair. we will have treatments like histogen(great results and compoundable), replicel(average results but could be improved with dosing. people forget that the initial trials were only for efficacy and safety) , bimatoprost, CB, prp need to be refined from TGF beta 1 which is hair follicle killer and is abundant in prp more than the other benefitial growth factor, scientis will be testing injectable fat stem cells, different growth factors injections will help and need expermenting but everybody seems to be scared of using them, and who knows maybe follica will discover how to turn the villus hair they produced into terminal hairs.

I hope you are wrong.
Maybe the cure will be discovered by accident, but it will definitely be found.

Maybe you would like to check this out:

http://twitter.com/AndroAlopecia

[Haircure]

youre probably thinking of phase IIa, they raised the dose in IIb and those trials are in progress so i dont know how he would know, who is shapiro and how would he know anything about BIM?

Yes I know they raised the dose, which is what I explained in my previous post. As for Dr. Shapiro, he's a pretty prominent hair dermatologist and basically a few months back, I had asked him about potential treatments and I brought up Bim. He didn't tell me much details, but said that even after upping the dosage, the results weren't any good. He seemed to know a lot about all the other companies, which makes sense given his credentials.

http://www.doctorjerryshapiro.com

[rdawg]

With regards to Bimatoprost, I spoke with a Dr. jerry Shapiro about it and from what he told me, the results aren't so great. From what I recall he spoke of the trials using 10X the concentration of Bimatoprost compared to what is found in the current product Latisse. He told me that the results were not better than the current hair loss treatments of fin and minox. So hate to bring more bad news, but it looks like Bim isn't going to be much help.

youre probably thinking of phase IIa, they raised the dose in IIb and those trials are in progress so i dont know how he would know, who is shapiro and how would he know anything about BIM?

[Haircure]

With regards to Bimatoprost, I spoke with a Dr. jerry Shapiro about it and from what he told me, the results aren't so great. From what I recall he spoke of the trials using 10X the concentration of Bimatoprost compared to what is found in the current product Latisse. He told me that the results were not better than the current hair loss treatments of fin and minox. So hate to bring more bad news, but it looks like Bim isn't going to be much help.

[rdawg]

my timeline(and obviously new things will come every year as they always do):

end of 2014-2015: - more research completed on hairloss, further progress made/released
- BIM results released, if good pushed immediately in Phase III and this board goes nuts over a new product that can cause growth is coming! If bad gets dropped(and this is possible)
- CB nears completion of Phase II for hair, gets approved for acne.
-Replicel Phase II results shown.

2016-2017: BIM and CB both released or very near release
- a bigger project from Follica gets further into production
- stem-cell related hair research pushes forward.
-replicel finishes Phase II moves onto phase III if positive.

2018 beyond: who know!!

Personally i'm just living life, going traveling for a little over a month through europe getting away for a bit! Hairloss is definitely an issue for me and I tend to use concealers as i'm in sales so aesthetics do help.

On the other hand I'm slowly coming to terms with it, I think this is because im getting a little older, i'm 22 now and quite a few of my friends are showing the early signs so im not the only guy anymore!

[cthulhu2]

My predicted time scale:

S-Equol(out already)>>>>>>>?cb-03-01>>>>>>>>>>bimatoprost>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>replicel>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>follica

If you look at the before and after pics for PRP, they aren't super impressive. The same goes for low level laser therapy. I am surprised more people haven't tried Equol yet, considering that a major company is producing it at a slightly pricy but reasonable cost. I still believe a vehicle will be found relatively quickly for cb once it hits markets for acne, however we still have 3+ years of phase III and pre launch manufacturing issues to deal with.

[hgs1989]

a cure will never be here. the cure you are considering here involves creating follicles and transplanting them while many people dont want a surgery, . a cure will be something that will stop hair loss once it kicks in or something that will make your body regenerate hair. we will have treatments like histogen(great results and compoundable), replicel(average results but could be improved with dosing. people forget that the initial trials were only for efficacy and safety) , bimatoprost, CB, prp need to be refined from TGF beta 1 which is hair follicle killer and is abundant in prp more than the other benefitial growth factor, scientis will be testing injectable fat stem cells, different growth factors injections will help and need expermenting but everybody seems to be scared of using them, and who knows maybe follica will discover how to turn the villus hair they produced into terminal hairs.

[FearTheLoss]

I hate to be pessimistic but man ...


Graft surival isnt really an issue anymore, you can get FUE's with 97% survival nowadays. Fact remains that a donor area is way to small to give you good density back if you're beyond NW3.


What good is a cream ? You can't put it into your hair. You can already buy CB right now but the problem is people dont know how to create a vehicle for it. What difference would a cream make ? Or am I overlooking something ?


Nah, PRP = snakeoil.

laser = snakoil

I doubt that a topical will get you less sides, Fin will still go into the blood and thus systematic.

Replicel never showed any good results.

Nah, lots of people tried it, only very very few reported success.

Simply untrue. We could easily be 30 years away from a full blown cure. Look at it this way: 10 years ago the 'only last problem' was we couldnt culture Dp cells. What's changed in those 10 years ?

Dr Cole is on par with Nigam and Gho.


Don't know what to think of BIM. This might be our only hope ...

1. Actually, I've seen a lot of good results on nw5's...donor area isn't exactly too small when you can go out of the safe zone do to the fact it's scarless.

2.It's not the cream, I'm not talking about the acne version..I'm talking about the alopecia version, it's 6 months into phase II...things will change when this phase is over and we find out the vehicle they are using.

3.not true, you just need to go to the right doctor..granted it doesn't work for everyone, check out Dr. Greco's advances in his prp formula

4.more and more well respected doctors are getting lasers in their practice, they may work..but I'm waiting to see more results.

5.Hasson and Wong prescribes it to their patients that suffered sides from oral fin, and none of them have reported sides with the topical..email them and ask, as I have.

6.We saw phase 1 (safety trial) results at what, 6 months? you think they'd get a major investor to fast track the treatment if they hadn't improved? Spencer at one point said Replicel is gonna do it all for us, and I have a feeling he's seen things we haven't. I have faith in David Hall and where the company is headed with this big time investor.

7.That's because people weren't doing it right. If you are bleeding, you are damaging the follicle and causing more harm. You can't just half ass it or go at it without using the proper protocol and expect to see results.

8.Science continues to develop at a rapid pace, if you are going to be so pessimistic, then why do you even come to the forum??? why not come back in 30 years than?

9.You're delusional. Dr. Cole is one of the most respected doctors in the game.


It's really alarming to see how your posts have gone from so productive and positive to losing control over the last 8 months. You should take some time away from this website and come back every so often to check on new developments, don't waste your life away at the screen. New treatments are coming, but not tomorrow.