PDA

View Full Version : 18 y/o - RU58841 or Finasteride?



theyoungster
05-15-2016, 02:56 PM
Hi,
I turn 19 later this year and have been using minoxidil for 1 year now. I really need an antiandrogen though, as I want to maintain the amount of hair that I have right now. In general I have been an "early bloomer", with a little bit of chest hair right now and a full beard.

I was wondering on your opinions of whether I should use finasteride or RU58841? The way I see it:

Fin:
Pros
- FDA approved
- Just a pill
- Studies show that it can maintain for a LONG time

Cons
- Side effects! Especially considering my young age?

RU:
Pros
- Considered "safe", with few(er) sides, especially since it's topical

Cons:
- Slightly more time consuming to apply
- No studies, neither on safety or long term maintenance

Any help is appreciated!

lucrio
05-25-2016, 12:50 AM
I'm 24 now and was in your shoes at 19 years old as well. I tried fin for around a year when I was 19 -20 and tried RU for over a year from 22-24. I will say that both of these two gave me side effects. In all honesty I wouldn't reccomend you using either and trying your best to accept hair loss. Obviously that is way easier said than done and I know how important physical appearance is at this point in life. So, that being said, my next best advice would be to try fin first.

I know it's got all these horror stories of sides that don't go away but I think as a male at your age the chances of doing permanent damage are almost nothing. I did get sides and eventually decided it was too much but after quitting they eventually went away. Fin definitely decreased my sex drive, I was rarely getting erections, and I think I was mildly depressed. I tried lowering the dosage but even very small doses affected me. If you do try with fin, I definitely reccomend staring at a lower (1/4 or so) dose for a while (3-4 months) before you decide to increase dosage. Side effects can really take a while before they become evident. Also, expect some degree of shedding.

As far as RU, i do not recommend it. It was actually very effective for me, my shedding stopped almost completely and I even regrew a little around the hairline. The reason I don't recommend it though is because it gave me side effects that took many many months to go away. I used it for almost 6 months before I realized I hadn't had an erection in atleast a few weeks and wasn't really thinking much about sex. They kinda just slowly continued to get worse and worse until my libido was almost gone and I wasn't getting erections at all. Again, I tried tapering down in dosage but eventually felt it necessary to quit. The biggest reason I would say No to RU is mostly because I now know it does indeed cause side effects hence it does enter the blood(to what degree per person I can't say) and it is not FDA approved so it is unsure what long term effects are of it entering your system. I think RU is a much more potent anti androgen than what is claimed.

In summary, it is in everyone of our best interests to accept this hair loss thing until a real cure exists. However, as I myself have not yet reached that point, your best bet would be trying to go low dose fin for a while, a few months at least, and see if there are any sides. Also; when you go on and off fin, it can really screw with your shedding cycle, so going low dose helps minimize withdraw shedding if you decide not to continue. Also, very important, use Ketokonazole shampoo

Alex23
06-07-2016, 03:36 PM
I'm 24 now and was in your shoes at 19 years old as well. I tried fin for around a year when I was 19 -20 and tried RU for over a year from 22-24. I will say that both of these two gave me side effects. In all honesty I wouldn't reccomend you using either and trying your best to accept hair loss. Obviously that is way easier said than done and I know how important physical appearance is at this point in life. So, that being said, my next best advice would be to try fin first.

I know it's got all these horror stories of sides that don't go away but I think as a male at your age the chances of doing permanent damage are almost nothing. I did get sides and eventually decided it was too much but after quitting they eventually went away. Fin definitely decreased my sex drive, I was rarely getting erections, and I think I was mildly depressed. I tried lowering the dosage but even very small doses affected me. If you do try with fin, I definitely reccomend staring at a lower (1/4 or so) dose for a while (3-4 months) before you decide to increase dosage. Side effects can really take a while before they become evident. Also, expect some degree of shedding.

As far as RU, i do not recommend it. It was actually very effective for me, my shedding stopped almost completely and I even regrew a little around the hairline. The reason I don't recommend it though is because it gave me side effects that took many many months to go away. I used it for almost 6 months before I realized I hadn't had an erection in atleast a few weeks and wasn't really thinking much about sex. They kinda just slowly continued to get worse and worse until my libido was almost gone and I wasn't getting erections at all. Again, I tried tapering down in dosage but eventually felt it necessary to quit. The biggest reason I would say No to RU is mostly because I now know it does indeed cause side effects hence it does enter the blood(to what degree per person I can't say) and it is not FDA approved so it is unsure what long term effects are of it entering your system. I think RU is a much more potent anti androgen than what is claimed.

In summary, it is in everyone of our best interests to accept this hair loss thing until a real cure exists. However, as I myself have not yet reached that point, your best bet would be trying to go low dose fin for a while, a few months at least, and see if there are any sides. Also; when you go on and off fin, it can really screw with your shedding cycle, so going low dose helps minimize withdraw shedding if you decide not to continue. Also, very important, use Ketokonazole shampoo

Lol **** you. If he accepts hairs loss his teenage years and life are basically OVER. Take ****ing dut + ru58841 + nizoral and minoxidil or you will ****ing regret it i guarantee you that 10000%

pajason
06-08-2016, 11:32 AM
Lol **** you. If he accepts hairs loss his teenage years and life are basically OVER. Take ****ing dut + ru58841 + nizoral and minoxidil or you will ****ing regret it i guarantee you that 10000%

Unless taking DUT and RU effectively chemically castrates him. then he will have a full head of hair and a limp dick. At that point he would rather be bald and get it up. No one knows what RU will do to you long term. At least propecia has long term user's. Its also been effective for most men. DUT at least has some studies and was approved for something by the FDA. RU has no real evidence except a few people online. For all we know RU could cause testicular cancer in %80 of men using it for 5 years.

Alex23
06-08-2016, 11:40 AM
Unless taking DUT and RU effectively chemically castrates him. then he will have a full head of hair and a limp dick. At that point he would rather be bald and get it up. No one knows what RU will do to you long term. At least propecia has long term user's. Its also been effective for most men. DUT at least has some studies and was approved for something by the FDA. RU has no real evidence except a few people online. For all we know RU could cause testicular cancer in %80 of men using it for 5 years.

Yeah no... I'm on ru + dut and have 0 side effects I'm 198lbs 6%bodyfat bodybuilder and i fck 2 a day every day

pajason
06-09-2016, 10:25 AM
Yeah no... I'm on ru + dut and have 0 side effects I'm 198lbs 6%bodyfat bodybuilder and i fck 2 a day every day

Point I am making is you don't know if RU will make your dick fall off in 3 years. There literally is no real long term research. If you are taking it you are being a guinea pig. Most evidence says it does go systemic. And the original maker of the drug stopped pursuing it for some reason. DUT is a bit different as there are relevant studies saying what it does and it has at least been on the market for what 10 years?

Alex23
06-09-2016, 01:39 PM
Point I am making is you don't know if RU will make your dick fall off in 3 years. There literally is no real long term research. If you are taking it you are being a guinea pig. Most evidence says it does go systemic. And the original maker of the drug stopped pursuing it for some reason. DUT is a bit different as there are relevant studies saying what it does and it has at least been on the market for what 10 years?

Would rather be a gunea pig then bald bruh. And it can't take my d*k if i have 0 sides now i won't in 5 years. That's how hormones work. If it supposed to block my androgens systematically it would have done it buy now.

dm90
06-25-2016, 11:46 AM
Finasteride hands down. RU is a research chemical that has shown to potentially be effective androgen related conditions. It's true that we are unsure of long term effects of RU, but also whos to say its all that effective? The studies indicate it may not compete with DHT enough for long term results. Finasteride is proven to be extremely effective at providing long term hairloss cessation. Dutasteride is the closest thing we have to a cure, but without a natural model for type 1 deficiency you are taking it with some risks. Personally I take dutasteride, ru, and minoxidil because i'm obsessive and my hair is very important to me. Alex23 language may be brash but he proposes a good point that many of us share. Perhaps you can come to term with it for 2 years, but what if in 3 years you regret not taking action? Placing your bets on a future "cure" is to much of a gamble. Despite alot of frustration with the current state of treatments, these medications are very powerful and you don't have to go bald.

Alex23
06-25-2016, 11:54 AM
Finasteride hands down. RU is a research chemical that has shown to potentially be effective androgen related conditions. It's true that we are unsure of long term effects of RU, but also whos to say its all that effective? The studies indicate it may not compete with DHT enough for long term results. Finasteride is proven to be extremely effective at providing long term hairloss cessation. Dutasteride is the closest thing we have to a cure, but without a natural model for type 1 deficiency you are taking it with some risks. Personally I take dutasteride, ru, and minoxidil because i'm obsessive and my hair is very important to me. Alex23 language may be brash but he proposes a good point that many of us share. Perhaps you can come to term with it for 2 years, but what if in 3 years you regret not taking action? Placing your bets on a future "cure" is to much of a gamble. Despite alot of frustration with the current state of treatments, these medications are very powerful and you don't have to go bald.

Brah how long are you on dut and ru any regrowth? I can't take mimox cause of severe side effects i uncounted. I'm a fitness model and it basically destroyed my face it took me a year to get back to normal. I'm 2 months on dut and 1 month of ru i basically stopped all hair loss and I'm on testosterone 500mg. Always I'm going to finish my cycle in a month and stay natty for a while i have minor diffuse thinning when hair is wet. Did you regrow your hair bro? All my hair loss is 8 months -1 year "old"

dm90
06-25-2016, 02:40 PM
Ive been on dutasteride for probably closing in on 4 months and ru on and off for 2 months, ive done it everyday consistently for 4 weeks. I have a usb microscope and i monitor spots, and i've already noticed dormant hairs emerging from units where they werent there before. I should mention i was on finasteride since 18, i'm closing in on 27 now and it slowed down like 80% of it, but I only got around 60% reduction from it. Dutasteride has broght my dht levels much lower. RIght now i have 5ng/dl dht which about that of a 10 year old boy. i think on fin i was like 25-30. Sorry to ramble, to answer your question, the anti androgens alone started reversing my hairloss without the minoxidil. THis was hair that miniaturized years ago. I would agree to hold off an anymore cycles for the time being and give your hair time to "repair itself". The key is just being consistent, RU+DUT makes it impossible to continue to lose hair, but follicles that have been miniaturized need a few cycles in an androgen deprived environment if theyre going to repair themselves. If youre hairloss is that early theres a good chance youll get back most of it. Worst case scenario, you keep that hair forever.

burtandernie
06-27-2016, 05:38 PM
You would have to be silly to even think about RU over fin. Fin has piles of evidence and basically was the biggest breakthrough in hair loss in all of history. It single handedly made MPB a treatable condition for the first time and has been in real world use for 25 or 30 years proving its safe. RU is an experimental chemical with almost nothing but purely anecdotal reports from questionable sources. There is no comparison if you decide to choose one. It is risky though there is no easy answer for MPB so everyone has to decide if its worth the risks.
Kind of a shame stuff like CB sits in a lab somewhere probably nearly side free and equivalent of fin but not released for another 5 years.

Alex23
06-28-2016, 01:45 AM
You would have to be silly to even think about RU over fin. Fin has piles of evidence and basically was the biggest breakthrough in hair loss in all of history. It single handedly made MPB a treatable condition for the first time and has been in real world use for 25 or 30 years proving its safe. RU is an experimental chemical with almost nothing but purely anecdotal reports from questionable sources. There is no comparison if you decide to choose one. It is risky though there is no easy answer for MPB so everyone has to decide if its worth the risks.
Kind of a shame stuff like CB sits in a lab somewhere probably nearly side free and equivalent of fin but not released for another 5 years.

That's why you buy dutasteride, ru58841, minoxidil 15% and hold tight until something better comes out. Anways all of the above will 99% give you 10-15 years plus regrowth

Alex23
06-28-2016, 01:49 AM
Ive been on dutasteride for probably closing in on 4 months and ru on and off for 2 months, ive done it everyday consistently for 4 weeks. I have a usb microscope and i monitor spots, and i've already noticed dormant hairs emerging from units where they werent there before. I should mention i was on finasteride since 18, i'm closing in on 27 now and it slowed down like 80% of it, but I only got around 60% reduction from it. Dutasteride has broght my dht levels much lower. RIght now i have 5ng/dl dht which about that of a 10 year old boy. i think on fin i was like 25-30. Sorry to ramble, to answer your question, the anti androgens alone started reversing my hairloss without the minoxidil. THis was hair that miniaturized years ago. I would agree to hold off an anymore cycles for the time being and give your hair time to "repair itself". The key is just being consistent, RU+DUT makes it impossible to continue to lose hair, but follicles that have been miniaturized need a few cycles in an androgen deprived environment if theyre going to repair themselves. If youre hairloss is that early theres a good chance youll get back most of it. Worst case scenario, you keep that hair forever.

Thought so too. Cool brah going all out was yhe best decision ever. Brb beating hair loss cold. My mpb genetics aren't even strong my loss is roid induced from very very heavy androgen use.

UK_
07-27-2016, 04:30 PM
Thought so too. Cool brah going all out was yhe best decision ever. Brb beating hair loss cold. My mpb genetics aren't even strong my loss is roid induced from very very heavy androgen use.

You're telling a 19 year old kid to take an untested non-FDA approved experimental drug for hair loss?

You should be lined up against a wall and shot.

Liver cancer takes around 10 - 15 years to develop, harping on and laughing to us about how you are not having any side effects from the garbage you've ingested from God knows what country or what laboratory is simply hilarious. Tell you what Kimbo, come back in a decade and let us know how you're getting on ;-)

UK_
07-27-2016, 04:38 PM
RU is considered safe by who? It was dropped by the company that was testing it for an unknown reason, people on forums have put that down to some rubbish about the company not being able to market the product - IMO, it's probably got more to do with the fact that endocrine distruptors have been shown to cause cancer years and years down the line in humans, there are only a few anti-androgens that have not shown this propensity - finasteride is one although that also has been linked to a 'small' elevated risk of high grade prostate cancer.

What you essentially want to do, is distrupt your endocrine system to halt hair loss.... before you do that, please read the following:

Environmental endocrine disrupting chemicals (EDCs), including pesticides and industrial chemicals, have been and are released into the environment producing deleterious effects on wildlife and humans. The effects observed in animal models after exposure during organogenesis correlate positively with an increased incidence of malformations of the male genital tract and of neoplasms and with the decreased sperm quality observed in European and US populations. Exposure to EDCs generates additional effects, such as alterations in male and female reproduction and changes in neuroendocrinology, behavior, metabolism and obesity, prostate cancer and thyroid and cardiovascular endocrinology. This Review highlights the carcinogenic properties of EDCs, with a special focus on bisphenol A. However, humans and wildlife are exposed to a mixture of EDCs that act contextually. To explain this mindboggling complexity will require the design of novel experimental approaches that integrate the effects of different doses of structurally different chemicals that act at different ages on different target tissues. The key to this complex problem lies in the adoption of mathematical modeling and computer simulations afforded by system biology approaches. Regardless, the data already amassed highlight the need for a public policy to reduce exposure to EDCs.

http://www.nature.com/nrendo/journal/v6/n7/abs/nrendo.2010.87.html

Note the term 'mind boggling complexity'... you are truly playing with fire messing with these untested chemicals.

It's no good listening to some bone-head on a forum saying he is taking it and feels fine.... he might not feel so fine 5 - 10 years down the line when he's got lumps appearing above his collar bone and is experiencing night sweats and rapid weight loss.

dm90
07-27-2016, 07:23 PM
You realize he's also 19?

nhlpro11
03-19-2017, 02:04 PM
Hey Alex. I tried minoxidil too and it really messed my face up. You say you've been able to recover after a year? Did you do anything special or did you just let time run its course? Please let me know. I am desperate to fix this situation.

nhlpro11
03-20-2017, 10:17 AM
hey @Alex23 I really need your advice on fixing my face after minoxidil use. How did you do it? Anything helps. thanks

nhlpro11
03-20-2017, 10:18 AM
Thought so too. Cool brah going all out was yhe best decision ever. Brb beating hair loss cold. My mpb genetics aren't even strong my loss is roid induced from very very heavy androgen use.

Really need to know how you beat minoxidil face wasting effects after a year. Did you do anything special.