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View Full Version : Anyone planning on taking the *new* Hasson and Wong liposomal topical fin?



mowingdown
04-07-2016, 11:21 PM
If you do we would be forever grateful for your part in getting bloodwork done BEFORE you start the cream. I would love to get it but alas, I am in the US. If you do plan on using this please please please get your serum DHT checked prior to use so we can see if their claims are substantiated or just another farce!

Also a log would be great!

RU58841
04-08-2016, 08:04 AM
Almost certainly going to be trying this in 2-3 months. I got a call from them the other day saying I'll probably still have to visit Vancouver for the prescription but I'm willing to do that if it's the only way.

Specifically, what should I be asking for with the blood test? Just serum DHT levels? I'll be coming off oral finasteride, so should I try to be off that for a few weeks, get the blood test, then start the topical?

TooMuchHairWontKillYou
04-08-2016, 11:13 AM
Hey,

I'm interested in topical fin. Is it already available? Where can I buy it? Price?

mowingdown
04-08-2016, 11:23 AM
Almost certainly going to be trying this in 2-3 months. I got a call from them the other day saying I'll probably still have to visit Vancouver for the prescription but I'm willing to do that if it's the only way.

Specifically, what should I be asking for with the blood test? Just serum DHT levels? I'll be coming off oral finasteride, so should I try to be off that for a few weeks, get the blood test, then start the topical?

DHT is the big one of course, as that should tell us if H&W are telling the truth. Also if cost is an issue (which it sounds like it is not.), serum DHT would be the only one we really need to look at.

Otherwise testing Testosterone, FREE Testosterone, Estrogen, PSA, Prolactin, FSH, are all major ones if you are someone prone to side effects.

mowingdown
04-08-2016, 11:24 AM
Check out Hasson & Wong's website with their new liposomal topical fin.

TooMuchHairWontKillYou
04-08-2016, 11:39 AM
Check out Hasson & Wong's website with their new liposomal topical fin.

Thanks

I found this link
https://hassonandwong.com/topical-finasteride-solution-prescription/

But there is nothing about price and where to buy. Am I missing something? :D


aand... I know that there are some other topical fins (polichem?) Do you have any info on that? Which one is better?

mowingdown
04-08-2016, 11:58 AM
Are you in the US? If so, you may have to wait. Or convince a European on these boards to buy and ship to you!

cardib
04-08-2016, 12:18 PM
I'm already on topical fin from murray avenue apothecary. frankly i think they are all bullshit

NeedHairASAP
04-08-2016, 12:40 PM
Fin can't work without going systematic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antiandrogen

you can alter the pathway by (1) stopping production of androgens or (2) blocking the receptors that receive androgens

aka

you can either (1) tackle the quarterback, or (2) you can try to intercept the ball from a wide receiver.

fin is for tackling the quarterback....it's for stopping the ball before it's been thrown (aka stopping the production of DHT before it goes into the blood stream). Which means intercepting the ball after it's been thrown is blocking the receptor from receiving androgens (or stopping the circulating DHT from acting on the receptors in your scalp).

You can't tackle the quarterback after he's thrown the ball. In other words, fin doesn't really do anything after the ball has been thrown (or the DHT has been produced and let into the bloodstream). Thus applying it locally is like thinking you can sack the QB after he threw the ball.

The only topicals that will work are ones that shut down the AR receptor. This is ideal because you can sill have high DHT (and not be a womanly man tit boy) and still stop the baldness.

if this topical fin is working (aka lowering circulating DHT), it's because it's gone systemic.

stratowich
04-08-2016, 01:41 PM
Fin can't work without going systematic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antiandrogen

you can alter the pathway by (1) stopping production of androgens or (2) blocking the receptors that receive androgens

aka

you can either (1) tackle the quarterback, or (2) you can try to intercept the ball from a wide receiver.

fin is for tackling the quarterback....

It’s exactly these kinds of comments from uneducated morons like you who really make me don’t want to come back to these forums anymore. You are a disgrace to society man!

Just copy-pasting a wikipedia link without even then taking the time to further elucidate the point you are trying to make.

As you are obviously so educated on all of this, please explain to us the whole metabolic pathway of finasteride… The way liposomes pass the stratum corneum and locally release finasteride in the endoplasmic reticulum…

There is a very big chance this stuff Hasson & Wong is offering is not working, but there is all a decent chance this thing is a game changer for people who are prone or are afraid of systemic side-effects.

Using some fuc**** football analogy to prove your point - what a disgrace!!! Go read these papers and all references and all publications citing these and then come back and talk to all of us again:



... However, I still don't think this is all bulls**t they are planing on releasing. Dermal localized and prolonged drug-delivery systems have been around for a while now and are still subject of fundamental research. A brief glimpse into this field revealed the following:

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1468-3083.2009.03100.x/full:
"... They also have the potential to target drugs into the pilosebaceous structures and hence they have an additional advantage for treatment of hair follicle-associated disorders. ... The similarity of lipid composition of liposomes and membranes in the epidermis enables the liposomes to penetrate into the epidermal barrier to a higher extent as compared with other application forms and so do the compounds encapsulated into the liposomes. This may result in an increased drug absorption into the epidermis and a decreased clearance of drug from the epidermis resulting in a much longer sustained drug release and reduction of drug absorption into the blood. This is why liposomes may act as drug transporters as well asdrug targeters.3 This may lead to increased effectiveness,reduction in side-effects and a higher compliance of patientsto treatment.3 Liposomes have also the potential to targetdrugs into the pilosebaceous structures and hence they canbe employed for treatment of hair follicle- and sebaceousgland-associated disorders.22–24"

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0169409X07000403:
"Due to the lower risk of systemic side effects topical treatment of skin disease appears favourable, yet the stratum corneum counteracts the penetration of xenobiotics into viable skin. Particulate carrier systems may mean an option to improve dermal penetration. Since epidermal lipids are found in high amounts within the penetration barrier, lipid carriers attaching themselves to the skin surface and allowing lipid exchange between the outermost layers of the stratum corneum and the carrier appear promising."

Further reading:
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0169409X95000194
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19075893
http://www.jdsjournal.com/article/S0923-1811(96)00508-7/abstract
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0169409X0200114X
http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs00105-003-0513-6

nobs
04-08-2016, 03:10 PM
Fin can't work without going systematic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antiandrogen

you can alter the pathway by (1) stopping production of androgens or (2) blocking the receptors that receive androgens

aka

you can either (1) tackle the quarterback, or (2) you can try to intercept the ball from a wide receiver.

fin is for tackling the quarterback....it's for stopping the ball before it's been thrown (aka stopping the production of DHT before it goes into the blood stream). Which means intercepting the ball after it's been thrown is blocking the receptor from receiving androgens (or stopping the circulating DHT from acting on the receptors in your scalp).

You can't tackle the quarterback after he's thrown the ball. In other words, fin doesn't really do anything after the ball has been thrown (or the DHT has been produced and let into the bloodstream). Thus applying it locally is like thinking you can sack the QB after he threw the ball.

The only topicals that will work are ones that shut down the AR receptor. This is ideal because you can sill have high DHT (and not be a womanly man tit boy) and still stop the baldness.

if this topical fin is working (aka lowering circulating DHT), it's because it's gone systemic.

I'll try to be less harsh than stratowich. The argument you made would mean that topical minoxidil works by entering the bloodstream, which is not the case and why topical minoxidil can be found pretty much anywhere. To add to that, all the study participants on topical minoxidil had almost undetectable levels of the drug in their bloodstream. Finasteride is a very different drug than minoxidil from a chemical standpoint(lipophilic) and is easily absorbed through the bloodstream when applied with an ethanol carrier. I for one would be more than happy to do a before and after blood test while on Hasson and Wong's product. I live in the U.S. so I have to play the waiting game like the others unless a Canadian on here is willing to do it.

PatientlyWaiting
04-08-2016, 04:05 PM
Will this be readily available in the US or reliable online pharmacies or it something I have to join some secret forum for and take chemistry 101 and buy a triple beam balance to make it myself? Is it a full finished product you just buy and use?

nobs
04-08-2016, 04:56 PM
Will this be readily available in the US or reliable online pharmacies or it something I have to join some secret forum for and take chemistry 101 and buy a triple beam balance to make it myself? Is it a full finished product you just buy and use?

Finished product, already available in Canada but soon to be in United States within the next month or so. https://hassonandwong.com/topical-finasteride-solution-prescription/

mowingdown
04-09-2016, 02:58 PM
It’s exactly these kinds of comments from uneducated morons like you who really make me don’t want to come back to these forums anymore. You are a disgrace to society man!

Just copy-pasting a wikipedia link without even then taking the time to further elucidate the point you are trying to make.

As you are obviously so educated on all of this, please explain to us the whole metabolic pathway of finasteride… The way liposomes pass the stratum corneum and locally release finasteride in the endoplasmic reticulum…

There is a very big chance this stuff Hasson & Wong is offering is not working, but there is all a decent chance this thing is a game changer for people who are prone or are afraid of systemic side-effects.

Using some fuc**** football analogy to prove your point - what a disgrace!!! Go read these papers and all references and all publications citing these and then come back and talk to all of us again:

Love the background you provided and sources Strat. You've really brought a lot of knowledge on this specific topic and it's helped me a great deal in understanding it.

I know it's a really frustrating topic and it's hard to constantly see misinformed people (even misinformed people who may possibly be correct), but try your best not to get too heated! We are all on the boards for the same reason and thus, in this together :)

mowingdown
04-09-2016, 02:59 PM
I'm already on topical fin from murray avenue apothecary. frankly i think they are all bullshit


Is this the liposomal mixture? or just fin in topical form?

nobs
04-09-2016, 03:02 PM
Is this the liposomal mixture? or just fin in topical form?

liposome.

BaldingEagle
04-09-2016, 03:47 PM
Here's the thing. Fin doesn't block DHT. It blocks 5ar2.

Fin is trapped in the scalp it's the lipo formula right? So let's say it blocks 5ar2 locally in the scalp, okay good, but... What's going to stop all 5ar2 in your prostate from making DHT and the actual DHT which fin does nothing against circulates up to your follicles?

I want to believe it works but I can't get passed my point above.

NeedHairASAP
04-09-2016, 05:49 PM
Here's the thing. Fin doesn't block DHT. It blocks 5ar2.

Fin is trapped in the scalp it's the lipo formula right? So let's say it blocks 5ar2 locally in the scalp, okay good, but... What's going to stop all 5ar2 in your prostate from making DHT and the actual DHT which fin does nothing against circulates up to your follicles?

I want to believe it works but I can't get passed my point above.

this.

I'm not sure why everyone is calling me an idiot while they are the ones comparing fin to minox like it's apples to apples

nobs
04-09-2016, 09:22 PM
Here's the thing. Fin doesn't block DHT. It blocks 5ar2.

Fin is trapped in the scalp it's the lipo formula right? So let's say it blocks 5ar2 locally in the scalp, okay good, but... What's going to stop all 5ar2 in your prostate from making DHT and the actual DHT which fin does nothing against circulates up to your follicles?

I want to believe it works but I can't get passed my point above.

Valid point, I was a little stumped by this at first since I forgot finasteride was an AR type 2 inhibitor and not a dht inhibitor. However, balding scalps have higher expression of 5 alpha reductase type II and when people take oral finasteride, their scalp dht levels only go down by roughly 40-50% from one of the studies I have seen on propecia, meaning their isn't a complete equilibrium between the scalp and blood levels of dht. Maybe dht produced in the prostate doesn't have the same deleterious effects on the hair follicle idk.

burtandernie
04-14-2016, 05:43 PM
Yeah but merck originally formulated propecia as a topical, but went with oral from surveys from men saying oral was more convenient so it must work that way as well. It is a bit odd though inhibiting the enzyme topically would work like doing it orally

barfacan
04-14-2016, 09:10 PM
Dosing question here :

According to their prescription, it's a 2.5% solution (https://hassonandwong.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/topical-finasteride-form.jpg)

1 ML daily dose = 25mg Finasteride. They claim only 1/18th goes systemic. 25/18 = ~1.39 mg finasteride systemically absorbed.(Is that what they mean by serum levels are 1/18th? that's just a little confusing to me) That's more than the standard Fin oral dose, is it not?

Am i missing something?

barfacan
04-14-2016, 09:15 PM
Valid point, I was a little stumped by this at first since I forgot finasteride was an AR type 2 inhibitor and not a dht inhibitor. However, balding scalps have higher expression of 5 alpha reductase type II and when people take oral finasteride, their scalp dht levels only go down by roughly 40-50% from one of the studies I have seen on propecia, meaning their isn't a complete equilibrium between the scalp and blood levels of dht. Maybe dht produced in the prostate doesn't have the same deleterious effects on the hair follicle idk.

Yeah but we dont know the relative amounts of 5ar2 activity in scalp vs in other areas of the body (or do we?), if there is a very high concentration of 5ar2 in scalp then this product has the possibility of working well. But if the concentration is highest elsewhere in the body, then a non systemic topical is next to useless is it not? But i think we already had this discussion in another thread

timmay9000
04-14-2016, 09:32 PM
Dosing question here :

According to their prescription, it's a 2.5% solution (https://hassonandwong.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/topical-finasteride-form.jpg)

1 ML daily dose = 25mg Finasteride. They claim only 1/18th goes systemic. 25/18 = ~1.39 mg finasteride systemically absorbed.(Is that what they mean by serum levels are 1/18th? that's just a little confusing to me) That's more than the standard Fin oral dose, is it not?

Am i missing something?

As far as I can tell, your math is spot on. And equally as befuddled.

stratowich
04-15-2016, 01:38 AM
What we need is something like this:

http://i.imgur.com/9IQw91b.jpg

barfacan
04-15-2016, 02:13 PM
What we need is a DHT receptor blocker that works on the hair follicle. I can see a liposomal topical working that way.

burtandernie
04-15-2016, 05:15 PM
What we need is a DHT receptor blocker that works on the hair follicle. I can see a liposomal topical working that way.

Yeah we do. CB has been in development for years and its still like 4 or 5 years until we ever actually get it. It just takes forever to actually release anything. Anything thing else just is underground and never gets the scale or numbers to become that cost effective. Not to mention safety and all that never really happens. Look at RU no one has clue if its safe or not many years after forum people have been using it anyway
Maybe someone can test the potency of RU and we get a legit company making it formulated as a real topical product. DHT receptor blockers exist just none ever get finished. They come and go no company ever actually finishing one of them

FeelsBad
04-15-2016, 11:02 PM
I emailed the italian pharmacy and it seems they will make it in lower concentrations. They sent me a prescription to be filled out by my doctor for a .5% solution when I requested it.

Vishnu018
04-16-2016, 08:09 AM
does anyone know a doctor in france who would accept to make such prescription? Until now they have all refused to write me one.

mowingdown
04-16-2016, 05:35 PM
liposome.

So as far as I know you're the only person on this forum using it.. How long have you been on it? Notice any difference? Ton of questions!

Bobbylobbyhobbythrobby
04-18-2016, 06:23 PM
I went to my GP here in the UK, and they won't fill the form out. And when I go to a private Dermatologist, they will only prescribe their own more expensive brand of oral fin. So I don't really know how we're supposed to get this topical. I'm also a little bit surprised that no one has done a DHT test before taking the new topical and after a few weeks to see if it does go systemic or not. I would do it but it will cost a lot to test. Maybe I should do a go fund me start up that will pay for the tests so we can all know for sure before taking it.

FuzzyWuzzy
04-19-2016, 12:20 PM
I took Fin 3+ years ago. Terrible sides within a week so I stopped. Have not taken fin or minox ( or anything else) since. Got a blood test Monday in anticipation of this new topical fin being available in the US. Once H&W release it in the US I'll take it as well as get new blood tests. ( prob after 45-90 days assuming no immediate felt sides). Happy to post both sets of blood tests at that point.

Seperatley, I'm also gonna write a note to see the duration of the 100+/- person study that H&W did. 1/18 systemic levels vs oral may be great for initial dosing. But as Fin can reduce DHT levels for multiple days (4 according to one study) the gradual build up of 1/18s can ultimately arrive at oral systemic levels (also the reason for my 45-90 day period above)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8846625

Crossing my fingers

Bobbylobbyhobbythrobby
04-19-2016, 04:18 PM
I took Fin 3+ years ago. Terrible sides within a week so I stopped. Have not taken fin or minox ( or anything else) since. Got a blood test Monday in anticipation of this new topical fin being available in the US. Once H&W release it in the US I'll take it as well as get new blood tests. ( prob after 45-90 days assuming no immediate felt sides). Happy to post both sets of blood tests at that point.

Seperatley, I'm also gonna write a note to see the duration of the 100+/- person study that H&W did. 1/18 systemic levels vs oral may be great for initial dosing. But as Fin can reduce DHT levels for multiple days (4 according to one study) the gradual build up of 1/18s can ultimately arrive at oral systemic levels (also the reason for my 45-90 day period above)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8846625

Crossing my fingers

Yeah would be interesting to see your blood DHT results. When does it become available in the US? I know that over here (EU) we have to buy it through the Italian pharmaceutical company, and their standard protocol is to mix it with 2.5% Fin concentration, if you want less e.g 0.5% you have to specify that when ordering. I am not sure if it is the same if you are buying directly from Hasson and Wong though.

willy
04-19-2016, 05:17 PM
For those people intending to use this in an effort to avoid sides... will you drop other topicals? Or switch to alternating application of topicals?

My concern is that assuming the H&W vehicle reduces systemic absorption, applying minox or any other topical will cause the finasteride to be absorbed anyway through PPG / alcohol etc. Thoughts?

Bobbylobbyhobbythrobby
04-19-2016, 07:41 PM
I'm not sure of the regularity in which the topical fin needs to be applied. However perhaps applying this at night and minox in the morning may suffice to limit/reduce any systemic absorption? My initial plan was to drop Minox entirely, however if it transpires that the fin topical doesn't even need to be applied everyday then I may continue with the Minox.

I'm not sure on the exact science, I know that a few others don't think that this topical work any differently (in terms of sides) to oral fin, however I don't know if H&W binding it with the liposome will stop it going systemic or not.

I guess there's only one way to find out.

79BirdofPrey
04-21-2016, 07:28 AM
Question: I took Fin tablets and did not experience any negative sides, but didn't experience any hair regrowth either. I was on it for about 1 year.

Does topical Fin improve the efficacy of the product? If I didn't experience regrowth with oral fin, would my chances improve with topical?

RU58841
04-22-2016, 06:35 AM
Question: I took Fin tablets and did not experience any negative sides, but didn't experience any hair regrowth either. I was on it for about 1 year.

Does topical Fin improve the efficacy of the product? If I didn't experience regrowth with oral fin, would my chances improve with topical?

Unfortunately probably not. It seemed like somebody at Hasson & Wong admitted (in one of the threads) that if there were a difference it would more likely be a bit less effective than the pill.

79BirdofPrey
04-22-2016, 06:36 AM
Unfortunately probably not. It seemed like somebody at Hasson & Wong admitted (in one of the threads) that if there were a difference it would more likely be a bit less effective than the pill.

Thank you for your response. I appreciate it!

GNX
04-22-2016, 12:10 PM
wow that was BRILLIANT! copy and paste Wiki.... smh ur jus too smart for anyone here. maybe H&W can hire you as an expert smh


Fin can't work without going systematic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antiandrogen

you can alter the pathway by (1) stopping production of androgens or (2) blocking the receptors that receive androgens

aka

you can either (1) tackle the quarterback, or (2) you can try to intercept the ball from a wide receiver.

fin is for tackling the quarterback....it's for stopping the ball before it's been thrown (aka stopping the production of DHT before it goes into the blood stream). Which means intercepting the ball after it's been thrown is blocking the receptor from receiving androgens (or stopping the circulating DHT from acting on the receptors in your scalp).

You can't tackle the quarterback after he's thrown the ball. In other words, fin doesn't really do anything after the ball has been thrown (or the DHT has been produced and let into the bloodstream). Thus applying it locally is like thinking you can sack the QB after he threw the ball.

The only topicals that will work are ones that shut down the AR receptor. This is ideal because you can sill have high DHT (and not be a womanly man tit boy) and still stop the baldness.

if this topical fin is working (aka lowering circulating DHT), it's because it's gone systemic.

FuzzyWuzzy
05-16-2016, 03:30 PM
Has anyone in the US been able to get this? I check the H&W website often and only see the April 21st update. Is anyone a patient and aware of the hold-up? Was pretty excited in March, now feel a bit in limbo.

RU58841
05-17-2016, 03:34 AM
Has anyone in the US been able to get this? I check the H&W website often and only see the April 21st update. Is anyone a patient and aware of the hold-up? Was pretty excited in March, now feel a bit in limbo.

Same. Waiting impatiently for an update. I tried contacting them via their website's form and just got a voicemail from someone who isn't in their Vancouver office saying I'd have to go up there for the prescription, but I'm guessing he wasn't aware of these updates or something, because I could've done that at any point in the past few years, no need to wait for them to make it available to US patients (or whatever this impending update is for).

Fuzzy, are you currently on oral fin? or anything else? Do you have a plan to switch from your current regimen to the topical? That's what I'm mostly worried about is how things might change in that transition.

RU58841
05-17-2016, 04:10 AM
Also, regarding the price, a rep from Hasson & Wong said it's $130CAD for a 100-day supply, so that's under $40/month USD: http://www.hairlossexperiences.com/view_post.php?post_id=51232

FuzzyWuzzy
05-17-2016, 05:17 AM
RU -

Not perscription strength medicines ( regenpure, castor oil etc). Had terrible reaction to fin ~3 years ago and have preferred hair loss to the fin side effects. Would be great if this is truly side effect free.

I did email H&W and they confirmed that the *new* topical is slightly different than their previous offering. I hope this means less sides, as the last iteration available for the last two years continued to effect people poorly.

Did the rep tell you, as an American, to go to Canada and get a perspiration from the H&W clinic? Surprised, because in the comments on their website they specifically say that isn't possible. Would be great if it were (even though a trip to BC is way too far away for me to reasonably get an Rx)

RU58841
05-17-2016, 05:26 PM
RU -

I did email H&W and they confirmed that the *new* topical is slightly different than their previous offering. I hope this means less sides, as the last iteration available for the last two years continued to effect people poorly.


Good to hear.



Did the rep tell you, as an American, to go to Canada and get a perspiration from the H&W clinic? Surprised, because in the comments on their website they specifically say that isn't possible. Would be great if it were (even though a trip to BC is way too far away for me to reasonably get an Rx)

Yep. Someone from H&W has talked about it on the forums before too, saying it's the only legal way to get it. Hoping that'll change soon, because flying to another country for a 15 minute appointment would suck.

robodoc
05-20-2016, 09:47 PM
I think your analogy does not apply to topical Fin. Oral Fin may prevent conversion in the blood but topical Fin make work topically...

George76
05-24-2016, 05:42 AM
Yeah would be interesting to see your blood DHT results. When does it become available in the US? I know that over here (EU) we have to buy it through the Italian pharmaceutical company, and their standard protocol is to mix it with 2.5% Fin concentration, if you want less e.g 0.5% you have to specify that when ordering. I am not sure if it is the same if you are buying directly from Hasson and Wong though.

Have you actually buyed and tried the Top Fin solution from the Italian pharmacy?
I'm interested in contacting the pharmacy myself and buying Top Fin from them but unfortunatlty looking through their website they have no information what-so-ever on the product..

schtif
05-24-2016, 07:36 AM
Have you actually buyed and tried the Top Fin solution from the Italian pharmacy?
I'm interested in contacting the pharmacy myself and buying Top Fin from them but unfortunatlty looking through their website they have no information what-so-ever on the product..

You can send them an Email: info@farmaciaparati.it. I've contacted them, the answer cam straight away:
thank you for contacting us.
To receive Finasteride gel 2,5% you only need to send us by email prescription of a doctor, and we can directly ship to you.
Attached you can find a sample of prescription that your doctor needs to fill.
The price for one bottle 30 ml is € 50,00 (+ shipping cost).
Please, tell us also what is your address for the shipping.

I'm not sure how lon 30ml is going to last, but looks like it is quite expensive.

Edit: Here the link http://www.farmaciaparati.it/en/ordina.html

ez456
05-24-2016, 01:34 PM
Any more info on this? Efficacy?

I would be interested in what concentrations produce what systemic reductions in DHT..

Vishnu018
05-25-2016, 02:23 AM
I've recently started to use H&W's topical and after only two days i'm experiencing watery semen , poor quality erections and loss of morning erection.

Are these side effects common with starting finasteride and go away if you continue or are they serious and require i stop this drug ?

FuzzyWuzzy
05-25-2016, 07:45 AM
Vishnu-

Sorry to hear you're experiencing side effects. My opinion (and not a medical one) would be to stop the drug. When I experienced sides from taking oral fin, I stopped and never came back to it. My hair loss has progressed. But all of my sides have been resolved.

Others here live with minimal sides and think it's a fair trade off for keeping hair. Still others experience sides initially but they disappear with continued drug use. Personal decision I suppose.

Broadly, this takes the wind out of my sails. Still side effects despite the liposomal delivery.

Vishnu018
05-25-2016, 07:58 AM
Thank you for your post Fuzzy.

I'm definitely quitting this drug although it's only been two days. I'm quite scared actually and hope i will recover soon.

How long did it take for your side effects to resolve after quitting the drug? For how long and what dosage have you been on fin ?

RU58841
05-25-2016, 08:09 AM
Thank you for your post Fuzzy.

I'm definitely quitting this drug although it's only been two days. I'm quite scared actually and hope i will recover soon.

How long did it take for your side effects to resolve after quitting the drug? For how long and what dosage have you been on fin ?

Vishnu, did you contact Hasson & Wong? What did they say? If not, please do.

Vishnu018
05-25-2016, 08:20 AM
I haven't yet but i think they'll tell me to stop the drug and wait for side effects to disappear.

RU58841
05-25-2016, 08:23 AM
I'm sure they will, but they'll also appreciate knowing that you experienced side effects. Might be able to make you a weaker version of the drug (although you might not be interested at this point, lol).

FuzzyWuzzy
05-25-2016, 08:33 AM
I agree with RU, best to tell H&W. Sharing data openly helps us all.

Vishnu- I wouldn't worry. Took me maybe 4 weeks to come back. I think FIN decreases AR5 for 5 days and then it takes more time for DHT levels to re-build. Best thing is to not worry. Sleep 8 hours, go to gym. Just be healthy for a few weeks and it should be fine.

Vishnu018
05-25-2016, 10:55 AM
I will contact them tonight.

Thanks for your story Fuzzy it's recomforting knowing you don't always end up with PFS when taking fin.

ez456
05-26-2016, 11:17 AM
I've recently started to use H&W's topical and after only two days i'm experiencing watery semen , poor quality erections and loss of morning erection.

Are these side effects common with starting finasteride and go away if you continue or are they serious and require i stop this drug ?

Isn't H&W's topical supposed to not go systemic because of the gel it is delivered in? Can you be sure that the symptoms are not psychosomatic?

RU58841
05-26-2016, 11:25 AM
Isn't H&W's topical supposed to not go systemic because of the gel it is delivered in? Can you be sure that the symptoms are not psychosomatic?

That's the goal, yeah. Maybe some people need a lower concentration, or less gel, or maybe some unfortunately just can't handle it. Who knows, but I wouldn't count it out as "it doesn't work at all" just yet.

George76
05-29-2016, 04:17 AM
Thank You Schtif I''ll contact them:)



You can send them an Email: info@farmaciaparati.it. I've contacted them, the answer cam straight away:
thank you for contacting us.
To receive Finasteride gel 2,5% you only need to send us by email prescription of a doctor, and we can directly ship to you.
Attached you can find a sample of prescription that your doctor needs to fill.
The price for one bottle 30 ml is € 50,00 (+ shipping cost).
Please, tell us also what is your address for the shipping.

I'm not sure how lon 30ml is going to last, but looks like it is quite expensive.

Edit: Here the link http://www.farmaciaparati.it/en/ordina.html

George76
05-29-2016, 04:22 AM
wooow hold on :( it look like there are the same side effects on the Finasteride pills...so may be it's not a good idea to try the topical solution I better stay away from it

nobs
05-29-2016, 08:57 AM
You gotta wonder why Merck never developed a topical version of finasteride, maybe it can't work. Another user brought up a valid point that finasteride is a 5 alpha reductase inhibitor, not a dht blocker, so it might be possible for dht produced from the prostate to make it's way up to the scalp. Maybe we should focus our efforts on equol which blocks the effects of dht. Either way, unless we see a blood workup, we can't assume Vishnu's symptoms were completely due to finasteride going systematic.

burtandernie
05-29-2016, 09:38 AM
Topical fin can be effective, and you have to ask merck why that it is. All the other stuff like amount systemic and that who really knows. The internal pill is certainly a heck of a lot easier to use which is why merck did that instead. Little did they know the amount of complaining about sides that would show up in hair loss forums 20 years later

Sandman: I don’t get where you are concluding topical fin. is a waste of time.
When Merck was developing and researching the uses for fin. as it relates to hairloss, they found it was effective as a topical.
They chose the pill route because they felt, in the long run, it would be more convienient for users.
- See more at: http://www.regrowth.com/hair-loss-forums/topic/topical-finasteride-34/#sthash.sT35EloU.dpuf

RU58841
07-08-2016, 11:33 AM
Damn it. I was about to book a flight to go see Hasson & Wong for the prescription, then when I called to make an appointment the receptionist told me that they're not giving out prescriptions to US patients until it's able to be compounded in the US, not even if you go all the way to Vancouver.

As for the ETA on the USA availability, she's guessing another 3-4 months. God damn it.

Smallville
07-22-2016, 04:59 PM
Damn it. I was about to book a flight to go see Hasson & Wong for the prescription, then when I called to make an appointment the receptionist told me that they're not giving out prescriptions to US patients until it's able to be compounded in the US, not even if you go all the way to Vancouver.

As for the ETA on the USA availability, she's guessing another 3-4 months. God damn it.

You really think this will be effective???

What's interesting about this one vs other topical fin is the liposomal aspect and the nanoparticles to block systemic absorption!

robodoc
07-30-2016, 07:30 PM
If you do we would be forever grateful for your part in getting bloodwork done BEFORE you start the cream. I would love to get it but alas, I am in the US. If you do plan on using this please please please get your serum DHT checked prior to use so we can see if their claims are substantiated or just another farce!

Also a log would be great!

I have use oral Fin for many years. Yes some negatives on the libido so I made my own liposomal fin. I might not experience much in the way of side effects as before when I took the oral but don't see any measurable differences in growth, maintenance on the topical. Remember the liposomal vehicle is directed at less absorption, less side effects.

Hasson & Wong seem very good at HT and also very expensive. I believe there are others who perform well and charge considerably less. That is my gripe H&W.

rakewell
08-01-2016, 05:52 PM
Do you mind sharing how you made you own liposomal fin?