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clandestine
08-29-2013, 03:39 PM
I don't know if it's hairs that were just coming into a growth phase anyway or if they are a result of the roller, but I have some newbies coming in here and there. They look thick and healthy, and are definitely growing fast. But, it's just a few and not cosmetically significant..yet.;)

What strength minox are you using? And how frequently?

LevonHelms
08-29-2013, 05:03 PM
What strength minox are you using? And how frequently?

I've been using 5% foam once nightly.

clandestine
08-29-2013, 05:36 PM
I've been using 5% foam once nightly.

Curious, where did you purchase the 5% foam?

I can only find 5% liquid, 2% foam OTC.

Pentarou
08-29-2013, 06:29 PM
Tracy C, how are you managing to dermaroll with longer hair? Any tips? Hope you are doing well at the moment, incidentally.

goingquick
08-29-2013, 07:38 PM
Rolled for the first time today. Hurts but it's not that bad. Disappointing to see a lack of results so far in the thread.


Tracy C, how are you managing to dermaroll with longer hair? Any tips? Hope you are doing well at the moment, incidentally.

Don't roll back and forth.

Tracy C
08-29-2013, 09:14 PM
Tracy C, how are you managing to dermaroll with longer hair? Any tips? Hope you are doing well at the moment, incidentally.

I haven't started yet. I am still waiting for my roller to arrive.

I plan to try using plastic wrap in the same way that it is used to make a mold of your scalp when fitting for a wig or topper, then roll through the wrap.

LevonHelms
08-29-2013, 10:07 PM
Curious, where did you purchase the 5% foam?

I can only find 5% liquid, 2% foam OTC.

Are you in the U.S.? I pick mine up at Sam's Wharehouse in packs of 4.

doke
08-30-2013, 04:18 AM
Those study pics seem impressive but if you use a 0.5 roller or the 1.5 as long as you take it easy you could try using it everyday or everyother day and use minox once a day use it twice until you get results then you could try once a day.
Im going to be using my new 1.5 titanium needle roller instead of the 0.5 but still not sure whether to use the study once a week.
Also going to use my minox and lasr comb plus dutasteride lets rock and roll haha.
By the way guys hell i was out of order with remarks made and am sorry for that as most know me as placid im not sure what got into me that day.
Tried to pm you hell but could not?

fred970
08-30-2013, 05:35 AM
You should not roll everyday, or put minox within 24 hours after the rolling. Why don't your roll every ten minutes?

PrettyFly83
08-30-2013, 05:35 AM
Hey all my Balding Brothers and Sister

As promised here are my 3 month update photo's which I'm posting for all to gauge the effectiveness of this treatment.

To summarize, I haven't changed anything in my regime from my first posts on page 6-8 of this thread as I didnt want to blur any results by changing techniques. My understanding was the original purpose of this thread by Hellouser was either to replicate the study or undertake a regime with slight variations on the technique. I'm planning to stick with my regime until I see someone yield better results with theirs. In no way am I saying mine was better than the studies, I had just been doing it for 2 months so thought to carry on.

Ive tried to match close ups over various area's of my shiny NW6 head to compare each area individually. Sorry if they are not exactly correctly positioned as these were all taken with an Galaxy SIII but I think they show enough detail.

Would like to hear everyone views on them, whether there has been any progress. Be gentle with your comments please, this is my head after all:o

For those using this technique, please please please keep going, it's only been 1 month since this thread started and the only way we can verify or disprove the study is with multiple cases. Close ups before and during are the only way to see if anything is happening as its VERY slow in my case so please take baseline pictures.

Remember to click ZOOM button twice to get full size, here we go:
Front Start of Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-05-20094342_zpsb0ced7ac.jpg.html?sort=3&o=9 (http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-05-20094342_zpsb0ced7ac.jpg.html?sort=3&o=9)
Front 3 Months into Treatment:
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-30082555_zpsc1ab2ba5.jpg.html?sort=3&o=1

Top: Start of Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-05-14163009_zpsd965f535.jpg.html?sort=3&o=10
Top: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-18092448_zps173028a1.jpg.html?sort=3&o=3

Crown: Start of Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-05-22092731_zpsb129f54a.jpg.html?sort=3&o=8
Crown: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-18092438_zps8252c1b3.jpg.html?sort=3&o=4

Back: Start of Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-05-12190720_zpse012e8d8.jpg.html?sort=3&o=11
Back: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-18092438_zps8252c1b3.jpg.html?sort=3&o=4

Left Temple: 1 Month into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-06-27193151_zps21f48a7c.jpg.html?sort=3&o=7
Left Temple: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-30102218_zps340d03d6.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0

Right Temple: 1 Month into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-06-27193200_zps5db31454.jpg.html?sort=3&o=6
Right Temple: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-29130926_zps62c4302c.jpg.html?sort=3&o=2
I only took temple shots at 1 month into treatment.

Sorry its so many.

My view: Regrowth is still happening but more slowly now, I think Im seeing new very fine hairs sprouting from my slick temples but can't be sure as the old photo's go blurry there. Older regrowth seems to be thickening but is VERY slow. There are thousand of black dots just below the skin and I'm hoping those are hairs resting.

doke
08-30-2013, 05:42 AM
You should not roll everyday, or put minox within 24 hours after the rolling. Why don't your roll every ten minutes?

hi fred no im going by the australia dermaroller skin care centre they also have a video and they say use a 0.5mm roller everyday and minox once a day.
But the study here does seem more impressive with the 1.5mm roller note they do say in the study not to use as hell does and cause bleeding that is over the top i will use as per study only to cause slight redness of the scalp.

Koga
08-30-2013, 06:21 AM
Hey guys,

I jumped on the dermarolling 4 weeks ago, so it'll be my 5th time rolling tomorrow.

I just want to report my results so far.

I use a 1.5mm roller, once a week.
Rogaine foam 2x a day except on day of rolling
Started on Propecia on week 2.
I keep my head buzzed, so its easy for me to track any changes

After first week I saw some white fuzz on left side of my head.
By the second week there was alot more white fuzz on both sides and two or three black hairs on left side.
This week some of the fuzz are starting to turn black, and there are few more black thicker hairs coming out.

I take pics every week. The camera doesn't pick up on the fuzz, but the amount of regrowth is pretty noticible by eye. I'm only 4 weeks in so I'm pretty excited and suprised I'm getting results that fast. The propecia is probably contributing also, but its still pretty fast. I'm not sure how much regrowth ill get, but hopefully it'll continue to grow.

Koga
08-30-2013, 06:36 AM
Hey guys,

I jumped on the dermarolling 4 weeks ago, so it'll be my 5th time rolling tomorrow.

I just want to report my results so far.

I use a 1.5mm roller, once a week.
Rogaine foam 2x a day except on day of rolling
Started on Propecia on week 2.
I keep my head buzzed, so its easy for me to track any changes

After first week I saw some white fuzz on left side of my head.
By the second week there was alot more white fuzz on both sides and two or three black hairs on left side.
This week some of the fuzz are starting to turn black, and there are few more black thicker hairs coming out.

I take pics every week. The camera doesn't pick up on the fuzz, but the amount of regrowth is pretty noticible by eye. I'm only 4 weeks in so I'm pretty excited and suprised I'm getting results that fast. The propecia is probably contributing also, but its still pretty fast. I'm not sure how much regrowth ill get, but hopefully it'll continue to grow.

HARIRI
08-30-2013, 06:57 AM
Hey guys,

I jumped on the dermarolling 4 weeks ago, so it'll be my 5th time rolling tomorrow.

I just want to report my results so far.

I use a 1.5mm roller, once a week.
Rogaine foam 2x a day except on day of rolling
Started on Propecia on week 2.
I keep my head buzzed, so its easy for me to track any changes

After first week I saw some white fuzz on left side of my head.
By the second week there was alot more white fuzz on both sides and two or three black hairs on left side.
This week some of the fuzz are starting to turn black, and there are few more black thicker hairs coming out.

I take pics every week. The camera doesn't pick up on the fuzz, but the amount of regrowth is pretty noticible by eye. I'm only 4 weeks in so I'm pretty excited and suprised I'm getting results that fast. The propecia is probably contributing also, but its still pretty fast. I'm not sure how much regrowth ill get, but hopefully it'll continue to grow.

Great update Bro but the problem is we don't know if your regrowth is because of Dermarolling or Finasteride!!! :confused:

bombarie
08-30-2013, 07:01 AM
Amazing regrowt!!!! I also see alot of black dots! I think they will grow out as thick hairs!! Congrats to your new hairs mate:) Very interesting


Hey all my Balding Brothers and Sister

As promised here are my 3 month update photo's which I'm posting for all to gauge the effectiveness of this treatment.

To summarize, I haven't changed anything in my regime from my first posts on page 6-8 of this thread as I didnt want to blur any results by changing techniques. My understanding was the original purpose of this thread by Hellouser was either to replicate the study or undertake a regime with slight variations on the technique. I'm planning to stick with my regime until I see someone yield better results with theirs. In no way am I saying mine was better than the studies, I had just been doing it for 2 months so thought to carry on.

Ive tried to match close ups over various area's of my shiny NW6 head to compare each area individually. Sorry if they are not exactly correctly positioned as these were all taken with an Galaxy SIII but I think they show enough detail.

Would like to hear everyone views on them, whether there has been any progress. Be gentle with your comments please, this is my head after all:o

For those using this technique, please please please keep going, it's only been 1 month since this thread started and the only way we can verify or disprove the study is with multiple cases. Close ups before and during are the only way to see if anything is happening as its VERY slow in my case so please take baseline pictures.

Remember to click ZOOM button twice to get full size, here we go:
Front Start of Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-05-20094342_zpsb0ced7ac.jpg.html?sort=3&o=9
Front 3 Months into Treatment:
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-30082555_zpsc1ab2ba5.jpg.html?sort=3&o=1

Top: Start of Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-05-14163009_zpsd965f535.jpg.html?sort=3&o=10
Top: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-18092448_zps173028a1.jpg.html?sort=3&o=3

Crown: Start of Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-05-22092731_zpsb129f54a.jpg.html?sort=3&o=8
Crown: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-18092438_zps8252c1b3.jpg.html?sort=3&o=4

Back: Start of Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-05-12190720_zpse012e8d8.jpg.html?sort=3&o=11
Back: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-18092438_zps8252c1b3.jpg.html?sort=3&o=4

Left Temple: 1 Month into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-06-27193151_zps21f48a7c.jpg.html?sort=3&o=7
Left Temple: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-30102218_zps340d03d6.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0

Right Temple: 1 Month into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-06-27193200_zps5db31454.jpg.html?sort=3&o=6
Right Temple: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-29130926_zps62c4302c.jpg.html?sort=3&o=2
I only took temple shots at 1 month into treatment.

Sorry its so many.

My view: Regrowth is still happening but more slowly now, I think Im seeing new very fine hairs sprouting from my slick temples but can't be sure as the old photo's go blurry there. Older regrowth seems to be thickening but is VERY slow. There are thousand of black dots just below the skin and I'm hoping those are hairs resting.

bombarie
08-30-2013, 07:05 AM
good results Flysurfer! I really see alot of black dots, those must be new hairs!
Good pictures and congrats to you

hellouser
08-30-2013, 07:20 AM
Hey all my Balding Brothers and Sister

As promised here are my 3 month update photo's which I'm posting for all to gauge the effectiveness of this treatment.

To summarize, I haven't changed anything in my regime from my first posts on page 6-8 of this thread as I didnt want to blur any results by changing techniques. My understanding was the original purpose of this thread by Hellouser was either to replicate the study or undertake a regime with slight variations on the technique. I'm planning to stick with my regime until I see someone yield better results with theirs. In no way am I saying mine was better than the studies, I had just been doing it for 2 months so thought to carry on.

Ive tried to match close ups over various area's of my shiny NW6 head to compare each area individually. Sorry if they are not exactly correctly positioned as these were all taken with an Galaxy SIII but I think they show enough detail.

Would like to hear everyone views on them, whether there has been any progress. Be gentle with your comments please, this is my head after all:o

For those using this technique, please please please keep going, it's only been 1 month since this thread started and the only way we can verify or disprove the study is with multiple cases. Close ups before and during are the only way to see if anything is happening as its VERY slow in my case so please take baseline pictures.

Remember to click ZOOM button twice to get full size, here we go:
Front Start of Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-05-20094342_zpsb0ced7ac.jpg.html?sort=3&o=9
Front 3 Months into Treatment:
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-30082555_zpsc1ab2ba5.jpg.html?sort=3&o=1

Top: Start of Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-05-14163009_zpsd965f535.jpg.html?sort=3&o=10
Top: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-18092448_zps173028a1.jpg.html?sort=3&o=3

Crown: Start of Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-05-22092731_zpsb129f54a.jpg.html?sort=3&o=8
Crown: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-18092438_zps8252c1b3.jpg.html?sort=3&o=4

Back: Start of Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-05-12190720_zpse012e8d8.jpg.html?sort=3&o=11
Back: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-18092438_zps8252c1b3.jpg.html?sort=3&o=4

Left Temple: 1 Month into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-06-27193151_zps21f48a7c.jpg.html?sort=3&o=7
Left Temple: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-30102218_zps340d03d6.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0

Right Temple: 1 Month into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-06-27193200_zps5db31454.jpg.html?sort=3&o=6
Right Temple: 3 Months into Treatment
http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/PrettyFly83/media/Derma%20Roller%20and%20Minox/2013-08-29130926_zps62c4302c.jpg.html?sort=3&o=2
I only took temple shots at 1 month into treatment.

Sorry its so many.

My view: Regrowth is still happening but more slowly now, I think Im seeing new very fine hairs sprouting from my slick temples but can't be sure as the old photo's go blurry there. Older regrowth seems to be thickening but is VERY slow. There are thousand of black dots just below the skin and I'm hoping those are hairs resting.

Holy shit.

Thats all I've got to say.

brunobald
08-30-2013, 07:41 AM
Intresting to note the hairs on the crown are growing in the classic whorl pattern suggesting its regeneration of older follicule rather than new ones.

brunobald
08-30-2013, 07:43 AM
Great update Bro but the problem is we don't know if your regrowth is because of Dermarolling or Finasteride!!! :confused:

Could be a super responder to fin, but fin rarely if ever grows back terminal hairs on previously bald areas.

gainspotter
08-30-2013, 07:44 AM
@prettyfly: that regrowth is amazing! So pleased for you. Maybe we don't need to draw blood afterall.

walrus
08-30-2013, 07:51 AM
Very impressive PrettyFly83

Koga
08-30-2013, 07:56 AM
Great update Bro but the problem is we don't know if your regrowth is because of Dermarolling or Finasteride!!! :confused:

Sorry Hariri, I know finasteride confounds my results somewhat, but for what it's worth, I definitly saw fuzz by the end of the first week before taking the finasteride. Also I was on 5mg finasteride which I cut into quarters, for about 6 months where I did not see much results, so I quit taking it about 2 years ago.

This time I am taking the 1mg propecia. If it was purely the propecia responsible for the regrowth, wouldn't it take longer for it to kick in? I'm seeing results in just a few weeks.

clandestine
08-30-2013, 08:24 AM
PrettyFly; what mm size roller are you using?

Or anyone else that knows?

LevonHelms
08-30-2013, 08:36 AM
Thanks for the update PrettyFly!

I see more regrowth there man, all over your dome! Looking good, keep it up bro.

Buster
08-30-2013, 09:24 AM
PrettyFly; what mm size roller are you using?

Or anyone else that knows?

Quoted from PrettyFly's post:


My derma roller is a standard 0.5mm 192 needle titanium tipped model

clandestine
08-30-2013, 09:43 AM
Quoted from PrettyFly's post:

Thanks Buster

greatjob!
08-30-2013, 10:30 AM
Great update Bro but the problem is we don't know if your regrowth is because of Dermarolling or Finasteride!!! :confused:

At only 4 weeks on finasteride there is no way he would see any regrowth from it, in fact he is more likely to shed hair at this point than regrow it with fin.

john2399
08-30-2013, 10:39 AM
What is prettyfly's regimen?

hellouser
08-30-2013, 10:44 AM
At only 4 weeks on finasteride there is no way he would see any regrowth from it, in fact he is more likely to shed hair at this point than regrow it with fin.

Yup. Also, Minoxidil without dermarolling usually gives a bad shed in the first 1-3 months and results don't come in until much later, sometimes 6-12 months!

Buster
08-30-2013, 10:46 AM
Hey guys,

I jumped on the dermarolling 4 weeks ago, so it'll be my 5th time rolling tomorrow.

I just want to report my results so far.

I use a 1.5mm roller, once a week.
Rogaine foam 2x a day except on day of rolling


Hi, did you just start Minox, or have you been on it for a while?

Chromeo
08-30-2013, 11:38 AM
Very impressed with the results. Let's beat this thing, fellas.

chimera
08-30-2013, 11:38 AM
What is prettyfly's regimen?

He's just on minox and dermaroller. Well yeah, he's also on vit C, but we all know vit C won't do jack.

greatjob!
08-30-2013, 11:39 AM
Hey all my Balding Brothers and Sister

As promised here are my 3 month update photo's which I'm posting for all to gauge the effectiveness of this treatment.


PrettyFly I thought I would embed a side by side of your pics here so people could see your progress a little better.

http://i1000.photobucket.com/albums/af128/greatjob_/PrettyFly83_zps4518377d.jpg

Kiwi
08-30-2013, 01:29 PM
Would derm rolling without minox make a difference?

Also I'm not on minox if I start dermrolling now will I get and shedding?

gainspotter
08-30-2013, 01:58 PM
Would derm rolling without minox make a difference?

Also I'm not on minox if I start dermrolling now will I get and shedding?

Hard to answer that as most people would rather be exact to the study. If you want to try dermarolling without minox, I would say go for it, if you start getting results then it could be a good way to gauge the effectiveness of minox. It would be nice to stop applying that crap everyday anyway.
The more different techniques used in this study the better I think.
And yeah you will probably notice shedding if you use minox.

Jens1986
08-30-2013, 02:42 PM
Yup. Also, Minoxidil without dermarolling usually gives a bad shed in the first 1-3 months and results don't come in until much later, sometimes 6-12 months!

Shedding should stop before 3 months - after 3 months you should have results. This is what it says on minoxidil package at least (and my personal experience)

hellouser
08-30-2013, 02:55 PM
Shedding should stop before 3 months - after 3 months you should have results. This is what it says on minoxidil package at least (and my personal experience)

Usually true but everyones different. When I first started Minoxidil I didn't get results until around a year or so later. Essentially, I shed, thinned out and stayed that way for a loooong time (wasnt until 50mg/1ml of RU was added).

I hate Minox, but its essential. CB should be awesome.

Conpecia
08-30-2013, 03:24 PM
HOLY SHIT look at that regrowth!!!!! VERY exciting!!

clandestine
08-30-2013, 03:53 PM
hellouser are you going to Dermaroll with RU minox CB (ideally)?

fred970
08-30-2013, 04:08 PM
Looks like it's really working. Hard to not get excited :).

The Alchemist
08-30-2013, 04:34 PM
HOLY SHIT look at that regrowth!!!!! VERY exciting!!

His head is shaved to the bone in the first photo. In the second photo his hair has grown out quite a bit. Look at the sides to see how much. I think that this makes it difficult to say what is regrowth and what is just hair growing in. Maybe though...

I've been rolling for about a month now and have not noticed any effects yet. Will keep up with it for a few more months to see what happens. Really hoping this works

yan
08-30-2013, 04:42 PM
His head is shaved to the bone in the first photo. In the second photo his hair has grown out quite a bit. Look at the sides to see how much. I think that this makes it difficult to say what is regrowth and what is just hair growing in. Maybe though...

I've been rolling for about a month now and have not noticed any effects yet. Will keep up with it for a few more months to see what happens. Really hoping this works

So true...

john2399
08-30-2013, 04:56 PM
His head is shaved to the bone in the first photo. In the second photo his hair has grown out quite a bit. Look at the sides to see how much. I think that this makes it difficult to say what is regrowth and what is just hair growing in. Maybe though...

I've been rolling for about a month now and have not noticed any effects yet. Will keep up with it for a few more months to see what happens. Really hoping this works

Not really because the crown is completely bald. You can't even see stumble in the first pick on the crown and then after 3 months there is def regrowth.

StayThick
08-30-2013, 05:03 PM
His head is shaved to the bone in the first photo. In the second photo his hair has grown out quite a bit. Look at the sides to see how much. I think that this makes it difficult to say what is regrowth and what is just hair growing in. Maybe though...

I've been rolling for about a month now and have not noticed any effects yet. Will keep up with it for a few more months to see what happens. Really hoping this works

I wasn't going to be the one to say....but I agree 100% with ^.

I see most on here like to lean on hope and then get excited when they see something that might remotely resemble a result of some kind, but those pics don't prove anything IMHO.

Hair looks freshly shaved in the left pic and slightly grown out on the left. I've done this for around 3 months as well and personally it hasn't done much of anything...

Wish you all the best. I'll still continue myself, but have little hopes this will do anything.

Chromeo
08-30-2013, 07:48 PM
Totally disagree with the "shaven-down" BS. That's a bald scalp, fellas.

I shave my head regularly and there is never that "nothing there" look to it. You can tell if there is hair there or not.

Koga
08-30-2013, 08:26 PM
Hi, did you just start Minox, or have you been on it for a while?

I've been on minox for a few years now

PatientlyWaiting
08-30-2013, 08:39 PM
I shave my head any where from a zero to a 1 or a 2, every 2-3 days and I will disagree with those saying his head is completely shaved in the baseline pic. It looks to me like there's no hair at all because he's completely bald. He has the same haircut, just that in the after pic he has regrowth.

Koga
08-30-2013, 08:42 PM
Also, has anyone noticed its easier to draw blood each time you roll? The first time I rolled I couldn't draw any blood, but by the third time I was drawing some blood, and this last time there was a lot more. I apply the same amount of pressure each time. I'm thinking each time I roll and injure the scalp, it causes the blood vessels to grow closer to the scalp which would also bring more nutrients to the follicles? That would explain why I'm getting more blood each week.

yan
08-30-2013, 08:44 PM
I shave my head any where from a zero to a 1 or a 2, every 2-3 days and I will disagree with those saying his head is completely shaved in the baseline pic. It looks to me like there's no hair at all because he's completely bald. He has the same haircut, just that in the after pic he has regrowth.

Dude if you don`t see the different hair lenght, then something is wrong with you. Just check the donor area. No further comment, it`s obvious.

But nevertheless, it looks like he gained around 20-30 hairs in his crown (at best).

Chromeo
08-30-2013, 08:56 PM
Dude if you don`t see the different hair lenght, then something is wrong with you. Just check the donor area. No further comment, it`s obvious.

But nevertheless, it looks like he gained around 20-30 hairs in his crown (at best).

If you are suggesting that's not a bald scalp and just a shaven down scalp, then I would appreciate no further comment because you are clearly mistaken about it. I'm guessing you don't shave your head down regularly, because in areas where you have some hair, it doesn't look like his before pictures.

Chromeo
08-30-2013, 08:58 PM
Also, has anyone noticed its easier to draw blood each time you roll? The first time I rolled I couldn't draw any blood, but by the third time I was drawing some blood, and this last time there was a lot more. I apply the same amount of pressure each time. I'm thinking each time I roll and injure the scalp, it causes the blood vessels to grow closer to the scalp which would also bring more nutrients to the follicles? That would explain why I'm getting more blood each week.

I have noticed this too, Koga. On the first week, I didn't experience as much bleeding as I expected with the longer needles. The next week I bled a little more, the third week more than that, and by the one month mark, it was easier to bleed than ever before. Very interesting observation.

HairBane
08-30-2013, 09:17 PM
Is everyone just using wounding + minoxidil? Or are some people using growth factors etc?

hellouser
08-30-2013, 10:09 PM
Is everyone just using wounding + minoxidil? Or are some people using growth factors etc?

Me:

Dermarolling Once a week (deep rolling drawing blood)
5% Minoxidil 2x every day (except for day of dermarolling)
1-2% CB 1x every day

I might jump on the growth factors bandwagon. I really want my temples back and density on scalp.

horte
08-30-2013, 10:33 PM
So could be coincidence, doubtful but I noticed a huge shed and I am dermarolling on hair that came from mindoxil, i had decent temple regrowth with just Min and trentoin A and starting using dermaroller... However i have been experiencing a massive shed and now when i put min on and shampoo 15 hairs come out.

Basically has anyone else shed from this? should I stop dermarolling do a select few experience hairless? or am i making a connection thats not there.

Its been 2 weeks and seems to not be slowing down HELP please

TO YOUNG TO RETIRE
08-30-2013, 11:17 PM
ride it out man ;)

doke
08-31-2013, 01:52 AM
no need top draw blood guys as thats real damage to scalp just plain silly that is, anyway i have never done this and also i got results from dermarolling using a 0.5mm roller with 192 titanium needle and using it everyday and applying minox straight after when dry applying copper peptide spray its what works for you as its still experimental really even though theres been this trial.

Koga
08-31-2013, 05:52 AM
I'm not trying to draw blood, I'm just saying I'm starting to draw blood without trying, using the same amount of pressure as before.

doke
08-31-2013, 05:56 AM
hi guys im using topical morr f 3% minox plus 1mg finasteride all in one topical and may add topical spiro 0.5% lotion but cannot use it until minox is dry due to smell and before you say use dr klines spiro its too expensive best to cover as much as possible with advanced mpb i still have some mpb treatments ru plus 5% but it made my hairloss worse.

doke
08-31-2013, 06:01 AM
The only problem i see with scalp wounding will it make the scalp become used to the roller and form thicker skin that in turn causes more hair loss in the future i dought if the once a week will hurt as long as you take it lightly in small stages but everyday i think will be ok as long as you use a smaller needle roller.
I think i will try the once a week as i have my new 1.5 needle now but will need to start easy as i usually sneeze on the temples and eyes water.

StayThick
08-31-2013, 06:02 AM
Me:

Dermarolling Once a week (deep rolling drawing blood)
5% Minoxidil 2x every day (except for day of dermarolling)
1-2% CB 1x every day

I might jump on the growth factors bandwagon. I really want my temples back and density on scalp.

Hellouser: Im placing my order for the Growth Factors now before the price hikes up. I really want to apply this after a dermarolling session. It could have sides, but at this point my hair is killing me already.

If you want to ride it out, I'll be purchasing and can update you if you want. I don't care about being a guinea pig with this at the moment. I also just ordered CB from ID, which they said would be at my door within the week.

Hicks
08-31-2013, 07:09 AM
I'm not trying to draw blood, I'm just saying I'm starting to draw blood without trying, using the same amount of pressure as before.

I have notice this as well but I am ball rolling 3 times a week. 3rd time I dermarolled it look like someone gutted a deer in my sink.

It also seems that the elasticity of my front scalp has been increasing.

Stevo1
08-31-2013, 09:00 AM
Hellouser: Im placing my order for the Growth Factors now before the price hikes up. I really want to apply this after a dermarolling session. It could have sides, but at this point my hair is killing me already.

If you want to ride it out, I'll be purchasing and can update you if you want. I don't care about being a guinea pig with this at the moment. I also just ordered CB from ID, which they said would be at my door within the week.
Staythick,

1) I just ordered the Anagen GF's yesterday too. Like you I do not mind being the guinea pig.

2) Good to here Iron Dragon is shipping CB-03-01 soon as I ordered mine in July.

3) Check out my 35 year experience/history including using other type of GF's and ALL of Iron-Dragon products..."Growth factors Thread" page 18 & 19.

Respectfully,

Stevo

doke
08-31-2013, 09:53 AM
where in the 2013 trial results did they say you need to needle so hard as to draw blood its the opposite so why go against the trial if you want to follow it that is?

Tracy C
08-31-2013, 10:10 AM
where in the 2013 trial results did they say you need to needle so hard as to draw blood its the opposite so why go against the trial if you want to follow it that is?

Some are trying to reproduce the pilot study to see if it works, which is a very smart thing to do and is the way science should be done. Others are following their own untrained theories about the study results and are trying to improve upon those results without first attempting to reproduce them to confirm proof of concept. It's their scalps. They can do whatever they want with them.

hellouser
08-31-2013, 10:18 AM
Some are trying to reproduce the pilot study to see if it works, which is a very smart thing to do and is the way science should be done. Others are following their own untrained theories about the study results and are trying to improve upon those results without first attempting to reproduce them to confirm proof of concept. It's their scalps. They can do whatever they want with them.

Its been pointed out already, but I'll say it again:

No need to have so many people reproduce the trial results, theres enough that are doing so to validate the study. You're also dismissing the fact that some of us (me) are trying to replicate Follica's wounding theory (in some way at least).

Don't downplay the efforts of others.

doke
08-31-2013, 10:19 AM
I have seen no proof in any study that you really need to make the scalp bleed and thats true in the case skin use as well it is not the right thing to tell people to do and i will say whats right so some younger or new members here do not get the wrong info.
It is your own scalps to do as you want but we need to say do this at your own risk due as we have no long term data what this damage may do.
I say good luck to you guys doing this but me i will make sure its helping not torture slight redness is ok im not trying to deride anyone as you cannot tell people what to do but as said we need to point out its not in this study.

Tracy C
08-31-2013, 10:27 AM
No need to have so many people reproduce the trial results, theres enough that are doing so to validate the study.

You do not understand how research is properly done. The more these results of this pilot study can be reproduced the better. That is called good science.




Don't downplay the efforts of others.

I am not downplaying anyone. But this is important to point out. It is the sensible and responsible thing to do. Many here are certainly not being sensible and certainly not acting responsibly - but some of us are. Don't you downplay those who are exercising good sense and acting responsibly and appropriately.

hellouser
08-31-2013, 10:45 AM
You do not understand how research is properly done. The more these results of this pilot study can be reproduced the better. That is called good science.




'Good science' is an extremely vague and primitive way of describing the research.



I am not downplaying anyone. But this is important to point out. It is the sensible and responsible thing to do. Many here are certainly not being sensible and certainly not acting responsibly - but some of us are. Don't you downplay those who are exercising good sense and acting responsibly and appropriately.

That is offensive, you realize that, right? I've gone far beyond most people to bring all the necessary information for everyone to take part in this trial and pointed out many different routes people can take. For you to even suggest I downplay those who are following the study is bogus, especially since you tried to use my words against me. And again, which will be at least the 3rd time me saying this:

THERES NO NEED FOR ABSOLUTELY EVERYONE TO FOLLOW THE STUDY TO THE T WHEN THERES SO MANY ALREADY DOING SO.

Those that are following the study and get results will HOPEFULLY report back with their results (and hopefully with pictures). As for myself and others who are trying wounding, growth factors, etc. you can only be grateful for seeing how you'll then know if compounding other topicals works (or not). I don't see why youre so being so hostile for the fact that some are deviating from the study.

doke
08-31-2013, 11:02 AM
As said hell good luck to you and i hope you are successful with this but its not what the trial you brought to thie thread says or i did not see it.
I say again the trial was a good result and says slight redness is whats needed once a week as there was someone said that you may cause damage to the scalp in making the scalp bleed im only saying this to be on the safe side as we are not sure that to use too much force may cause more hair loss but i hope you post pictures at three months to see if you have had any success and before pics as well.

doke
08-31-2013, 11:04 AM
Has anyone saw the piliel trials that regrew hair after wounding as fns may help as well.
I do need to say to hellhouse thankyou for bringing this dermaroller trial to bald truth as its very interesting and maybe what we all want to regrow some hair back.

Tracy C
08-31-2013, 12:23 PM
'Good science' is an extremely vague and primitive way of describing the research.

Obviously you did not get the point of that at all.




That is offensive, you realize that, right?

It was intended to be because you asked for it and you deserved it. You and only you.




THERES NO NEED FOR ABSOLUTELY EVERYONE TO FOLLOW THE STUDY TO THE T WHEN THERES SO MANY ALREADY DOING SO.

There is absolutely no need for caps lock and bold text. No one is saying that ABSOLUTELY EVERYONE should follow the protocol in the pilot study. More people should however to help verify the proof of concept. What I am reading is telling me that not enough are attempting to reproduce the results of this pilot study by following the protocols of the pilot study. You insist on missing or intentionally ignoring that very important point.

Tracy C
08-31-2013, 12:29 PM
I do need to say to hellhouse thankyou for bringing this dermaroller trial to bald truth as its very interesting...

Yes it is very interesting - but it was only a pilot study. A pilot study is a study used to determine if more study is appropriate. The reported results tell me that more study is appropriate - if the results can be reasonably and adequately reproduced in larger numbers. That's a very important thing right there.

gainspotter
08-31-2013, 12:49 PM
I don't see why some people have to be so hostile on these threads.
Who cares if someone is trying it a different way, you don't have to. Even I am sticking with the study for time being, doesn't mean I'll criticise everyone elses methods. Hellhouser could have better success drawing blood and then we will all be jumping on that bandwagon. No one knows what's gonna happen, all I can say is thanks hell for all your work and research in tackling this sh1t.

greatjob!
08-31-2013, 01:43 PM
As said hell good luck to you and i hope you are successful with this but its not what the trial you brought to thie thread says or i did not see it.
I say again the trial was a good result and says slight redness is whats needed once a week as there was someone said that you may cause damage to the scalp in making the scalp bleed im only saying this to be on the safe side as we are not sure that to use too much force may cause more hair loss but i hope you post pictures at three months to see if you have had any success and before pics as well.

I initially said you don't want to draw blood as well because the study said to roll until you see mild erythema. This was however before I ever rolled with the 1.5 mm derma roller, because after I used it the first time I realized it is not possible to roll with a 1.5 mm roller and not draw blood.

greatjob!
08-31-2013, 01:45 PM
It was intended to be because you asked for it and you deserved it. You and only you.

Damn that's pretty harsh

sosa56
08-31-2013, 01:51 PM
I initially said you don't want to draw blood as well because the study said to roll until you see mild erythema. This was however before I ever rolled with the 1.5 mm derma roller, because after I used it the first time I realized it is not possible to roll with a 1.5 mm roller and not draw blood.

This. As long as youre not going crazy, I think we've all seen, those of us who have been following the thread form its humble beginnings, that a little bit of blood with 1.5 mm dermarolling is par for the course

Tracy C
08-31-2013, 03:50 PM
Damn that's pretty harsh

Are you serious? I don't get even close to being as harsh with you guys as you guys are with me. You guys have been jumping all over my case and giving me massive amounts of unreasonable crap from the very beginning - and all I ever wanted to do was help... I have every right to get even more harsh with you guys than I currently do and I have the green light to go ahead and do so. Whether you like it or not I have a right to defend myself - and I am going to do that.

greatjob!
08-31-2013, 04:07 PM
Are you serious? I don't get even close to being as harsh with you guys as you guys are with me. You guys have been jumping all over my case and giving me massive amounts of unreasonable crap from the very beginning - and all I ever wanted to do was help... I have every right to get even more harsh with you guys than I currently do and I have the green light to go ahead and do so. Whether you like it or not I have a right to defend myself - and I am going to do that.

I have never been harsh towards you. I agree with you on most things. The only thing I have disagreed with you on in the past in laser therapy, and it looks like your opinion has evolved in regards to men using laser therapy, so we now probably agree on almost everything. I know people have been assholes to you in the past, I was just reacting to this particular conversation.

Pentarou
08-31-2013, 06:28 PM
I definitely agree with Tracy that we need to stick to trying to replicate the pilot study's treatment protocol to test the generalisability *before* we collectively attempt anything further. We have to learn to walk before we can run.

Kiwi
08-31-2013, 06:44 PM
Are you serious? I don't get even close to being as harsh with you guys as you guys are with me. You guys have been jumping all over my case and giving me massive amounts of unreasonable crap from the very beginning - and all I ever wanted to do was help... I have every right to get even more harsh with you guys than I currently do and I have the green light to go ahead and do so. Whether you like it or not I have a right to defend myself - and I am going to do that.

I value your input too Tracy!!!!

.... just not when it comes to do with topics such as erect penis failure due to finasteride. So long as you don't talk about the benefits of fin in the "Cutting Edge" forums I'm a happy chappy ;)

Pentarou
08-31-2013, 06:48 PM
Look people, this study could be a real gift: a way to regrow hair using a relatively cheap implement, and a substance that you can buy cheaply in any pharmacy! As basic as it gets. It really is worth the effort to try and prove (or disprove).

Kiwi
08-31-2013, 06:51 PM
Look people, this study could be a real gift: a way to regrow hair using a relatively cheap implement, and a substance that you can buy cheaply in any pharmacy! As basic as it gets. It really is worth the effort to try and prove (or disprove).

Do you guys think this will do?
http://www.dermaroller.co.nz/homecareroller

LevonHelms
08-31-2013, 09:59 PM
Do you guys think this will do?
http://www.dermaroller.co.nz/homecareroller

Yep. That's the same one I have, made by Rejuveness. Seems fairly sturdy.

Whoa Kiwi, I just looked at the price. $129 is way too much, and that's a .25mm in the starter kit. I bought two rollers just like that one in a 1.5mm and .5mm on Amazon for a total of $60. And you can buy the c & e serum(for your face) if you want for around $25.

Kiwi
08-31-2013, 10:12 PM
Do you guys think dermarolling for a month without minox might lesson the chances of minox shedding?

john2399
08-31-2013, 10:18 PM
Yep. That's the same one I have, made by Rejuveness. Seems fairly sturdy.

Whoa Kiwi, I just looked at the price. $129 is way too much, and that's a .25mm in the starter kit. I bought two rollers just like that one in a 1.5mm and .5mm on Amazon for a total of $60. And you can buy the c & e serum(for your face) if you want for around $25.

60 bucks? my dermaroller was like 12 bucks.

Conpecia
08-31-2013, 10:44 PM
I definitely agree with Tracy that we need to stick to trying to replicate the pilot study's treatment protocol to test the generalisability *before* we collectively attempt anything further. We have to learn to walk before we can run.

No.

DesperateOne
08-31-2013, 11:20 PM
First I want to say that everyone had the right to their opinion, and that means we might disagree with each other. Let us not gang up on Tracy, I know she is like beacon here because she is the only girl and a well known respected emember.

Anyways, it has been over a month with me and I took pics before the trial and buzzed my head pretty short, 1mm. I now have the hair longer and I will be posting some pics tomorrow as I am typing this on my phone. I dont know how much it has helped because as some have pointed out, it's hard to see a difference when hair has grown. It is still very bad, but I think it worked a bit.

LevonHelms
08-31-2013, 11:41 PM
60 bucks? my dermaroller was like 12 bucks.

Well, 2 at $30 a pop. The first one I bought was 10-15 bucks by MT. I wanted to see if there was any difference in quality. Honestly I liked the handle of the cheaper MT better, but the rolling pin started squeaking and binding last week. Hence the switch.

DesperateOne
08-31-2013, 11:48 PM
Well, 2 at $30 a pop. The first one I bought was 10-15 bucks by MT. I wanted to see if there was any difference in quality. Honestly I liked the handle of the cheaper MT better, but the rolling pin started squeaking and binding last week. Hence the switch.



Mine is also squeaking, but it should still work. God... Why did we have to be cursed with this desease, I think it might be worse than cranialpagus parasiticus .

doke
09-01-2013, 06:28 AM
Mine is also squeaking, but it should still work. God... Why did we have to be cursed with this desease, I think it might be worse than cranialpagus parasiticus .

Squeaking i only thought the mice trials for hairloss caused that hahaha put a little drop of olive oil on the spindle that may cure it.

doke
09-01-2013, 06:33 AM
I was getting good results from dermarolling everyday with the 0.5mm roller but uping it to 1.5mm may produce better results im wondering if using it every other day and minox with azeilac acid in every day but at night only 2mls.
Any thoughts on that as long as you go easy at first with the roller although i have not got the roller out of its rapping yet.

Koga
09-01-2013, 07:36 AM
I would advise against rolling every other day with 1.5mm, since after I roll with mine my scalp feels a bit sore and different for at least 3 days after. You should roll once with the 1.5mm and see how you feel day by day.

But if you're rolling for the wounding effect, wouldn't then it would make sense to let the scalp repair and recover, and let your follicles benefit from the growth factors being released, before wounding it again?

HARIRI
09-01-2013, 07:45 AM
Read this Guys:-

Dermaroller for Home Use

The modern-day magic wand of skin care
Are you really happy with the results of your skincare, or do you think they could be better? Did you know that only minor fractions (maximum 0.3%!) of the active substance of your favourite cream can penetrate the surface of your skin? The majority of it – 99.7% – is wasted on your towel, pillow or cotton-pads. So if you want to dramatically increase the effectiveness of your skincare products and treatments then you need a dermaroller for home use!

Description of the dermaroller

Our dermaroller for home use is a cosmetic skin tool that dramatically increases the penetration and effectiveness of active substances up to 40 times compared to normal topical creaming. By rolling the cylinder on the skin’s surface you create micro-channels that effortlessly drive active vitamins, lipids and substances deeper into your skin, whilst stimulating the skin’s natural renewal process.

Features

Our roller has nearly 200 stainless-steel micro points that painlessly create thousands of tiny channels in the outer layer of the skin, allowing vitamins, enzymes and lipids to penetrate more deeply. Needle tips or micro-points are so fine they can barely be seen with the naked eye and only penetrate the epidermis and cannot reach the dermis.

Homecare Roller
The length of the needles in our dermaroller for home use is .25mm. This roller is perfect for treating your face and other delicate areas


Advanced Roller

The length of the needles in our advanced roller is .5mm. This roller is suited for treating cellulite or stretch marks because the skin is thicker. It is also ideal for those who have used our dermaroller starter pack and require a more advanced at home treatment. This roller will induce some collagen and dramatically increase product penetration.

Warning

Please do not be fooled into thinking that longer needles are superior and will give better results! At dr. dermacare your safety comes first. This is why we refuse to sell rollers with longer needles to our retail customers. We have been selling rollers for over 5 years, long before the influx of websites that clearly put ‘profit before principles’ came along. Our knowledge experience and research clearly tells us that you can cause permanent damage to the nerves and muscles beneath your skin if you roll regularly with longer needles.

Needles longer than .5mm should only be used by professionals for medical treatments.

Benefits of the homecare dermaroller when used in conjunction with active substances:

The process is entirely natural
Dramatically increases the penetration of your skincare products and treatments.
Reduces appearance of fine lines and wrinkles
Visibly reduces scarring, sun damage and pigmentation
Skin becomes thicker and healthier
Dermaroller can be used at home use or anywhere
The process is pain free
There is no damage to the skin
It can be used on thin skin
Supports collagen and elastin repair
It can be used on all areas of the face, neck and body
It is cost-effective, and lasts up to 120 applications
Enhances Iontophoresis and Sonophoresis treatments

Use of the dermaroller

Apply a thin layer of your chosen dr. dermacare skincare product and ‘roll’ it gently into your skin with the roller. Only a medium pressure should initially be applied. Scientific data is based on rolling 10-15 times in the same area in all directions. In this case around 240 microinfiltration- pores per square centimetre are set. The pores close within minutes thus locking in nutrients and supporting skin renewal.
When you purchase a roller from us it will come with detailed instructions

Indications for Use

Suitable for all skin types except for use on active acne, eczema, warts, moles and skin cancers. It should be used only and exclusively by the same person. The infiltration channels are closed in less than one hour after the treatment.

How to use the dr. dermacare roller for hairloss:

The roller can and should be used with every application of an anti-hairloss product. We recommend Minoxidil. The use is absolutely pain-free and the invisible micro perforation of the skin disappears in minutes. The topical product has to be applied first then use the roller with light to medium pressure.

Very important – Roll 2-3 times over the same spot but only in one direction. If you roll back and forth you will tangle your existing hair in the roller. Always roll away from the hair root. Use your hands to keep existing hair out of your way as good as possible.

Koga
09-01-2013, 08:30 AM
yikes Hariri, that's kind of scary.. I don't want permanent nerve or muscle damage. But then again, what they are talking about is more for increased penetration of minoxidil and skin care products. I'm sure they aren't talking about wounding which is what we are going after, which they probably don't know about. So the 1.5mm might be needed. Does anyone know how deep hair follicles are?

DesperateOne
09-01-2013, 09:21 AM
Well here are my photos, it's been about a month and a week that I used this procedure. I have kept it basically the same as the study, but I do get some sun for 15 mins now, and vitamin D3. Been on fin for about 3 years now.

I buzzed my hair on top around 2mm, and it should be about 4mm or so now. Sorry but this is going to have to do for now, until I have to buzz it down more, I don't know if there is any improvement, I think I have gotten some thickness. Well you be the judge, there is not many pics but oh well. I think with a little longer hair and some dermatch, I might be able to pull a relatively passable look, do you think?

http://imgur.com/a/byiAS#5

HairBane
09-01-2013, 09:31 AM
Shouldn't you guys be using FGF9 like Follica said, rather than minoxidil?

chimera
09-01-2013, 09:38 AM
Turns out FGF9 is not as easy to get... not at all...

DesperateOne
09-01-2013, 09:58 AM
Shouldn't you guys be using FGF9 like Follica said, rather than minoxidil?

Well, if you can find it or make it, you let us know. I think hellouser is willing to be the lab rat for it.

hellouser
09-01-2013, 10:24 AM
Turns out FGF9 is not as easy to get... not at all...

Its easy to get. If you have thousands of dollars.

the_dude78
09-01-2013, 10:25 AM
Well here are my photos, it's been about a month and a week that I used this procedure. I have kept it basically the same as the study, but I do get some sun for 15 mins now, and vitamin D3. Been on fin for about 3 years now.

I buzzed my hair on top around 2mm, and it should be about 4mm or so now. Sorry but this is going to have to do for now, until I have to buzz it down more, I don't know if there is any improvement, I think I have gotten some thickness. Well you be the judge, there is not many pics but oh well. I think with a little longer hair and some dermatch, I might be able to pull a relatively passable look, do you think?

http://imgur.com/a/byiAS#5

If the last two pictures in the album are the before pictures and the rest are after, then it definitely could look like you've gained some density. But with the quality of the photos, it's hard to tell really. Seems like the lighting in the last two pictures is different.

the_dude78
09-01-2013, 10:37 AM
Are you serious? I don't get even close to being as harsh with you guys as you guys are with me. You guys have been jumping all over my case and giving me massive amounts of unreasonable crap from the very beginning - and all I ever wanted to do was help... I have every right to get even more harsh with you guys than I currently do and I have the green light to go ahead and do so. Whether you like it or not I have a right to defend myself - and I am going to do that.

Tracy, let me first say I value your input too, and I actually agree with you in most cases, but I think you can be a little harsh too in the way you address people. I know that that's what has provoked me before, not so much your opinions. But then again, I'm a sensitive guy, and I have learned to live with it, and I would actually like to apologize for giving you crap before.

Tracy C
09-01-2013, 10:49 AM
...and I would actually like to apologize for giving you crap before.

Thank you. Apology accepted.

I am never intentionally harsh unless it is in response to someone who is being an aggressive jerk with me. There are many members of this forum who do just that for the sole sake of being an aggressive jerk. When that happens, I will defend myself.

Tracy C
09-01-2013, 10:55 AM
Seems like the lighting in the last two pictures is different.

In research photos, it is vitally important to maintain consistency as much as humanly possible. When researching a hair loss remedy, this includes lighting, hair style and length, background and poses. If any of those things are different, it could be very difficult or impossible for anyone to be able to tell if any progress is being made.

I looked at his photos, there is too much different for me to be able to tell if any progress has been made. However, I would not expect any progress to be visible for at least four to six months anyways. So I am not surprised if I don't see any.

DesperateOne
09-01-2013, 11:04 AM
If the last two pictures in the album are the before pictures and the rest are after, then it definitely could look like you've gained some density. But with the quality of the photos, it's hard to tell really. Seems like the lighting in the last two pictures is different.

You're right, I took the last two photos in the bathroom and closer to the light, the rest are in my room, the light was on but I think the bathroom one has more power. Anyways, I will eventually take some in the bathroom with the same buzzed head when I need it. I am not going to go now just to prove a point, maybe like in 1 month and half more I will go again.

PayDay
09-01-2013, 11:05 AM
Tracy, let me first say I value your input too, and I actually agree with you in most cases, but I think you can be a little harsh too in the way you address people. I know that that's what has provoked me before, not so much your opinions. But then again, I'm a sensitive guy, and I have learned to live with it, and I would actually like to apologize for giving you crap before.

I've probably said this before, but I'm actually a fan of the way Tracy tries to inject some common sense into many of the threads on this forum. Her advise is usually excellent, even though I do not agree with some of what she says.

I know she got some crap in the past, but things seems to have gotten a lot less hostile here over the past few months and I'm really enjoying reading and participating on forum even more now.

I think Tracy might have some PTSD from being harassed in the past, but I have to agree that she has been acting inappropriately hostile and defensive lately.

I'm sure you're reading this Tracy so please take this for how it is meant, as I am a member who respects and appreciates you here. Please try to take the high road and stop being so hostile. If you have something to say, you are obviously intelligent enough to make your points without name calling or finger pointing. Two wrongs to not make a right and this type of behavior only lumps you into the say category as some of the people who used to be hostile towards you and you are too good for that.

DesperateOne
09-01-2013, 11:07 AM
In research photos, it is vitally important to maintain consistency as much as humanly possible. When researching a hair loss remedy, this includes lighting, hair style and length, background and poses. If any of those things are different, it could be very difficult or impossible for anyone to be able to tell if any progress is being made.

I looked at his photos, there is too much different for me to be able to tell if any progress has been made. However, I would not expect any progress to be visible for at least four to six months anyways. So I am not surprised if I don't see any.

You're right Tracy, my apologies. The ones on the bottom are taken directly under the light and the others I was sitting down and the light is not as powerful. I will get buzzed again in 2 months or so and I will try to take the photos as closely as possible to the first ones.

Tracy C
09-01-2013, 11:14 AM
I will get buzzed again in 2 months or so and I will try to take the photos as closely as possible to the first ones.

Actually, I like your hairstyle the way it is now. Why not just maintain that hair style from now on as you continue to participate in this trial?

Get someone to help you with photos. Use a good quality camera and do your best to keep the lighting and backgrounds consistent.

Tracy C
09-01-2013, 11:17 AM
I think Tracy might have some PTSD from being harassed in the past, but I have to agree that she has been acting inappropriately hostile and defensive lately.

I don't know if it is PTSD but I have been getting more aggressive with these guys as they have continued to get more aggressive with me. Maybe it is PTSD or maybe it's just a "When in Rome, do as the Romans do" kind of issue.

clandestine
09-01-2013, 11:19 AM
Tracy could you tell me again where to buy the saline solution? I've checked my local pharmacies and they don't carry.

Thanks.

PayDay
09-01-2013, 11:28 AM
I don't know if it is PTSD but I have been getting more aggressive with these guys as they have continued to get more aggressive with me. Maybe it is PTSD or maybe it's just a "When in Rome, do as the Romans do" kind of issue.

Well whatever it is, you're too good to stoop to their level. Take the high road.:)

Chromeo
09-01-2013, 11:49 AM
We definitely do not need everybody to stick to replicating the study. Enough of us are already doing that. Be thankful for the guys who are willing to try variations on the theme; regardless of whether their results are positive or negative, the information is useful. If they are willing to take risks to find out what works and what doesn't, we can only be thankful.

DesperateOne
09-01-2013, 11:55 AM
Actually, I like your hairstyle the way it is now. Why not just maintain that hair style from now on as you continue to participate in this trial?

Get someone to help you with photos. Use a good quality camera and do your best to keep the lighting and backgrounds consistent.

Okay, that sounds good to me, but I don't think I'm going to get anyone to help me with the photos, not the kind of thing I want to ask help for.

DesperateOne
09-01-2013, 12:00 PM
We definitely do not need everybody to stick to replicating the study. Enough of us are already doing that. Be thankful for the guys who are willing to try variations on the theme; regardless of whether their results are positive or negative, the information is useful. If they are willing to take risks to find out what works and what doesn't, we can only be thankful.

That is so true, they are taking risks and we should go faster thanks to them. Granted statistically speaking, there will be some horror stories like anything else. Some of the things being tried in addition to he study are very logical and should work better IMO. Personally, I would add more stuff if I had the money, I am unemployed and it is so nerve racking having to find a job looking like this, I sometimes feel like I have cancer and getting chemo therapy. Anyways, I will have no choice but to get a job so I can buy some of these products. On that note, anyone willing to help a NW brother in the LA area with a job? Haha, worth a try.

Tracy C
09-01-2013, 12:06 PM
We definitely do not need everybody to stick to replicating the study.

Of course not.




Enough of us are already doing that.

No there are not enough who are already doing that. This was not a full study. This was only a pilot study, so there needs to be many more participants spread out over a much wider area and the duration needs to be at least six months in order to verify the findings of that pilot study.

I want the results of this pilot study to be true. I want to see good quality proof that it is true. I want to see thousands of men and hundreds of women participating in the efforts to reproduce the results of this pilot study. I want to see good quality before and good quality 6-month after photos plastered all over the place. Then it is appropriate to move forward with experimenting to attempt to improve the results.

However, no one is required to do what is most appropriate. It is your scalp. Do what you want with it.

thinningTooSoon
09-01-2013, 02:15 PM
Did my first session tonight with a 1.5mm roller. It didn't feel like the needles were going all the way in but I did get some bleeding, has anyone else experienced this?

DesperateOne
09-01-2013, 02:47 PM
Okay so I have taken new pictures with the same light as before. I put the before which are only 3 that I have and the new ones. If anything, well I will just use the new ones as a reference point. New ones have more resolution.

Old 5/4 months as of today(pics are done right after derma rolling, that's why my scalp is red and maybe some blood):
http://imgur.com/a/kO2Pp

New:

back:
http://imgur.com/a/zsjgn

sides(This disease also has affected my sides, even worse :( ):
http://imgur.com/a/ygJsC

top view
http://imgur.com/a/5Fmdc

Conpecia
09-01-2013, 03:51 PM
dude, it LOOKS like you have pretty good regrowth but it's difficult to tell because of the resolution and the redness. but your hair definitely looks thicker in the second set. it's certainly not getting any worse, so that's good for being on something that many months. maintenance is a great thing in itself. i'd say this is pretty good news for you.

DesperateOne
09-01-2013, 04:01 PM
dude, it LOOKS like you have pretty good regrowth but it's difficult to tell because of the resolution and the redness. but your hair definitely looks thicker in the second set. it's certainly not getting any worse, so that's good for being on something that many months. maintenance is a great thing in itself. i'd say this is pretty good news for you.

Yes and I feel it thicker too, I had to bit the bullet and buzz it that short because I knew it would help the dermarolling and the application. But I think you're confused, it's not 4-5 months it's a month and 1 week, it was intended to be a fraction :) 5/4 .

Chromeo
09-01-2013, 05:31 PM
No there are not enough who are already doing that. This was not a full study. This was only a pilot study, so there needs to be many more participants spread out over a much wider area and the duration needs to be at least six months in order to verify the findings of that pilot study.

I want the results of this pilot study to be true. I want to see good quality proof that it is true. I want to see thousands of men and hundreds of women participating in the efforts to reproduce the results of this pilot study. I want to see good quality before and good quality 6-month after photos plastered all over the place. Then it is appropriate to move forward with experimenting to attempt to improve the results.

However, no one is required to do what is most appropriate. It is your scalp. Do what you want with it.

Good post. I stand corrected, I thought a lot of us were following the study to the T like I am. Hopefully there are at least a good number of us who are. I'm happy that there are other people going above and beyond. Who else is copying the study exactly? We need to get some numbers, here. I'm going into my 5th rolling session tonight with the 1.5mm needles. It's early days, but I have to say it really looks like it is working. I think those of us who shave our heads are the most likely to see the results, if we're taking pics. Far more difficult to tell if you're looking at a fairly full head of hair & just wanting it to be thicker.

I can clearly see that the hairs I have are coming through blacker and thicker in areas where the growth was pretty poor previously. PrettyFly83's pics are indicative of what this can do. It's slow progress but progress nonetheless. I'm sorry but people who are saying "That's just a shaven-down scalp compared to hair that is slightly grown in" are wrong. That is a bald scalp that is beginning to regrow thick, dark hairs. I am seeing it myself on my own scalp. I don't know how far we can go with this, but it does work.

Tracy C, I have read your posts before and I understand why you would feel a need to kick back against those who have kicked against you and verbally abused you along the way. I have to say I have the utmost respect for you and I welcome your contribution here every bit as much as I do every other person who posts here. I want this cure for you as much as I want it for every other male who posts on this board, maybe even a little bit more. Fingers crossed this is something that really works for us all.

Chromeo
09-01-2013, 06:48 PM
Just got done with rolling session #5. I've had a skinful of booze tonight, and anyone who says that stuff doesn't hurt is straight-up smoking crack.

KeepHoping
09-01-2013, 07:02 PM
Yes and I feel it thicker too, I had to bit the bullet and buzz it that short because I knew it would help the dermarolling and the application. But I think you're confused, it's not 4-5 months it's a month and 1 week, it was intended to be a fraction :) 5/4 .

I'm also a diffuse thinner with a bit of recession and I just did my second rolling session... Not sure if I'm doing it correctly though, I seem to be rolling for quite a bit of time and my scalp doesn't get as red as yours, it does get a bit read but not to the same extent. Can you tell me how you use the dermaroller DesperateOne?

DesperateOne
09-01-2013, 07:41 PM
I'm also a diffuse thinner with a bit of recession and I just did my second rolling session... Not sure if I'm doing it correctly though, I seem to be rolling for quite a bit of time and my scalp doesn't get as red as yours, it does get a bit read but not to the same extent. Can you tell me how you use the dermaroller DesperateOne?

Of course, we need to help each other as much as possible. First, let me just let you know that I am very sensitive, my skin gets red very fast regardless of derma rolling, for example, I tend to blush very easily, so don't feel discouraged because you don't see the same redness.

To your point, I will let you know how I do it and then try to back it up with my opinion why I think this is the best way.

Sun (Shower with nizoral or regenepure shampoo before the derma rolling. As some have pointed out, they reduce inflammation which may render the procedure less effective, that's why I use it at the very end, when the scalp is recovered.) I then go on to derma roll. (I will explain my technique bellow). No rogain this day.

Mon Rogain foam(2x a day, one morning, one at night) and about 15 mins of light absorption in my scalp and a vitamin D3 pill

Tues "

Wed "

Thur "

Fri "

Sat "

I have been also taking fin for the last 3 years, so 1.25mg a day. I would recommend that you use lipogaine rather than rogaine if you have the money, I just bough some and will be using it instead on some days, and then the regular foam and kirkland one more to reduce the cost.

Technique: I have essentially given up on the rolling technique the 2nd week. Like many have pointed out, it might now go all the way through. So now I take about an hour or more (because I have to do the entire scalp) and just go one press at a time until I hear the velcro sound and make sure it goes all the way in. I did it today, and I can tell you that it didn't get as red, yet it still hurt as hell and feel very sore. I also do a bit of regular rolling towards the end just to try and create some more trauma. Good luck.

KeepHoping
09-01-2013, 08:01 PM
Thanks for the detailed response man, ever considered a topical anesthetic like lidocaine? I'm wondering if that would effect the procedure at all...? Mine gets a little red but the redness subsides pretty quickly from what I can observe so I'm not sure if I'm actually doing it properly and I'm considering a topical anesthetic just to make it less of an awful ordeal hahahahah.

DesperateOne
09-01-2013, 08:05 PM
Thanks for the detailed response man, ever considered a topical anesthetic like lidocaine? I'm wondering if that would effect the procedure at all...? Mine gets a little red but the redness subsides pretty quickly from what I can observe so I'm not sure if I'm actually doing it properly and I'm considering a topical anesthetic just to make it less of an awful ordeal hahahahah.

lol I know it hurts like hell but I have seen in a few places that you should not use any of that because it may cause nerve damage. If you do then you need to consult a qualified dermatologist, to tell you the truth I doubt they will know.

doke
09-02-2013, 02:15 AM
how do you guys know if tracy is a woman as it maybe a man?

the_dude78
09-02-2013, 02:20 AM
how do you guys know if tracy is a woman as it maybe a man?

wat?


Why would we even care?

doke
09-02-2013, 02:26 AM
wat?


Why would we even care?

i asked because some are refering to tracy as she read back the posts?

Chromeo
09-02-2013, 02:43 AM
Tracy is a woman.

thinningTooSoon
09-02-2013, 03:11 AM
What is everyone using to clean the Dermarroller after a session, I ran it under a hot tap then soaked it in Dettol for 30 mins, is this enough?

doke
09-02-2013, 03:25 AM
ok thanks chromeo thats solved it.

hiilikeyourbeard
09-02-2013, 03:35 AM
is she hot?

clandestine
09-02-2013, 04:34 AM
Question;

How is everyone cleaning their derma roller to prevent the risk of infection? What about storing?

clandestine
09-02-2013, 04:42 AM
Nevermind; it appears this has already been answered, but I can in no way see or edit my posts.

Risk of Infection (http://www.truthinaging.com/review/beware-of-micro-needling)

Can you damage your skin? (http://www.futurederm.com/2012/06/04/can-you-damage-your-skin-with-microneedling/)

&&


1. Pressing too hard shouldnt matter in regards to side effects. We know that clinics as demonstrated in some of the youtube videos draw a LOT of blood.
2. Betadine, Isopropanol, Isopropyl should all be used to clean the roller. Some are boiling it hot water followed by the high concentration alcohols.

I store mine in a plastic enclose it came with and then inside the plastic tube container.



to clean it i pour betadine into a shot glass and let the roller sit in it for a few mins, I would think that would clean it pretty well...

gainspotter
09-02-2013, 05:27 AM
Anyone starting to have doubts?
Or are you all still optimistic?
I swear my hairs getting worse lately, could be because I'm due for a trim.
I just want this to work so bloody bad!

doke
09-02-2013, 07:13 AM
Some say that if you use a minox product like lipogain or spectral dnc you do not need to scalp roll as they are ment to penetrate the skin but with scalp roller may work even better.
Or what about using Dr Razack crinagen with minox instead its worth trying some of these products with the roller as they are more advanced than plain minoxidil.

DesperateOne
09-02-2013, 07:31 AM
Some say that if you use a minox product like lipogain or spectral dnc you do not need to scalp roll as they are ment to penetrate the skin but with scalp roller may work even better.
Or what about using Dr Razack crinagen with minox instead its worth trying some of these products with the roller as they are more advanced than plain minoxidil.


Have people even read the first page of the study? We don't care about how much better minox is being absorbed, what we are trying to achieve is neogenesis. When you wound the skin deep enough, the body will make a decision of whether to make new skin or a hair follicle, we're after hair of course. Adding minox encourages the body to take the follicle route, that's why we use it, not because of absorption. I still would think that lip ovations would be better if you can afford it, but the others should do fine.

PS: Tracy is a woman, she has called the show before and shared her story. Every place always needs a feminine touch, it's just a shame how hostile this place is. And lol to whoever asked if she was hot, she is very hot :) .

GreyGhost1864
09-02-2013, 07:44 AM
Sup fellas. Got my hair cut Sat. Same gal every time. She told me my hair was growing back in my crown. I have essential tremor in my hands so pics are not coming from me. I do have base line pics. Made by me when I was drunk. My hands do not shake when I am drunk. I quit drinking so my next hair cut I will have her take a pic. Been rolling my ring finger with my ex whore wifes name. Getting lighter every week. Things looking so good ..ghost

JDW
09-02-2013, 07:45 AM
Anyone starting to have doubts?
Or are you all still optimistic?
I swear my hairs getting worse lately, could be because I'm due for a trim.
I just want this to work so bloody bad!

Yes man, with you on wanting this to work, would be a great feeling to start to see an improvement.

I think stick at it for 12 weeks minimum as per the trial and then see what happens.

doke
09-02-2013, 08:14 AM
Have people even read the first page of the study? We don't care about how much better minox is being absorbed, what we are trying to achieve is neogenesis. When you wound the skin deep enough, the body will make a decision of whether to make new skin or a hair follicle, we're after hair of course. Adding minox encourages the body to take the follicle route, that's why we use it, not because of absorption. I still would think that lip ovations would be better if you can afford it, but the others should do fine.

PS: Tracy is a woman, she has called the show before and shared her story. Every place always needs a feminine touch, it's just a shame how hostile this place is. And lol to whoever asked if she was hot, she is very hot :) .

hi desperate is it dan the next word hahaha anyway the wounding study starting the thread uses minoxidil and whatever anyone says it still then needs a healing topical wheather its a growth factor or not as i have said before perhaps a product like renokin or dermaheal product to use with the roller but its what works for each individual perhaps osmotics fnc serum as it was used in the burn on scalp regrowth of hair in the damaged area.

Jcm800
09-02-2013, 08:19 AM
PS: Tracy is a woman, she has called the show before and shared her story. Every place always needs a feminine touch, it's just a shame how hostile this place is. And lol to whoever asked if she was hot, she is very hot :) .

Tracy tells it how it is, and is usually correct, no idea what she looks like - she's brave coming back tho, she takes some flak around here.

DesperateOne
09-02-2013, 08:41 AM
Everyone here is crazy as hell. I think hairloss attacks some part of the brain, that would explain so much.

Conpecia
09-02-2013, 08:54 AM
Yes and I feel it thicker too, I had to bit the bullet and buzz it that short because I knew it would help the dermarolling and the application. But I think you're confused, it's not 4-5 months it's a month and 1 week, it was intended to be a fraction :) 5/4 .

ah ok, never seen it put that way lol. in that case it def looks to be working pretty quick. gonna do my third rolling session tonight, hopefully i'll start seeing something in a few weeks...

doke
09-02-2013, 09:19 AM
hi jc ive never had a problem with tracy its not good to have any trolls out to cause trouble but we do sometimes take things the wrong way as its easy to post something and then regret it.
But we are all in this i hope to help in this affliction,im not sure but the bald truth was a better forum for not getting bullying as some the trolls are out of control did the forum not have a mod until winston came along?

DesperateOne
09-02-2013, 09:25 AM
hi jc ive never had a problem with tracy its not good to have any trolls out to cause trouble but we do sometimes take things the wrong way as its easy to post something and then regret it.
But we are all in this i hope to help in this affliction,im not sure but the bald truth was a better forum for not getting bullying as some the trolls are out of control did the forum not have a mod until winston came along?

Doke I have seen you troll around in this forum plenty. You seem to have a problem with certain people including Tracy. Something tells me you are working for Merk and you want propecia to stay active, who knows maybe you're Joe from Staten Island and you want to keep the cure for yourself.

Tracy C
09-02-2013, 09:27 AM
Tracy could you tell me again where to buy the saline solution? I've checked my local pharmacies and they don't carry.

Thanks.

Really? I just buy it at my local pharmacy. Try going up to the counter and ask for help finding it.




I would recommend that you use lipogaine rather than rogaine if you have the money...

There is no meaningful or significant benefit to using Lipogaine or DNC over Rogaine. The active ingredient is what matters and it is the same for each. The benefits of the "extra stuff" in Lipogaine or DNC are unproven and questionable at best.




how do you guys know if tracy is a woman as it maybe a man?

Some of these guys have heard me call in to the live show. I am a woman suffering with FPB.




What is everyone using to clean the Dermarroller after a session...

I still have not received my roller but I read the cleaning instructions which say to clean it with alcohol. The roller I ordered comes with a case to store it in.




is she hot?

I get hit on a lot so maybe.




Anyone starting to have doubts?
Or are you all still optimistic?

It is too soon to tell. For those who are following the protocol of the pilot study, I would not expect any improvement to become visible for at least four to six months. For those who are doing their own thing, we just don't know because there is no established baseline.




Have people even read the first page of the study? We don't care about how much better minox is being absorbed, what we are trying to achieve is neogenesis.

Correct. Absorption is not a factor in the results of the pilot study.




Sup fellas. Got my hair cut Sat. Same gal every time. She told me my hair was growing back in my crown.

That is awesome!!! I am so happy for you - and hopeful for everyone else. :)




Tracy tells it how it is, and is usually correct, no idea what she looks like - she's brave coming back tho, she takes some flak around here.

Thank you. :)

Telling it like it is is exactly why some members hate me. I know it, Spencer knows it and the mods know it. That's why they give me so much breathing room.

greatjob!
09-02-2013, 10:09 AM
Something tells me you are working for Merk and you want propecia to stay active

Really?? I seriously hope you're joking

gainspotter
09-02-2013, 12:08 PM
Really? I just buy it at my local pharmacy. Try going up to the counter and ask for help finding it.





There is no meaningful or significant benefit to using Lipogaine or DNC over Rogaine. The active ingredient is what matters and it is the same for each. The benefits of the "extra stuff" in Lipogaine or DNC are unproven and questionable at best.





Some of these guys have heard me call in to the live show. I am a woman suffering with FPB.





I still have not received my roller but I read the cleaning instructions which say to clean it with alcohol. The roller I ordered comes with a case to store it in.

Any suggestions as to what to clean with if alcohol can't be obtained? I've been rolling it over a hygiene wipe but don't think that will cut the mustard



I get hit on a lot so maybe.





It is too soon to tell. For those who are following the protocol of the pilot study, I would not expect any improvement to become visible for at least four to six months. For those who are doing their own thing, we just don't know because there is no established baseline.

Fair enough, I'm just being impatient.



Correct. Absorption is not a factor in the results of the pilot study.





That is awesome!!! I am so happy for you - and hopeful for everyone else. :)





Thank you. :)

Telling it like it is is exactly why some members hate me. I know it, Spencer knows it and the mods know it. That's why they give me so much breathing room.

I am new to this forum so don't know the full picture. Ill stay out of it. We should all stick together on this one.

DesperateOne
09-02-2013, 12:33 PM
I am new to this forum so don't know the full picture. Ill stay out of it. We should all stick together on this one.

That's a good idea that you're staying away from this, senior members will eat you alive in this forum and then drink your blood for dessert

the_dude78
09-02-2013, 01:07 PM
I'm having my 4th session tomorrow and I actually feel my hair is looking a little worse than it did a month ago. Haven't really noticed more shedding than usual and hopefully it's just my imagination.

KeepHoping
09-02-2013, 01:07 PM
Last question Desperate One and thank you in advance for what you bring to the table here, I definitely appreciate the input. What roller are you using?

DesperateOne
09-02-2013, 02:27 PM
Last question Desperate One and thank you in advance for what you bring to the table here, I definitely appreciate the input. What roller are you using?

This is the one I am using right now.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004ATTGSY/ref=oh_details_o05_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1

GreyGhost1864
09-02-2013, 04:06 PM
Guys do not be stupid. Rolling will cut many hairs in half. Many at scalp level. I lose at least 100 hairs during rolling and I am a Norwood 6. Man up 6 months from now it will be so much better. I love promox! Love the 10% spray in the morning it dries fast. The 15% lotion is definitely a nighttime gig. Cheers
Ghost:D

DesperateOne
09-02-2013, 05:58 PM
Guys do not be stupid. Rolling will cut many hairs in half. Many at scalp level. I lose at least 100 hairs during rolling and I am a Norwood 6. Man up 6 months from now it will be so much better. I love promox! Love the 10% spray in the morning it dries fast. The 15% lotion is definitely a nighttime gig. Cheers
Ghost:D


And you based this statement on what exactly

Conpecia
09-02-2013, 09:08 PM
just had my 3rd session. gotta man up indeed, shit doesn't feel particularly pleasant.

also finally got minox liquid in, gonna jump from foam to liquid for better absorption (although i'm still not applying until 24 hrs after rolling, in line with the study).

was definitely bleeding this time, made sure to go all the way in and all around the hairline. i'm hoping i'll get results from my regimen, can't think of any stronger hairloss regimen right now, and it's nice having dermarolling as the least proven method in my arsenal...

john2399
09-02-2013, 09:20 PM
just had my 3rd session. gotta man up indeed, shit doesn't feel particularly pleasant.

also finally got minox liquid in, gonna jump from foam to liquid for better absorption (although i'm still not applying until 24 hrs after rolling, in line with the study).

was definitely bleeding this time, made sure to go all the way in and all around the hairline. i'm hoping i'll get results from my regimen, can't think of any stronger hairloss regimen right now, and it's nice having dermarolling as the least proven method in my arsenal...

in other words, it hurts like a bitch ikno lol

DesperateOne
09-02-2013, 09:36 PM
just had my 3rd session. gotta man up indeed, shit doesn't feel particularly pleasant.

also finally got minox liquid in, gonna jump from foam to liquid for better absorption (although i'm still not applying until 24 hrs after rolling, in line with the study).

was definitely bleeding this time, made sure to go all the way in and all around the hairline. i'm hoping i'll get results from my regimen, can't think of any stronger hairloss regimen right now, and it's nice having dermarolling as the least proven method in my arsenal...

Yeah, that shit is no fun, I just want to quit halfway most of the time.
When do you plan to post pictures?

luca10
09-02-2013, 09:47 PM
I think I see regeneration

TO YOUNG TO RETIRE
09-02-2013, 10:21 PM
could you please take some pics and give us some info
thank you
-john
I think I see regeneration

HARIRI
09-02-2013, 10:56 PM
I'm using the 0.5mm once a week and find it painful while you guys are using 1.5mm!!! I tolarated a strip procedure and a chest BHT into scar surgery but NOT this. I guess Im a P***y when it comes to dermarolling lol

thinningTooSoon
09-03-2013, 03:31 AM
I started on Sunday am using 1.5mm roller, painful but lets hope it's worth it, I have taken pictures and will upload if I get improvements to show you all.

Quick question, how often do you wash your hair? I ask because I am wondering if the scabbing over is part of the wound healing process and would washing the hair interrupt this process?

doke
09-03-2013, 04:26 AM
Doke I have seen you troll around in this forum plenty. You seem to have a problem with certain people including Tracy. Something tells me you are working for Merk and you want propecia to stay active, who knows maybe you're Joe from Staten Island and you want to keep the cure for yourself.

nope get angry with some who think they own the forum and there own threads but as many may know me at other forums im no troll and as for propecia i do not indorse it as i use avodart due to my health.
I have said it maybe best for younger guys to start with propecia combined with minox but thats what every hair loss adviser with any inteligence says at this time and i agree with them although we know some are trialing bimatoprost as it may work better than minox but its too pricey if you want to use 1ml a day.

Hicks
09-03-2013, 05:24 AM
Quick question, how often do you wash your hair? I ask because I am wondering if the scabbing over is part of the wound healing process and would washing the hair interrupt this process?

I shower and shampoo then derma roller. After dermaroll I rinse my hair with water, let hair dry and use warm liquid coconut oil.

I wash my hair everyday and use a conditioner. I use nizoral 1% 3 times a week. mon wed fri

Hope this helps. Everyones body will react differnt. Listen to your body.

I am using Bio-oil on some days after I apply liquad minoxal.

NotDyingBald
09-03-2013, 07:28 AM
Since Nizoral is used for skin infections in scalp, would it be good idea to use it in the day we dermaroll as a way to prevent some infection caused by it? Would this affect somehow the replication of the study? I mean same way as some of us use dettol to clean the dermaroller, we could use nizoral to "clean" the scalp?

Edit: I mean using Nizoral in the shower before dermarolling

clandestine
09-03-2013, 07:45 AM
Since Nizoral is used for skin infections in scalp, would it be good idea to use it in the day we dermaroll as a way to prevent some infection caused by it? Would this affect somehow the replication of the study? I mean same way as some of us use dettol to clean the dermaroller, we could use nizoral to "clean" the scalp?

Edit: I mean using Nizoral in the shower before dermarolling

Saline, betadine and a clean derma roller, as per the study.

Conpecia
09-03-2013, 08:33 AM
after you guys roll what do you do? i shower off because there is some blood on my scalp but i don't apply anything, should i do so?

head is sore today from rolling yesterday. will apply minox liquid tonight thoroughly.

Conpecia
09-03-2013, 08:36 AM
Yeah, that shit is no fun, I just want to quit halfway most of the time.
When do you plan to post pictures?

hey desperate, i'm going to post pics after about 12 weeks unless i see some serious regrowth earlier.

remember, i'm also on dutasteride and regenepure, so i'm sure that stuff will help me but it may skew my dermarolling results. if i happen to get regrowth in the hairline i'll attribute more of that to rolling, but crown should be filled in by dutasteride and regenepure i think.

DesperateOne
09-03-2013, 09:26 AM
nope get angry with some who think they own the forum and there own threads but as many may know me at other forums im no troll and as for propecia i do not indorse it as i use avodart due to my health.
I have said it maybe best for younger guys to start with propecia combined with minox but thats what every hair loss adviser with any inteligence says at this time and i agree with them although we know some are trialing bimatoprost as it may work better than minox but its too pricey if you want to use 1ml a day.

Haha, I was just messing with you, nothing serious.

DesperateOne
09-03-2013, 09:31 AM
I started on Sunday am using 1.5mm roller, painful but lets hope it's worth it, I have taken pictures and will upload if I get improvements to show you all.

Quick question, how often do you wash your hair? I ask because I am wondering if the scabbing over is part of the wound healing process and would washing the hair interrupt this process?

You and everyone should post their pictures and results regardless of regrowth. We need info good or bad in order to perfect the technique. Since my hair was essentially shit, I now shower every other day, so I won't lose that many hairs in the shower. However, that is a good point, I don't know if that helped me or hurt me in any way.

DesperateOne
09-03-2013, 09:33 AM
Since Nizoral is used for skin infections in scalp, would it be good idea to use it in the day we dermaroll as a way to prevent some infection caused by it? Would this affect somehow the replication of the study? I mean same way as some of us use dettol to clean the dermaroller, we could use nizoral to "clean" the scalp?

Edit: I mean using Nizoral in the shower before dermarolling

I use it that way, nizoral once a day, the day of the rolling before I roll.

35YrsAfter
09-03-2013, 11:20 AM
An article (http://owndoc.com/dermarolling/dermarolling-microneedling-hype-realistic-results/) on the general non-hair related benefits of micro needling.

35YrsAfter also posts as CITNews and works at Dr. Cole's office

Conpecia
09-03-2013, 11:46 AM
An article (http://owndoc.com/dermarolling/dermarolling-microneedling-hype-realistic-results/) on the general non-hair related benefits of micro needling.

Is it possible that beginning derma rolling at an early age (20s) will maintain young skin better than doing so after most of the collagen is depleted in our 50s and 60s?

TO YOUNG TO RETIRE
09-03-2013, 11:47 AM
guys any results?

hellouser
09-03-2013, 11:59 AM
guys any results?

Still none for me! I've been shedding pretty much constantly for the last two months.

I should report though, that with the level of dermarolling I've been doing, mainly harsh 'semi-wounding' which has caused some bleeding similarly to the effect of one of the youtube videos posted with the woman going across the guys face, I've been experiencing a massive SKIN shed. The wounds have been drastic enough that light scabs have appeared on my scalp which are breaking off in large chunks and look pretty damn gross. At the same time, I'm on Minoxidil twice a day on days where I dont dermaroll as well as being on CB between 1%-2% per day at 1ml of which for 4 days I used 0.9ml of PG and 0.1ml of Oleyl as the vehicle for CB.

Now, my scalp was itching like fcking crazy while using oleyl, and it increased the amount of shedding by the 4th day. It was also burning my scalp but I don't know how much damage it really did.

In any case, after the 4th day of oleyl I used the dermaroller more vigorously than ever and a couple days later I noticed a pretty bad shed, here's how it looks:

http://i1120.photobucket.com/albums/l490/hellouser/2013-09-01-hair-shed.jpg

Thats after brushing my hair with my hands for about 1 minute. Insane huh?

Tough to say if thats from dermarolling, or from oleyl or from minox twice a day. I suspect its probably a combination of things but mostly at the hands of Oleyl.

Tracy C
09-03-2013, 12:19 PM
Since Nizoral is used for skin infections in scalp, would it be good idea to use it in the day we dermaroll as a way to prevent some infection caused by it?

Washing your hair with Nizoral once a week is good idea if you are treating hair loss. I doubt that dermarolling makes any difference good or bad, adding Nizoral to your regimen is just a good idea.




after you guys roll what do you do?

Still waiting for my roller but I plan to clean the area with betadine and apply a very thin layer of Neosporin over the area.




guys any results?

It's too soon. For those who are following the protocol of the pilot study, I would not expect cosmetically significant results for at least four to six months. For those who are doing their own thing, who knows?

DesperateOne
09-03-2013, 12:28 PM
Still none for me! I've been shedding pretty much constantly for the last two months.

I should report though, that with the level of dermarolling I've been doing, mainly harsh 'semi-wounding' which has caused some bleeding similarly to the effect of one of the youtube videos posted with the woman going across the guys face, I've been experiencing a massive SKIN shed. The wounds have been drastic enough that light scabs have appeared on my scalp which are breaking off in large chunks and look pretty damn gross. At the same time, I'm on Minoxidil twice a day on days where I dont dermaroll as well as being on CB between 1%-2% per day at 1ml of which for 4 days I used 0.9ml of PG and 0.1ml of Oleyl as the vehicle for CB.

Now, my scalp was itching like fcking crazy while using oleyl, and it increased the amount of shedding by the 4th day. It was also burning my scalp but I don't know how much damage it really did.

In any case, after the 4th day of oleyl I used the dermaroller more vigorously than ever and a couple days later I noticed a pretty bad shed, here's how it looks:

http://i1120.photobucket.com/albums/l490/hellouser/2013-09-01-hair-shed.jpg

Thats after brushing my hair with my hands for about 1 minute. Insane huh?

Tough to say if thats from dermarolling, or from oleyl or from minox twice a day. I suspect its probably a combination of things but mostly at the hands of Oleyl.

So that's the new hair you grew or the only hair you have left do to shedding? You might be trying to much shit at a time.

hellouser
09-03-2013, 12:35 PM
So that's the new hair you grew or the only hair you have left do to shedding? You might be trying to much shit at a time.

A lot of those hairs are finer/thinner hairs but some are also thicker terminal hairs. My hair cycles a lot though, I've lost and gained a lot of density since starting Minoxidil.

I'm really not on much though, only CB and Minox. oleyl/pg was just the vehicle for CB but I do know that another member on another forum tried oleyl/pg as well and said he was experiencing incredible shedding on it too, which my experience would only confirm that causes that. I also had the same side effects from it too; burning scalp, intense itching.

I've since dropped oleyl and am back on ethanol/pg to use for CB. Itching is GONE, scalp no longer burns and shedding during showers has decreased already. Now I just need to monitor shedding through out the day. So far, it has decreased but I'll know better in the coming weeks/months.

Knockin on NW4
09-03-2013, 12:56 PM
U think the shed is because u are transitionning from RU to CB? how long were u off RU before starting CB? its cant be from rolling. Has to be from the transition and perhaps oleyl irritation

clandestine
09-03-2013, 01:38 PM
hell are you using eth(70)/PG(30) vehicle for CB?

DesperateOne
09-03-2013, 01:47 PM
A lot of those hairs are finer/thinner hairs but some are also thicker terminal hairs. My hair cycles a lot though, I've lost and gained a lot of density since starting Minoxidil.

I'm really not on much though, only CB and Minox. oleyl/pg was just the vehicle for CB but I do know that another member on another forum tried oleyl/pg as well and said he was experiencing incredible shedding on it too, which my experience would only confirm that causes that. I also had the same side effects from it too; burning scalp, intense itching.

I've since dropped oleyl and am back on ethanol/pg to use for CB. Itching is GONE, scalp no longer burns and shedding during showers has decreased already. Now I just need to monitor shedding through out the day. So far, it has decreased but I'll know better in the coming weeks/months.

lol well, I guess ethanol/pg will be better to start with. Did you think that oleyl/pg was going to be better for some reason?

Man that is a lot of hairs you lose, and that's not counting the ones you missed. I remember grabbing my hair and pulling a little would grab some hairs, but not that many. Is most of your hair brittle? or are they usually pretty thick.

GreyGhost1864
09-03-2013, 05:39 PM
Guys....just a few of here are nw5 or greater. You Norwood 1.5 and 2's think you can go to your juvenile hairline. So stupid. A mature Norwood 3 hairline is perfect. So you youngsters keep what you got and you will do just fine. No woman wants to sleep with a little boys hairline. Just my thoughts.
Ghost

Hicks
09-03-2013, 06:47 PM
Guys....just a few of here are nw5 or greater. You Norwood 1.5 and 2's think you can go to your juvenile hairline. So stupid. A mature Norwood 3 hairline is perfect. So you youngsters keep what you got and you will do just fine. No woman wants to sleep with a little boys hairline. Just my thoughts.
Ghost

Do you drink a lot?

Your posts are funny

DesperateOne
09-03-2013, 07:03 PM
Do you drink a lot?

Your posts are funny

Yeah I think he does drink, or maybe it's just meth. At any rate, everyone wants better relative to their situation, to him a nw3 would be awesome.

I am now questioning the value of coming to the forum so often.

Thinning87
09-03-2013, 08:12 PM
Still none for me! I've been shedding pretty much constantly for the last two months.

I should report though, that with the level of dermarolling I've been doing, mainly harsh 'semi-wounding' which has caused some bleeding similarly to the effect of one of the youtube videos posted with the woman going across the guys face, I've been experiencing a massive SKIN shed. The wounds have been drastic enough that light scabs have appeared on my scalp which are breaking off in large chunks and look pretty damn gross. At the same time, I'm on Minoxidil twice a day on days where I dont dermaroll as well as being on CB between 1%-2% per day at 1ml of which for 4 days I used 0.9ml of PG and 0.1ml of Oleyl as the vehicle for CB.

Now, my scalp was itching like fcking crazy while using oleyl, and it increased the amount of shedding by the 4th day. It was also burning my scalp but I don't know how much damage it really did.

In any case, after the 4th day of oleyl I used the dermaroller more vigorously than ever and a couple days later I noticed a pretty bad shed, here's how it looks:

http://i1120.photobucket.com/albums/l490/hellouser/2013-09-01-hair-shed.jpg

Thats after brushing my hair with my hands for about 1 minute. Insane huh?

Tough to say if thats from dermarolling, or from oleyl or from minox twice a day. I suspect its probably a combination of things but mostly at the hands of Oleyl.

I don't think this is bad. Shedding is a sign of hair growth cycle regulation as you know. I wonder if the wounding and therefore the production of new follicles in the new skin might explain them shedding.

hellouser
09-03-2013, 08:15 PM
I don't think this is bad. Shedding is a sign of hair growth cycle regulation as you know. I wonder if the wounding and therefore the production of new follicles in the new skin might explain them shedding.

No clue, but I'm almost certain it was/is the Oleyl. That shit burns itches irritates the scalp like crazy after repeated use. With the massive shed, I'm expecting massive results.

StayThick
09-03-2013, 08:27 PM
Still none for me! I've been shedding pretty much constantly for the last two months.

I should report though, that with the level of dermarolling I've been doing, mainly harsh 'semi-wounding' which has caused some bleeding similarly to the effect of one of the youtube videos posted with the woman going across the guys face, I've been experiencing a massive SKIN shed. The wounds have been drastic enough that light scabs have appeared on my scalp which are breaking off in large chunks and look pretty damn gross. At the same time, I'm on Minoxidil twice a day on days where I dont dermaroll as well as being on CB between 1%-2% per day at 1ml of which for 4 days I used 0.9ml of PG and 0.1ml of Oleyl as the vehicle for CB.

Now, my scalp was itching like fcking crazy while using oleyl, and it increased the amount of shedding by the 4th day. It was also burning my scalp but I don't know how much damage it really did.

In any case, after the 4th day of oleyl I used the dermaroller more vigorously than ever and a couple days later I noticed a pretty bad shed, here's how it looks:

http://i1120.photobucket.com/albums/l490/hellouser/2013-09-01-hair-shed.jpg

Thats after brushing my hair with my hands for about 1 minute. Insane huh?

Tough to say if thats from dermarolling, or from oleyl or from minox twice a day. I suspect its probably a combination of things but mostly at the hands of Oleyl.

Not going to lie. That right there would scare the hell out of me. Hell is that a typical shed because in my opinion that is extremely excessive. I have never shed like that. Sweet god.

Not sure if a shed like that means regrowth, but man....this sucks. If your hair is shedding like that considering all the treatments you're on, then I feel there is no hope. Wish you the best though. I sincerely hope that is a positive sign of what's to come.

StayThick
09-03-2013, 08:31 PM
Guys....just a few of here are nw5 or greater. You Norwood 1.5 and 2's think you can go to your juvenile hairline. So stupid. A mature Norwood 3 hairline is perfect. So you youngsters keep what you got and you will do just fine. No woman wants to sleep with a little boys hairline. Just my thoughts.
Ghost

I'd gladly take a juvenile hairline and give everyone the finger in this forum and never shine my grace on here again..problem is, that will NEVER happen. It's not in my genetic makeup. It's one of the few things God did not bless me with...it just wasn't in my cards to have great hair all my life.

hellouser
09-03-2013, 08:37 PM
Not going to lie. That right there would scare the hell out of me. Hell is that a typical shed because in my opinion that is extremely excessive. I have never shed like that. Sweet god.

Not sure if a shed like that means regrowth, but man....this sucks. If your hair is shedding like that considering all the treatments you're on, then I feel there is no hope. Wish you the best though. I sincerely hope that is a positive sign of what's to come.

I'm only on CB and Minox. Nothing more dude, so I wouldnt say there isn't hope.

I had terrible shedding earlier this year in January/February as well. I had good density after RU usage for a few months, however, I wish I had stuck to the regimen. To me, it seems like I could have increased density EVEN MORE, similarly to IrishPride's case, that guy has been consistent as hell with his RU/FIN + Minox regimen. Dude went from 'OK' density to more or less FULL restoration.

The coming months with my CB usage will be pretty telling though... I'm not worried too much, all of what I've lost should grow back in due time.

DesperateOne
09-03-2013, 11:44 PM
I'm only on CB and Minox. Nothing more dude, so I wouldnt say there isn't hope.

I had terrible shedding earlier this year in January/February as well. I had good density after RU usage for a few months, however, I wish I had stuck to the regimen. To me, it seems like I could have increased density EVEN MORE, similarly to IrishPride's case, that guy has been consistent as hell with his RU/FIN + Minox regimen. Dude went from 'OK' density to more or less FULL restoration.

The coming months with my CB usage will be pretty telling though... I'm not worried too much, all of what I've lost should grow back in due time.

That's more of wishful thinking considering we don't even know if that CB will work in the first place, also if you lose hair to RU, I don't know if those will grow back either. I have found that once you find something that works you should stay with it, and if something new comes out, then it should just be added not the other similar product discarded, IMO. I know how depressing it can be so I can only wish you the best of luck as it will open more members to trying CB if yours works, good luck.

brunobald
09-05-2013, 01:23 AM
http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/football-rooney-posts-picture-head-injury-165944935.html

Looks like Rooney is jumping on the wounding theory bandwagon. :)

gainspotter
09-05-2013, 04:14 AM
http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/football-rooney-posts-picture-head-injury-165944935.html

Looks like Rooney is jumping on the wounding theory bandwagon. :)

LOL he must have used the 10mm roller.

vanityhair
09-05-2013, 04:48 AM
Not seeing anything notable over here at 6 weeks. Darn it.

Do we know whether the baldies in the pilot study were already on Minoxidil prior to starting dermarolling, or if they started both treatments at the same time?

Julian P
09-05-2013, 06:26 AM
Do we know whether the baldies in the pilot study were already on Minoxidil prior to starting dermarolling, or if they started both treatments at the same time?

That shouldn't matter because there is a control group that uses only minoxidil, and that group had significantly less resultst than the dermarolling + minox group. Anyhow, it looks like they all started using minox at the beginning of the study, but I'm not sure.

dodgePT
09-05-2013, 06:38 AM
Not seeing anything notable over here at 6 weeks. Darn it.

Do we know whether the baldies in the pilot study were already on Minoxidil prior to starting dermarolling, or if they started both treatments at the same time?

The study clearly states there were some subjects already on finasteride/minoxidil before the study:


A total of 94 patients, 20 had been treated with Finasteride and Minoxidil in the past for 6 months to 1 year duration and had reported no improvement, of which twelve were randomized to the Microneedling group and eight to the Minoxidil group.

Julian P
09-05-2013, 06:56 AM
The study clearly states there were some subjects already on finasteride/minoxidil before the study:



Whoops, caught me in my laziness there.

DesperateOne
09-05-2013, 11:54 AM
Do you guys think adding Cet and Mico would help with this? I think if we add Cet on the 4th day it would be ideal and Mico the same days as minox, what do you'd think

Conpecia
09-05-2013, 12:50 PM
The study clearly states there were some subjects already on finasteride/minoxidil before the study:


A total of 94 patients, 20 had been treated with Finasteride and Minoxidil in the past for 6 months to 1 year duration and had reported no improvement, of which twelve were randomized to the Microneedling group and eight to the Minoxidil group.

No exactly clear in my opinion. The way it's phrased doesn't tell us if they were STILL on fin and minox when they started microneedling. Either way, it says they had no improvement prior to microneedling so it's not like it gave them much of an advantage, that's the key.

Conpecia
09-05-2013, 12:51 PM
I feel like this is a make or break month for a whole bunch of guys around here. If results don't start popping up in at least a few members we could be in for another miserable autumn.

DesperateOne
09-05-2013, 01:00 PM
I feel like this is a make or break month for a whole bunch of guys around here. If results don't start popping up in at least a few members we could be in for another miserable autumn.

That's true, it sucks but we have to accept. I have no doubt that it made my hair way thicker, I can feel the hair being so much healthier, so I know it works for that for sure. I just ordered some Cet, I know the study is important but I can't continue with it to the T anymore, I need to expand my horizons now. I think Cet will give peach hair and then with the derma rolling it might be enough to turn them terminal.

hellouser
09-05-2013, 01:55 PM
I feel like this is a make or break month for a whole bunch of guys around here. If results don't start popping up in at least a few members we could be in for another miserable autumn.

I had a miserable summer. I'm looking forward to a miserable autumn.

Tracy C
09-05-2013, 02:14 PM
Not seeing anything notable over here at 6 weeks. Darn it.

Try setting your expectations to something more realistic. I would not expect to be able to see any improvement until at least four to six months - more likely six months than four. To expect to be able to see any results in less than four months is not realistic at all.

DesperateOne
09-05-2013, 02:32 PM
Try setting your expectations to something more realistic. I would not expect to be able to see any improvement until at least four to six months - more likely six months than four. To expect to be able to see any results in less than four months is not realistic at all.

I thought you were going to stay away because people were beign aggressive towards you. I guess you had a change of heart :)

gainspotter
09-05-2013, 03:10 PM
Try setting your expectations to something more realistic. I would not expect to be able to see any improvement until at least four to six months - more likely six months than four. To expect to be able to see any results in less than four months is not realistic at all.

I hope so.

Tracy C
09-05-2013, 09:41 PM
I thought you were going to stay away because people were beign aggressive towards you.

I am staying away from several threads that are thoroughly infested with fools who desperately need someone to slap some sense into them. If you follow those threads, you will easily find that the most aggressive members are the biggest fools. I no longer have any patience for them. I will call them fools and idiots because those words very accurately describe those people. If I get banned for doing so, so be it. I simply don't care anymore.

This thread however is about a treatment that I feel might have some merit. I am disappointed that there are not enough people trying to duplicate the results of the pilot study - but something is better than nothing. Anyways, these guys who expect to see results in a matter of weeks are not being realistic and obviously do not understand how hair cycles work. They also do not understand that there is a difference between "statistically significant" and "cosmetically significant". Results that may be "statistically significant" may happen within the time frame reported in the pilot study, but "cosmetically significant" results will take a lot longer.

hairandthere
09-05-2013, 10:17 PM
Just wanted to throw it out there that I'm also trialing dermarolling with a 1.5mm roller after having seen the recent study reports, even if the claimed density results seemed literally unbelievable. I have to add that I'm not interested in replicating the study.

I would classify myself as somewhere between NW3 and NW4. I first started 1mg finasteride a little less than a decade ago and was on it almost 2 years. Looking back, I think it did wonders in regrowing from NW2 to NW1 over 16 months and then maintaining. I was feeling like my nipples were getting softer and bigger and was getting iffy about messing with my hormones so I dropped it. I then used minox for a year until I got a serious girlfriend and quit everything altogether. A few years back I got serious about it again for 6 months and tried daily RU and Dutasteride twice a week, both for the first time.

I ended up moving out of my home country for a while and it became difficult to obtain these kinds of products so I waited until I recently returned. So a few months ago, I decided to throw the kitchen sink at it in a last ditch attempt to miraculously recover to perhaps NW2 level? I was a good responder before so I'm hoping it's not too late and I can still reverse the damage that happened the last couple of years. I'm committing to a solid year of the following regimen to see if this is possible:



I use the 1.5mm dermaroller every 4-6 days (usually the day I buzz down with either no-guard or the lowest guard) until i get little specs of blood over the whole horseshoe area, which I then wash off and then immediately apply Polaris NR-10 16% minox. I use this minox twice daily, dermarolling or not.

The rest of my regimen: .5mg propecia every day, 60-70mg RU from Kane over whole horsehoe area three times a day (~200mg total daily), 2% nizoral 1-2 times a week. Start times:

RU since June 2013
Fin since mid July 2013, took 2mg first day, 1mg second day, .5mg since
Kirkland Minoxidil 5% foam June-July 2013
Polaris NR-10 16% Minoxidil since August 2013
Dermaroller since end July 2013
2% Nizoral since February 2013


I'll likely add CB in next once a good vehicle is found. I've actually ordered 2 pcs of the Iron Dragon version to see what they have to offer.

Sorry, I don't like taking, much less posting pics, and even much less looking at the situation too much as the less I think about it the better. I just try to integrate the regimen as seamlessly into the daily routine and move-on knowing that I'm already doing as much as possible :)

Should something miraculous happen, I'm sure I could find some pics showing the difference, which could then be endlessly scrutinized for legitimacy!

DesperateOne
09-05-2013, 10:32 PM
Just wanted to throw it out there that I'm also trialing dermarolling with a 1.5mm roller after having seen the recent study reports, even if the claimed density results seemed literally unbelievable. I have to add that I'm not interested in replicating the study.

I would classify myself as somewhere between NW3 and NW4. I first started 1mg finasteride a little less than a decade ago and was on it almost 2 years. Looking back, I think it did wonders in regrowing from NW2 to NW1 over 16 months and then maintaining. I was feeling like my nipples were getting softer and bigger and was getting iffy about messing with my hormones so I dropped it. I then used minox for a year until I got a serious girlfriend and quit everything altogether. A few years back I got serious about it again for 6 months and tried daily RU and Dutasteride twice a week, both for the first time.

I ended up moving out of my home country for a while and it became difficult to obtain these kinds of products so I waited until I recently returned. So a few months ago, I decided to throw the kitchen sink at it in a last ditch attempt to miraculously recover to perhaps NW2 level? I was a good responder before so I'm hoping it's not too late and I can still reverse the damage that happened the last couple of years. I'm committing to a solid year of the following regimen to see if this is possible:



I use the 1.5mm dermaroller every 4-6 days (usually the day I buzz down with either no-guard or the lowest guard) until i get little specs of blood over the whole horseshoe area, which I then wash off and then immediately apply Polaris NR-10 16% minox. I use this minox twice daily, dermarolling or not.

The rest of my regimen: .5mg propecia every day, 60-70mg RU from Kane over whole horsehoe area three times a day (~200mg total daily), 2% nizoral 1-2 times a week. Start times:

RU since June 2013
Fin since mid July 2013, took 2mg first day, 1mg second day, .5mg since
Kirkland Minoxidil 5% foam June-July 2013
Polaris NR-10 16% Minoxidil since August 2013
Dermaroller since end July 2013
2% Nizoral since February 2013


I'll likely add CB in next once a good vehicle is found. I've actually ordered 2 pcs of the Iron Dragon version to see what they have to offer.

Sorry, I don't like taking, much less posting pics, and even much less looking at the situation too much as the less I think about it the better. I just try to integrate the regimen as seamlessly into the daily routine and move-on knowing that I'm already doing as much as possible :)

Should something miraculous happen, I'm sure I could find some pics showing the difference, which could then be endlessly scrutinized for legitimacy!

16% minox after derma rolling? Holly crap, watch out man, you might get heart problems. Well it looks like you have a lot of stuff on you, the derma rolling is not intended for absorption purposes, although it will probably will help in the absl toon process. What we're trying to achieve here is neogenesis. Anyways, good luck with your regimen. I also think you're adding a lot of RU a day, and seeing it as it is expensive I take it you make pretty good money.l, you lucky bastard.

DesperateOne
09-05-2013, 10:36 PM
I am staying away from several threads that are thoroughly infested with fools who desperately need someone to slap some sense into them. If you follow those threads, you will easily find that the most aggressive members are the biggest fools. I no longer have any patience for them. I will call them fools and idiots because those words very accurately describe those people. If I get banned for doing so, so be it. I simply don't care anymore.

This thread however is about a treatment that I feel might have some merit. I am disappointed that there are not enough people trying to duplicate the results of the pilot study - but something is better than nothing. Anyways, these guys who expect to see results in a matter of weeks are not being realistic and obviously do not understand how hair cycles work. They also do not understand that there is a difference between "statistically significant" and "cosmetically significant". Results that may be "statistically significant" may happen within the time frame reported in the pilot study, but "cosmetically significant" results will take a lot longer.

You're right Tracy, sometimes I wonder if its even worth it comin here so often. I would follow the study to the T but I can't take this curse no more, I do feel like it will help me adding Cet on day 4-7 when the healing has almost ended. I just hope if this process works and we do get neogenesis, that it can be reproduced indefinitely and be compounded.

Chromeo
09-05-2013, 11:13 PM
Normally I would also tend to believe any changes would take at least 6 months to appear...however, this was a 12 week study and the results appear to be "cosmetically significant" in as little as 3 months.

Therefore, for those sticking to the method laid out in the study, it would not be entirely unrealistic to expect comparable results at a similar early stage. Otherwise it would have to suggest that the subjects of the test must have been exceptionally good responders, or that the results themselves are of questionable authenticity.

Let's hope for positive results amongst forum users.

chimera
09-05-2013, 11:51 PM
I really don't understand the pics from the study. Because in the study it's says that all participants were shaved so it could be easy to measure differences, but in the pics from the end of the study the hair is waaay longer than what hair can growth in just three months. So, are the pics fake, or those pics were not takes three months after, but maybe more months after (which would be good, as for those results I would gladly wait a whole year), but it is not clear.

Knockin on NW4
09-05-2013, 11:52 PM
Cetrizine will not grow hair. i wouldnt waste your time. most people report only increased shedding.

Chromeo
09-06-2013, 12:24 AM
I really don't understand the pics from the study. Because in the study it's says that all participants were shaved so it could be easy to measure differences, but in the pics from the end of the study the hair is waaay longer than what hair can growth in just three months. So, are the pics fake, or those pics were not takes three months after, but maybe more months after (which would be good, as for those results I would gladly wait a whole year), but it is not clear.

I agree, I feel the results are questionable. I remain optimistic, however.

clandestine
09-06-2013, 03:49 AM
Just wanted to throw it out there that I'm also trialing dermarolling with a 1.5mm roller after having seen the recent study reports, even if the claimed density results seemed literally unbelievable. I have to add that I'm not interested in replicating the study.

I would classify myself as somewhere between NW3 and NW4. I first started 1mg finasteride a little less than a decade ago and was on it almost 2 years. Looking back, I think it did wonders in regrowing from NW2 to NW1 over 16 months and then maintaining. I was feeling like my nipples were getting softer and bigger and was getting iffy about messing with my hormones so I dropped it. I then used minox for a year until I got a serious girlfriend and quit everything altogether. A few years back I got serious about it again for 6 months and tried daily RU and Dutasteride twice a week, both for the first time.

I ended up moving out of my home country for a while and it became difficult to obtain these kinds of products so I waited until I recently returned. So a few months ago, I decided to throw the kitchen sink at it in a last ditch attempt to miraculously recover to perhaps NW2 level? I was a good responder before so I'm hoping it's not too late and I can still reverse the damage that happened the last couple of years. I'm committing to a solid year of the following regimen to see if this is possible:



I use the 1.5mm dermaroller every 4-6 days (usually the day I buzz down with either no-guard or the lowest guard) until i get little specs of blood over the whole horseshoe area, which I then wash off and then immediately apply Polaris NR-10 16% minox. I use this minox twice daily, dermarolling or not.

The rest of my regimen: .5mg propecia every day, 60-70mg RU from Kane over whole horsehoe area three times a day (~200mg total daily), 2% nizoral 1-2 times a week. Start times:

RU since June 2013
Fin since mid July 2013, took 2mg first day, 1mg second day, .5mg since
Kirkland Minoxidil 5% foam June-July 2013
Polaris NR-10 16% Minoxidil since August 2013
Dermaroller since end July 2013
2% Nizoral since February 2013


I'll likely add CB in next once a good vehicle is found. I've actually ordered 2 pcs of the Iron Dragon version to see what they have to offer.

Sorry, I don't like taking, much less posting pics, and even much less looking at the situation too much as the less I think about it the better. I just try to integrate the regimen as seamlessly into the daily routine and move-on knowing that I'm already doing as much as possible :)

Should something miraculous happen, I'm sure I could find some pics showing the difference, which could then be endlessly scrutinized for legitimacy!

That is a seriously impressive regimen. I wish my body could handle all that.

Add CB, you might just cure hair loss.

KeepHoping
09-06-2013, 03:52 AM
I'm trying to follow the studies protocol Tracy... I can't be sure if I'm dermarolling correctly because I'm the one doing it but I'm doing it once a week and not starting the minoxidil until 24hrs afterward. I'm a diffuse thinner as well and took some baseline shots so if I see anything of cosmetic difference I will take after shots and try to post a comparison for you guys. I have been on fin for like 3 years now just fyi in case that skews the data. Wishing everyone the best of luck!

chimera
09-06-2013, 06:00 AM
No exactly clear in my opinion. The way it's phrased doesn't tell us if they were STILL on fin and minox when they started microneedling. Either way, it says they had no improvement prior to microneedling so it's not like it gave them much of an advantage, that's the key.

Well I don't know about minox, but about fin:

-Men on Finasteride or other anti-androgenic medications within past 6 months, any known systemic Illness were excluded-

DesperateOne
09-06-2013, 07:29 AM
Cetrizine will not grow hair. i wouldnt waste your time. most people report only increased shedding.

Where did you see this? I saw that people gained peach hair.

Chromeo
09-06-2013, 09:12 AM
Where did you see this? I saw that people gained peach hair.

It does indeed. I used it for almost a year.

brunobald
09-06-2013, 09:41 AM
http://clinicaltrials.gov/show/NCT01347957

Another possible stimulent?


Preclinical studies showed the Nitric Oxide (NO) gel significantly promoted hair follicle formation and growth in both rat and mouse models.

Tracy C
09-06-2013, 09:56 AM
Therefore, for those sticking to the method laid out in the study, it would not be entirely unrealistic to expect comparable results at a similar early stage. Otherwise it would have to suggest that the subjects of the test must have been exceptionally good responders, or that the results themselves are of questionable authenticity.

^ That is a great example of some of the reasons why a real full on study should be done. More study participants need to be included from a wide variety of locations, age groups and general health characteristics - and a full out study should be at least six months but preferably longer.

The reported results of the pilot study are pretty hard to believe - but the idea still has merit. The longer duration of six months minimum is far more realistic and believable.

Stevo1
09-06-2013, 11:14 AM
http://clinicaltrials.gov/show/NCT01347957

Another possible stimulent?
Brunobald,

1) Hence, Doctor Proctor was always way ahead of his time as he has used NO in his products for over 22 years, which is how long I have been a patient. In addition, he was always big on the inflamation angle way back when and includes many ingreditents in Proxiphen to combat this.

2) I have always used a derma-rolloer (1.5mm) on & off for product penetration, BUT have started to adhere to the study for almost 3 weeks. Hence, pressing harder (for redness, not bleeding) once a week (now 2 times total). In addition, I roll back and forth more times. RESULTS, believe it or not my hair is getting stronger and seems to be anchored more. Hence, when I do the "PULL TEST" less comes out.

3) More importantly, today I started scratching my scalp and a ton of little flakes came off. HENCE....maybe the healing/natural growth factor process as begun?

4) My Anagen Growth Factors should arrive today and will apply AFTER dermarolling tonight.

5) Also, my pre-mixed CB-03-01 was shipped.

Respectfully,

Stevo1

vanityhair
09-06-2013, 11:28 AM
http://clinicaltrials.gov/show/NCT01347957

Another possible stimulent?


Interesting. It says it should have been completed in August - do you know if they have published their results yet?

DesperateOne
09-06-2013, 11:37 AM
It does indeed. I used it for almost a year.

So you got some results with Cet? how long did it take, or have you stopped using it?

VictimOfDHT
09-06-2013, 04:13 PM
Has any one bought derma rollers on ebay? Which ones? I can't buy from amazon (Canada) because just like everything about this rip-off country of Canada, amazon (Canada) is charging triple for the same rollers on US amazon and I don't think the US one sells to Canadians.

Chromeo
09-06-2013, 04:40 PM
So you got some results with Cet? how long did it take, or have you stopped using it?

You should see the small hairs beginning to sprout very early on into your Cet regime. I noticed plenty popping up along my hairline, very encouraging. I stopped using it 5 weeks ago to copy the microneedling study. Thinking of getting back on it as it's the only thing I've used up til now that has put hair on my head.

Knockin on NW4
09-06-2013, 07:34 PM
Where did you see this? I saw that people gained peach hair.

if i had a dollar for every post that claimed peach fuzz growth...;)

Stevo1
09-07-2013, 08:25 AM
Interesting today...


I have always used a derma-rolloer (1.5mm) on & off for product penetration, BUT have started to adhere to the study for almost 3 weeks. Hence, pressing harder (for redness, not bleeding) once a week (now 2 times total). In addition, I roll back and forth more times. RESULTS, believe it or not my hair is getting stronger and seems to be anchored more. Hence, when I do the "PULL TEST" less or zero comes out now.

MORE IMPORTANTLY, today I started scratching my scalp and a ton of little flakes came off. HENCE....maybe the healing/natural growth factor process as begun...which would co-incide with intentions of study?

chimera
09-07-2013, 03:31 PM
MORE IMPORTANTLY, today I started scratching my scalp and a ton of little flakes came off. HENCE....maybe the healing/natural growth factor process as begun...which would co-incide with intentions of study?

Never had flakes off due to the dermaroller before?. Another user doing deep dermaroller who says it's working for him has mentioned heavy flanking too.

DesperateOne
09-07-2013, 03:39 PM
Never had flakes off due to the dermaroller before?. Another user doing deep dermaroller who says it's working for him has mentioned heavy flanking too.

I also have lots of flakes, a lot. At first I thought it was because of the minox getting stuck or something. But then I Remembered that this didnt happen before the roller. I just did my 7 session about 30 minutes ago, went as harsh as I could, but now I am thinking about getting a 2mm and some numbing gel. I didn't get any blood out, but it did hurt like hell. I guess al the flakes is the dead skin cells?

Stevo1
09-07-2013, 03:46 PM
I also have lots of flakes, a lot. At first I thought it was because of the minox getting stuck or something. But then I Remembered that this didnt happen before the roller. I just did my 7 session about 30 minutes ago, went as harsh as I could, but now I am thinking about getting a 2mm and some numbing gel. I didn't get any blood out, but it did hurt like hell. I guess al the flakes is the dead skin cells?
DesperateOne,

Cool...so you experienced what I did on earlier post.

Like I said in my earlier post, I have used derma-roller before for penetration, but never had flaking.

Now 3 weeks into deeper rolling like study I am getting flakes from dead skin.

Hopefully, this is a good sign and shows the difference of going harder/more rolls per session, unlike when I used for just penetration.

Respectfully,

Stevo1

Chromeo
09-07-2013, 06:43 PM
if i had a dollar for every post that claimed peach fuzz growth...;)

Did you actually look at the pictures of growth from the users on the German forum? Quite clear to see if you ask me.

Yes, I have experienced flaking from dermarolling. If you're not experiencing flaking, I'd have to think you are not doing it properly. You need to damage that skin, otherwise you are just wasting your time. Damaged skin discards.

DesperateOne
09-07-2013, 06:55 PM
Did you actually look at the pictures of growth from the users on the German forum? Quite clear to see if you ask me.

Yes, I have experienced flaking from dermarolling. If you're not experiencing flaking, I'd have to think you are not doing it properly. You need to damage that skin, otherwise you are just wasting your time. Damaged skin discards.


I just go my CET today, how many times did you apply it? Did you follow the protocol the Germans put? Dissolve in water and and remove the sluge? And what ratio, I plan to blend it in lipogaine since it already has some good vehicles.

doke
09-08-2013, 03:14 AM
Haha, I was just messing with you, nothing serious.

no worries desperate im ok with it haha im using miconazole nitrate with roller with some minox and also american crew recovery shampoo and foam as its got some natural anti dht in it and its one of the easyist to apply after shampoo treatments and not that expensive.:)

Chromeo
09-08-2013, 04:49 AM
I just go my CET today, how many times did you apply it? Did you follow the protocol the Germans put? Dissolve in water and and remove the sluge? And what ratio, I plan to blend it in lipogaine since it already has some good vehicles.

Yep, I used 60 tabs in 60ml of water. I put the tabs in an old minox container & filled it with water, left it for a day to dissolve. Some were removing the filler but I just let it settle at the bottom & drew solution off the top with the dropper.

baldee
09-08-2013, 05:03 AM
4 weeks of dermarolling. No new hair sprouting. Not even peach fuzz. Then again nothing works for me.

Dermarolling is painful... but not as painful as loosing your hair.

Chromeo
09-08-2013, 06:25 AM
4 weeks of dermarolling. No new hair sprouting. Not even peach fuzz. Then again nothing works for me.

Dermarolling is painful... but not as painful as loosing your hair.

How are you measuring it, are you taking macro photographs or just looking in the mirror? Also, how long is your hair (if you have any) and which length needles are you using? You sound like quite an unfortunate case.

You're damn right it's painful...but I'm actually looking forward to my 6th week of rolling tonight. Not looking forward to the pain, of course...but eager to make more progress. Good luck guys and gals.

the_dude78
09-08-2013, 10:03 AM
4 weeks of dermarolling. No new hair sprouting. Not even peach fuzz. Then again nothing works for me.

Dermarolling is painful... but not as painful as loosing your hair.


It's too early to say anything after only 4 weeks.

From the study:
"Initiation of new hair growth was noticeable by around 6 weeks"

This doesn't necessarily mean that everybody will see new hair growth after only 6 weeks. And also "initiation of new hair growth", I'm guessing you'd have to look very carefully before you see anything at all after just 6 weeks.

People need to give this time and not lose hope just because nothing happens after a month. It takes time to grow hair!

DesperateOne
09-08-2013, 10:41 AM
It's too early to say anything after only 4 weeks.

From the study:
"Initiation of new hair growth was noticeable by around 6 weeks"

This doesn't necessarily mean that everybody will see new hair growth after only 6 weeks. And also "initiation of new hair growth", I'm guessing you'd have to look very carefully before you see anything at all after just 6 weeks.

People need to give this time and not lose hope just because nothing happens after a month. It takes time to grow hair!

I think you're forgetting the fact that people are desperate, as well they should be. This damn curse ruins lifes, such a stupid desease really, you lose hair in a pattern like form wow.

I think we should see results pretty soon because its about wounding and it should grow relatively quick once the wound is healed.

Hal0
09-08-2013, 11:08 AM
Hi,

I will add Lithioderm 8 % (http://www.labcatal.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=75:lithioderm-8-gel-ac&catid=2:gamme-dermatologie&Itemid=13) to my regimen.

But i need your opinion :

Should I apply this gel every morning / evening (like the instruction for use say )

or

Apply this before (or after) my dermarolling session?




PS: Sorry for my bad grammar =)

the_dude78
09-08-2013, 11:47 AM
I think you're forgetting the fact that people are desperate, as well they should be. This damn curse ruins lifes, such a stupid desease really, you lose hair in a pattern like form wow.

I think we should see results pretty soon because its about wounding and it should grow relatively quick once the wound is healed.

I'm not forgetting that people are desperate. It's very obvious. :) But still, try to have patience, there is no reason why we should see results earlier than the 6 weeks if we are, more or less, following the same steps as in the study. It just seems like people are getting really disappointed when nothing has happened after a few weeks, just do your rolling and don't think too much about it for the next 6-12 weeks. Easier said than done, I know, and we all really, really want this to work, but it'll save you from a lot of negative thoughts and stress if you can stop looking for new hairs every time you look in the mirror ;)

hellouser
09-08-2013, 12:04 PM
Hi,

I will add Lithioderm 8 % (http://www.labcatal.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=75:lithioderm-8-gel-ac&catid=2:gamme-dermatologie&Itemid=13) to my regimen.

But i need your opinion :

Should I apply this gel every morning / evening (like the instruction for use say )

or

Apply this before (or after) my dermarolling session?




PS: Sorry for my bad grammar =)

If youre going to try to add lithium, I highly recommend you look into and read in full Follica's patent and their method of application for wounding + regrowth. Essentially, they spilled the beans. Lithium has been tried years ago with dermarolling but it failed. I'd advise against using it without first read this:

http://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showpost.php?p=145781&postcount=61

It should be added, but whats needed is knowledge of when and how its applied.

thinningTooSoon
09-08-2013, 02:04 PM
Had my 2nd session tonight, seemed to be much easier than the 1st, so don't be put off if you found it painful 1st time round people :)

TO YOUNG TO RETIRE
09-08-2013, 02:09 PM
guys anybody else saw regrowth ? there is a guy on *** similar forum posted some good regrowth pics..

i really dont want to go sleep again knowing we dont see regrowth,,,

wish we get it..

goodnight.......

DesperateOne
09-08-2013, 03:33 PM
guys anybody else saw regrowth ? there is a guy on *** similar forum posted some good regrowth pics..

i really dont want to go sleep again knowing we dont see regrowth,,,

wish we get it..

goodnight.......

Squeegee is getting some regrowth on ***. We also found that we can induce gfg-9 by applying sperm to it, since it has pge2 and that in turn induces gfg-9. Once I grow my hair back, I will have to charge woman to jizz on their head :D

hellouser
09-08-2013, 07:25 PM
Squeegee is getting some regrowth on ***. We also found that we can induce gfg-9 by applying sperm to it, since it has pge2 and that in turn induces gfg-9. Once I grow my hair back, I will have to charge woman to jizz on their head :D

I keep seeing comments about guys using their sperm as a topical.... I dont know anymore if this is a joke anymore or not. I just did a quick search in Google for 'FGF-9 sperm' and there are results popping up for the two... which begs the question:

Is anyone REALLY masturbating and applying their sperm as a topical solution in some kind of vehicle?

DesperateOne
09-08-2013, 07:29 PM
I keep seeing comments about guys using their sperm as a topical.... I dont know anymore if this is a joke anymore or not. I just did a quick search in Google for 'FGF-9 sperm' and there are results popping up for the two... which begs the question:

Is anyone REALLY masturbating and applying their sperm as a topical solution in some kind of vehicle?


Yes it's true, there is medical journals that suggest this. I tried it today for the first time, I mixed it with lipogaine so it can reach the follicle. To tell you the truth, I don't really care anymore, if it takes this and a 3mm, then so be it.

hellouser
09-08-2013, 07:49 PM
Yes it's true, there is medical journals that suggest this. I tried it today for the first time, I mixed it with lipogaine so it can reach the follicle. To tell you the truth, I don't really care anymore, if it takes this and a 3mm, then so be it.

I'm not grossed out by my own baby batter (its mine, why would I be?), so I'd have no problem with it either, but the whole concept sounds so...... uh... well, you know.

However, FGF-9 has a molecular weight of 23,000 dalton. Human skin only allowes about 500 dalton to pass through. Microneedling is supposed to allow up to around 10,000;

http://dermapen.com/micro-needling-drug-delivery/

If you guys really are doing it, then even dermarolling won't help. You'd need to basically strip away skin substantially, a large and wide wound would have to be there in order for FGF-9 to work its magic. Dermabrasion could be it. Another member posted a biopsy punch device on eBay as well, that could work.

DesperateOne
09-08-2013, 08:00 PM
I'm not grossed out by my own baby batter (its mine, why would I be?), so I'd have no problem with it either, but the whole concept sounds so...... uh... well, you know.

However, FGF-9 has a molecular weight of 23,000 dalton. Human skin only allowes about 500 dalton to pass through. Microneedling is supposed to allow up to around 10,000;

http://dermapen.com/micro-needling-drug-delivery/

If you guys really are doing it, then even dermarolling won't help. You'd need to basically strip away skin substantially, a large and wide wound would have to be there in order for FGF-9 to work its magic. Dermabrasion could be it. Another member posted a biopsy punch device on eBay as well, that could work.

Well we have already agreed that we need a 2.5mm or a 3.0mm and do it very aggressively, do you honk that would be deep enough? Also, would you think that we should apply it minutes after that mutilation, or wait a few hours when the growth factors made their way to the wound.

The journals don't say that sperm has gfg-9, but that it induces it, maybe it can go deep enough and then induce the gfg-9. Would you say applying it with lipogaine is a bad idea? I mean it could kill some stuff needed to work its magic, would you say not?

Thinning87
09-08-2013, 08:08 PM
Well we have already agreed that we need a 2.5mm or a 3.0mm and do it very aggressively, do you honk that would be deep enough? Also, would you think that we should apply it minutes after that mutilation, or wait a few hours when the growth factors made their way to the wound.

The journals don't say that sperm has gfg-9, but that it induces it, maybe it can go deep enough and then induce the gfg-9. Would you say applying it with lipogaine is a bad idea? I mean it could kill some stuff needed to work its magic, would you say not?

It's FGF9 dude not GFG9

Koga
09-08-2013, 08:15 PM
Seriously.. Are guys really rubbing semen on their heads to grow hair?? No wonder hair keeps sprouting on my gf's face...lol :p

DesperateOne
09-08-2013, 08:19 PM
It's FGF9 dude not GFG9

Thanks, usually type on my phone, so I tend to dismiss things

fred970
09-08-2013, 08:20 PM
I reported this thread, this is going too far. Are you really suggesting people to butcher their scalp and then put sperm on it?

I have a feeling this is going to end up like cetirizine.

hellouser
09-08-2013, 08:32 PM
Well we have already agreed that we need a 2.5mm or a 3.0mm and do it very aggressively, do you honk that would be deep enough? Also, would you think that we should apply it minutes after that mutilation, or wait a few hours when the growth factors made their way to the wound.

The journals don't say that sperm has gfg-9, but that it induces it, maybe it can go deep enough and then induce the gfg-9. Would you say applying it with lipogaine is a bad idea? I mean it could kill some stuff needed to work its magic, would you say not?

I really don't know, if ejaculated sperm doesn't contain FGF-9 then I wouldn't bother. I only saw bits of info where FGF-9 was induced when sperm was developed.

Before any of you are doing anything with your own scalp and semen, you'd need to find out what the exact properties of it; does it contain FGF-9 or not and what else that may pose any potential risks. Though, to be realistic, many women and gay men swallow it during sex without any side effects, that should give us a hint as to its safety and thats taking in someone elses fluids. Its pretty much impossible to infect yourself so the chances of anything happen with your own are even slimmer than someone else taking yours.

Interesting ideas seeing how the makeup of semen could have benefits, I mean, that is half of the very beginnings of the human form. I think we're veering off course though from this thread's purpose. Further talk should be taken to a new thread.